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I also think that the fact that 'reasonable doubt' is so hard to quantitatively define makes it hard on jurors. Where do you draw the line between 'reasonable' and 'speculative'?
The DA should have adjusted the charges according to the evidence that MOST LIKELY was going to assure a conviction. They took a huge gamble, and unfortunately lost. I find it completely plausible that ICA was neglecting Caylee, found her floating in the pool and took measures to cover it up and was relieved that she was no longer saddled with the responsibility of motherhood. Mother Nature, time and pathology created the perfect storm and now she gets off. Personally, I believe the duct tape doesn't prove anything in particular. It's an oddity, but just one of many things that doesn't add up in this whole sordid affair. People aren't (or at least shouldn't be) put to death because they are morally bankrupt and despicable. There is still the burden of proof that has to be met. If they could go back and revise the charges, I believe they would.
yes...no charge was given that they could useI think the jurors believed it was an accident but I am confused then on why they couldn't charge her with a crime for covering it up all this time.
Is it because there wasn't that charge for them to pick from? And what exactly would the charge be for that?
I don't agree with the verdict - she should have gotten aggravated child abuse. However the things that I think helped the defense cast reasonable doubt:
1. River Cruz and "an accident that snowballed out of control"
2. Friends and Family stating she was a "good mother".
3. The grief expert - "there is no normal way to grieve".
4. Anthony's pet burial ritual - bags and duct tape - to show duct tape was not murder weapon.
5. Kronk - I have always been uncomfy with the kronk issue.
6. George's suicide letter - showing guilt? Did HHJP give the DT the idea?
7. JB's opening statement - it really kind of made you think "Hmmm.." even though there was no evidence to support it.
8. Cashback computer report - 84 myspace searches not chloroform
9. Ricardo Morales myspace picture "win her over with chloroform".
10. Forensic guy who testified in favour of DT re: flies in trunk.
11. JB dragging this case out for weeks and twisting facts around.
12. JB's smoozing with the jury every am and acting like he was being picked on by big bully JA.
13. Keeping ICA off of the witness stand.
14. "so what - she is a *advertiser censored* and a liar - not a murderer per JB.
These are the things that gave me an uneasy feeling.
There's no way physically that the jury did all they were supposed to do to even get to the spot where they all agreed about no reasonable doubt. If the alternate can speak for most, then they didn't believe George, believed that cruz woman, yet didn't think Casey harmed her child! IMO, not getting in the thefts, Cindy thinking of taking custody, and not trying to prove that she did not plan to take Caylee anywhere that evening was the big mistake. I also blame the media and people like the Grunds, Padilla, and a few others who started this family dysfunction nonsense. They are still at it, too. It doesn't matter how dysfunctional a group is, each adult is responsible for his own actions. The jury believed the dysfunction is the cause of Casey not reporting an accident and totally discounted actual forensic evidence. Someone on FB said that it's as if the jurors believe the world is flat. It's true. New cutting edge evidence and research to prove crime yet some don't even try to make an effort in understanding. No real professionals on the jury either, some with only 11th grade education and criminal charges in their past. Big mistake.
1. Not believing that the duct tape covered the mouth. With all the talk of animals and water degrading things and moving bones around, and the fact that I do believe Roy Kronk (not maliciously) interacted the bones, I consider it a reasonable doubt that there was some other explanation. One reasonable possibility I would consider is that whoever disposed of the body was trying to prevent fluids from leaking, or bugs from crawling into the mouth AFTER the child was dead.
2. At least some of the testimony from GA and CA was put into doubt. CA provably lied about the searches at that time of day. She was at work. GA I believe lied about the extent of his involvement with River Cruz. At the very least, he was pretty darn combative on the stand.
3. I found JB's argument that chloroform was looked up after seeing TL's graphic about it on FB was a reasonable doubt. He did apparently have an image on it on his page. The search was apparently done after this. One report said 84 hits, one said 1. The discrepancy, combined with the explanation, creates a reasonable doubt.
4. The story of burying pets did actually introduce a reasonable doubt. Someone tried to bury the child in the yard, but realized that was unreasonable, so disposed of it near the house. I think originally the body WAS buried, as well as the person (and I think it was Casey) could manage. But with all the animals and especially the water I think it would've 'bubbled up'.
An alternate reasonable scenario could be this: the child drowned. Casey, who obviously has poor coping skills and is immature in general, freaked out. She fell back to lying, because she was scared. She was in denial and freaked out and partied to try to forget it -- some people turn to drugs to drown things out, some to alcohol, she turned to partying. The body was in the car, and started to smell. She gave it the best burial she could in the swamp. Things DID spiral out of control for her. She had poor coping skills and just dealt with it totally and utterly wrong, Truth and Casey are just not acquainted with her. I doubt it even occurred to her to tell the truth! I don't think George told her "you will go to jail for the rest of your life" but she might have truly believed that.
Now, that said, I don't think that's what happened. I think she had a hand in the death. I just don't see how it was proved, because there's what I consider to be a reasonable alternative scenario above. Do I believe it? No, not really, but I'll allow it could have happened like that. She is immature enough, a pathological liar enough, sociopathic enough, and just plain batshit crazy enough to make me believe she could do utterly unbelievable things.
If I was on that jury, I would be dying to charge her with improperly disposing a body. Because I think the body was in the car. And though I think she probably had a hand in why there was a body, I think it's possible she didn't, under a reasonable (and not just out-and-out crazy) scenario.
And the people that believe that Caylee drowned really have to stop and ask themselves why they believe that. There is no evidence. IMO i think thats what people want to believe and human psyche is amazing.
I cornered a friend of mine who believes this and guess what it boiled down to: She didnt look like a murderer! Thats right folks. She seemed like she loved her kid by just watching video clips and photos. ICA looked nice and was attractive. Oh and he said its hard for a mom to kill her kid. I just walked away...He wanted to believe she drowned cause the opposite was too much for his mind to process. I think alot of people dont wanna believe she murdered her child even in the face of evidence and everything. Unbelieveable!
Someone please explain to me how Child Neglect that resulted in Death is not Child Abuse??? Please?????????????????
my comments below your questionsI don't agree with the verdict - she should have gotten aggravated child abuse. However the things that I think helped the defense cast reasonable doubt:
1. River Cruz and "an accident that snowballed out of control"
The fight the 15th- caylee ended up dead, CASEY was not supposed to leave the car.
2. Friends and Family stating she was a "good mother".
3. The grief expert - "there is no normal way to grieve".
4. Anthony's pet burial ritual - bags and duct tape - to show duct tape was not murder weapon.
or a sick family ritual JB profferedfor teh state, GA taking a 4 yr to have it put down... and not again til high school? guess she needed a to be reminded
5. Kronk - I have always been uncomfy with the kronk issue.
6. George's suicide letter - showing guilt? Did HHJP give the DT the idea?
what granparent commits suicide because a grandchild dies when they have there own children living? $$ was drying up ! it had beenan month since Caylee was found! EXCACTLY 14 days before Christmas
7. JB's opening statement - it really kind of made you think "Hmmm.." even though there was no evidence to support it.
Except a dead child decomposing int the woods?:waitasec:
8. Cashback computer report - 84 myspace searches not chloroform
9. Ricardo Morales myspace picture "win her over with chloroform".
10. Forensic guy who testified in favour of DT re: flies in trunk.
and Chloroform which is a pesticide
11. JB dragging this case out for weeks and twisting facts around.
12. JB's smoozing with the jury every am and acting like he was being picked on by big bully JA.
13. Keeping ICA off of the witness stand.
14. "so what - she is a *advertiser censored* and a liar - not a murderer per JB.
These are the things that gave me an uneasy feeling.
Someone please explain to me how Child Neglect that resulted in Death is not Child Abuse??? Please?????????????????
Someone please explain to me how Child Neglect that resulted in Death is not Child Abuse??? Please?????????????????
And the people that believe that Caylee drowned really have to stop and ask themselves why they believe that. There is no evidence. IMO i think thats what people want to believe and human psyche is amazing.
Someone please explain to me how Child Neglect that resulted in Death is not Child Abuse??? Please?????????????????