GUILTY GA - Lauren Giddings, 27, Macon, 26 June 2011 # 7

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Quick observation.
If the murder and dismemberment took place in lgs apt. Wouldn't someone notice the perplexing going in and out? This act would have taken hours on hours to clean. And the removal of body parts would have taken several trips in and out. Even in the dead of nite gave avenue has traffic and the macon. Pd and mecer. Pd drive by at least 2 or 3 times each nite.
The murder scene and the disposal of the torso by a resident of the apartments is possible but is it feasible? Even with the student s moving out, it is still a college apartment complex and college kids in macon like to party on any given nite.
Imo I think we should all step back and review just the facts we know. Not the media pictures. Or reporters word, but the facts.
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapperfor the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )


So lets try to start from the beginning and bit by bit piece it all together with only what the facts are, not what some told us but what we know for sure. I feel the same as bessie. I don't care who did it I just want them to face justice for the actions that were committed.

I like this idea a lot! I've copied the list from your quote and pasted it into my post. Now I'll add a few items.

Macontime's original list:
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapper for the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )

Bessie's additions:

11. On Thursday, June 30th, McD told a reporter on camera was home all night on Wednesday, June 29th, the night prior to the discovery of LG's remains, and had been home most of the week studying for the bar exam. He also stated, “I hadn’t seen anyone or heard anything,” he said. “I don’t know anyone who would want to hurt her.”

12. McD was arrested and charged with burglary on July 1, 2011. He is alleged to have entered two apartments in BH complex without permission stealing a condom from each one. Both crimes are said to have occurred during the last week of December, 2008 and the first week of January, 2009.

13. On August 2, 2011, Stephen McDaniel was charged with the murder of Lauren Giddings.

14. The arrest warrant states McD had in his possession "a master key that opened every door" in the complex; and

15. a key to LG's apartment.

16. McD has said previously that "he could commit murder and provided details to avoid detection which are similar to the facts and circumstances surrounding the killing of Lauren Giddings.

17. Lauren Gidding's cell phone and computer activity ceased at about 10:30 p.m. on Saturday, June 25, 2011. She was never heard from again.

Will anyone else add to the list?
 
Agree totally. And of the many articles, newscasts, etc., I've encountered, that ONE article is the only one I remember that didn't take some pains to state something about "same brand hacksaw", etc. I remember that the omission jumped out at me because of that.


I believe that is the kind of thing Macontime was referring to. Why he said stick to the facts. We all know how the media clips and splices, omitting as they see the WANT inevitably changing the whole theme!

Also dangling modifiers in their ads piss me off.
 
Since IMO the torso came out of the vacant apartment fridge, I don't think it was necessary to roll the trash can anywhere. He simply walked over to it and lifted the lid.

FWIW- I have a standard size front door. I think our 96 Gal. recycling bin (looks just like the trash can at BH) would def fit through the door with no problem.
I agree, Knox. The trash can was just 20' or so from the apartment door. Rolling the can up to the door would take more time, create noise, and possibly attract attention. So much easier and cleaner to walk over to the can.
 
Yes, especially for the body parts other than the torso. For those, I'm thinking a backpack that about 3/4 of law students use to lug books & laptop around.

Obviously, a backpack is not of adequate size to carry the torso in. Since the torso had to be transported only from LG's upstairs left apt (or apt #1, beneath LG's, which was the source of the fridge) to the trash bins along the left side of the building, I'm thinking the perpetrator could most securely manage the transfer by dropping the body out of the window.

In the pictures of Barrister's Hall, there is a striped awning on the left side of the building about in the right location to be a window in the living room of each apartment. From either upstairs or downstairs apartment, all the perpetrator would have to do is look out the door to see whether anyone is present and when the coast is clear, lift the window sash and drop the body into position immediately next to the trash bins. Then scamper out the door to the trash bin area, carrying a small plastic bag for cover, and move the torso from the ground to one of the bins. No big duffle bag or other covering required.

This method might also have been used to minimize the chance of discovery when moving the torso from LG's apt to Apt #1.

All this assumes that the windows of BH apartments are capable of being opened and that the opening is big enough to accommodate a 34" x 20" object. If the windows are capable of use for this purpose, it's obviously a less risky way to get the torso to a trash receptacle than any other method.

How about a black garbage bag....walk to dumpster, open lid, drop it in........nothing suspicious about that
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macontime
Quick observation.
If the murder and dismemberment took place in lgs apt. Wouldn't someone notice the perplexing going in and out? This act would have taken hours on hours to clean. And the removal of body parts would have taken several trips in and out. Even in the dead of nite gave avenue has traffic and the macon. Pd and mecer. Pd drive by at least 2 or 3 times each nite.
The murder scene and the disposal of the torso by a resident of the apartments is possible but is it feasible? Even with the student s moving out, it is still a college apartment complex and college kids in macon like to party on any given nite.
Imo I think we should all step back and review just the facts we know. Not the media pictures. Or reporters word, but the facts.
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapperfor the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )


So lets try to start from the beginning and bit by bit piece it all together with only what the facts are, not what some told us but what we know for sure. I feel the same as bessie. I don't care who did it I just want them to face justice for the actions that were committed.
I like this idea a lot! I've copied the list from your quote and pasted it into my post. Now I'll add a few items.

Macontime's original list:
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapper for the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )

Bessie's additions:

11. On Thursday, June 30th, McD told a reporter on camera was home all night on Wednesday, June 29th, the night prior to the discovery of LG's remains, and had been home most of the week studying for the bar exam. He also stated, “I hadn’t seen anyone or heard anything,” he said. “I don’t know anyone who would want to hurt her.”

12. McD was arrested and charged with burglary on July 1, 2011. He is alleged to have entered two apartments in BH complex without permission stealing a condom from each one. Both crimes are said to have occurred during the last week of December, 2008 and the first week of January, 2009.

13. On August 2, 2011, Stephen McDaniel was charged with the murder of Lauren Giddings.

14. The arrest warrant states McD had in his possession "a master key that opened every door" in the complex; and

15. a key to LG's apartment.

16. McD has said previously that "he could commit murder and provided details to avoid detection which are similar to the facts and circumstances surrounding the killing of Lauren Giddings", per the arrest warrant.

17. Lauren Gidding's cell phone and computer activity ceased at about 10:30 p.m. on Saturday, June 25, 2011. She was never heard from again.

Will anyone else add to the list?

Smooth's Additional details

18.) we know there was a Stanley hacksaw recovered from BH apts that's blade was found to test positive for Lauren Giddings DNA

19.) we know that Stephen McDaniels since having been incarcerated has now recovered a memory from middle of the night Thursday, June 23(less than 48 hrs prior to Lauren's last being heard from) of coming face to face with whom he states is the "real killer" that was on Lauren's balcony and told Stephen that he was about to cut what is now known to be imaginary grass.

20.) we know per Glenda McDaniel that LE searched Stephen's apt for anything that would have blue or gray fibers

21.) and according to Glenda her son has told her that DD, the "real killer" has blue and gray interior of his car..
 
This is kind of off topic,but-

I've been trying to understand why McD would put the torso in the rolling trash bin (to the left of the complex) instead of the large dumpster to the back of the complex. Seems like if the perp's plan was for the torso to go off undetected to the landfill, the better plan would be to put it in a dumpster, where it would be less likely to be noticed by the trashman than it would in a smaller rolling can. The dumpster would also provide more obscurity because of all the reeds and such near the dumpster. It's also not within eyesight from Georgia Ave. like the rolling can would have been.

Any ideas why the can vs. the dumpster?

YES, is there more on BB comment about throwing something away on June 29 that was wrapped in plastic but no odor detected?

Do we know if SHE was the one who threw the torso in trash
Do we know which apt she was cleaning?
Do we know WHY she would be cleaning apt 1 if tenant was still to return for things?
Do we know if it came out of fridge thus prompting LE to take fridge for DNA testing?
Do we know, if so, WHY McD was so surprised about the discovery of the torso if he had left it in fridge or apt to be discovered?
This could change things quite a bit.
I was under the assumption that he may have hurriedly gotten it to the trash quickly after friends left and everyone had searched the area for her. But if he wanted to frame someone or atleast have someone else under the eye of suspicion instead of himself, (right away anyway) then why trash it at all? Unless of course as we've all suggested, to get it to the dump quickly, but that would have been so coincidental to suddenly get the opportunity to discard it in the middle of the night before trash pickup which is only once a week.

Just some observations!
 
Okay, you've piqued my interest, Angel!

Since I'm guessing you can't address the things you know that were done that had "no practical purpose," would you feel comfortable addressing the psychology of one who would do such things?

What would you expect to find in the background of a person who committed such a crime?

IF more disturbing elements of this crime prove to have taken place...


I believe control is the central issue at play here.
To consume or engage sexually with the remains of your victim demonstrates an urge to fully control that person, likely resulting from a feeling of personal powerlessness. Let's imagine for a moment that Stephen was fixated on Lauren for a long time, living next to her, working along side her in the FedSoc at Mercer, but never truly able to engage with her on a personal or romantic level. Most likely he never voiced his feelings for her to her directly, but perhaps spoke frequently about her to his mother. He felt she was unattainable, she'd never return his feelings, he'd never HAVE her in life. Perhaps her life force itself was overwhelming to him, because deep down in his psyche, Stephen could be extremely controlling. No consenting partner, especially not an independent and driven young woman such as Lauren, would be suitable for him as he would require the utmost submission and autonomous control over another individual. This is often the case with killers who engage in these post-mortem acts of cannibalism and necrophilia. Only once their victim is dead can they truly actualize their fantasy.
For some killers, the act of defiling their victim's body is an extension of the sadistic acts and degradation they inflicted on their victims pre and peri-mortem, as in the case of Ted Bundy. For others, such as Jeffrey Dahmer, it is the main event. I imagine McDaniel falls into the latter category. He "attained" Lauren in killing her, and cemented his sense of ownership over her entire being [in his mind] by deconstructing her person-hood, literally and figuratively, after death. This is typical of lust murder, as the killer seeks to remove the humanity of his victim through mutilation and disfigurement. The dismemberment itself indicates rage, resentment, but more interestingly it indicates that the killer was threatened, intimidated by the victim. To strip the victim of her identity is to neutralize the threat and exercise ultimate control. It's very personal. When such acts are committed in stranger homicides, such as in the case of Jack The Ripper for instance, the victim is representative of something personally threatening to the killer. In this case, Lauren herself was somehow a threat to Stephen's psyche. IMO, the threat stemmed from the power he perceived her to have in life. If he was obsessed with her, in his mind she held an unacceptable amount of power over him, and in killing her and then destroying her body, he re-asserts his own control. He is aroused by that satisfaction derived from absolute control over someone formerly so out of reach, he can now do as he pleases.
Finally, if cannibalism indeed took place, it would be the penultimate act of control and possession of his victim.
IF it went down like that, I imagine he was high off his actions for several days. The extensive cleaning and obstruction was another way for him to get off on the control he continued to exert over his victim's fate. His downfall was ultimately that he was too greedy with her remains, too indulgent of his urges, to do what needed to be done. He literally waited until the last possible moment to discard the last bit, despite the overwhelming risk involved. Hopefully that means he did a poor job of cleaning up the evidence he left on her body, especially if he originally planned to dispose of them in such a way that they would never, ever be recovered prior to decomposition. If the bleach rumor turns out to be true, that was probably his hurried attempt at making sure he rid the body of evidence, and it probably wasn't as thorough a job as he would have liked. His nerves went into overdrive when he saw cops looking for her Wednesday, so he inserted himself into the search and investigation promptly to control, to whatever extent he could, the flow of information and get access to the facts on the ground. I wouldn't be surprised if those involved in the search, cops and civilians, could tell us in retrospect little things he tried to do to direct the search effort away from key areas.
Getting on camera to discuss Lauren's whereabouts was terribly revealing, and terribly bold. I'm sure he derived some satisfaction from that as well, still holding out the belief that he'd never be found out, linked forever to her memory however due to that interview. Imagine how satisfied he'd have been if he'd never been a POI and his face in that interview would come to represent that fateful day in Lauren's legacy...what a fast one he'd have pulled.
JMO
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macontime
Quick observation.
If the murder and dismemberment took place in lgs apt. Wouldn't someone notice the perplexing going in and out? This act would have taken hours on hours to clean. And the removal of body parts would have taken several trips in and out. Even in the dead of nite gave avenue has traffic and the macon. Pd and mecer. Pd drive by at least 2 or 3 times each nite.
The murder scene and the disposal of the torso by a resident of the apartments is possible but is it feasible? Even with the student s moving out, it is still a college apartment complex and college kids in macon like to party on any given nite.
Imo I think we should all step back and review just the facts we know. Not the media pictures. Or reporters word, but the facts.
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapperfor the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )


So lets try to start from the beginning and bit by bit piece it all together with only what the facts are, not what some told us but what we know for sure. I feel the same as bessie. I don't care who did it I just want them to face justice for the actions that were committed.
I like this idea a lot! I've copied the list from your quote and pasted it into my post. Now I'll add a few items.

Macontime's original list:
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw
4. A wrapper for the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )

Bessie's additions:

11. On Thursday, June 30th, McD told a reporter on camera was home all night on Wednesday, June 29th, the night prior to the discovery of LG's remains, and had been home most of the week studying for the bar exam. He also stated, “I hadn’t seen anyone or heard anything,” he said. “I don’t know anyone who would want to hurt her.”

12. McD was arrested and charged with burglary on July 1, 2011. He is alleged to have entered two apartments in BH complex without permission stealing a condom from each one. Both crimes are said to have occurred during the last week of December, 2008 and the first week of January, 2009.

13. On August 5, 2011, Stephen McDaniel was charged with the murder of Lauren Giddings.

14. The arrest warrant states McD had in his possession "a master key that opened every door" in the complex; and

15. a key to LG's apartment.

16. McD has said previously that "he could commit murder and provided details to avoid detection which are similar to the facts and circumstances surrounding the killing of Lauren Giddings.

17. Lauren Gidding's cell phone and computer activity ceased at about 10:30 p.m. on Saturday, June 25, 2011. She was never heard from again.

Will anyone else add to the list?

Smooth's Additional details

18.) we know there was a Stanley hacksaw recovered from BH apts that's blade was found to test positive for Lauren Giddings DNA

19.) we know that Stephen McDaniels since having been incarcerated has now recovered a memory from middle of the night Thursday, June 23(less than 48 hrs prior to Lauren's last being heard from) of coming face to face with whom he states is the "real killer" that was on Lauren's balcony and told Stephen that he was about to cut what is now known to be imaginary grass.

20.) we know per Glenda McDaniel that LE searched Stephen's apt for anything that would have blue or gray fibers

21.) and according to Glenda her son has told her that DD, the "real killer" has blue and gray interior of his car..


18) repeats one of the facts already given
19) we don't know any such thing, only that his mom has told something suggesting this
21) she didn't say anything about the car interior, only that she suspects blue or grey fibers may be found in the car
 
I am not trying to accomplish anything at all. As you,I post in order to have a logical intelligent conversation or at times a debate with other posters on this forum. A life a has been snuffed out, a young one that will never know the joy of starting her on family. I for one enjoy reading other ideas and possibilitie concerning this murder. I work in macon and lived in macon my entire life. This case really hits close to home. I have family in the pd, the fire dept and really close friends that live on right next to the apartment complex. I am in no way shape or form saying we should not discuss possibilities but I do feel we all need to retrace and re-establish the base of the case. Just so we will stop repeating the same things over and over again.
Ok, I obviously misunderstood what you were trying to say.
I've thought about this myself. In fact, I thought it would be cool to have a companion site for "case facts".
Something where users could create a 'fact' for a case, with supporting info (links, attachments, etc.),
and each fact would be 'scored' based on the type of supporting info, along with other user's 'affirming' it.
Users could 'challenge' a fact, etc, etc...
It could be really nice - but obviously would take a lot of time and effort to develop.

ETA: I think to track a list here, it would need to be in it's own thread - like the media links.
It won't take long before such a list will be larger than a single post will allow.
Not to mention, the constant quoting of this list will eat up pages quickly. :twocents:
 
Macontime's Original List
1. There was a horrible murder committed.
2.time of death is unknown.
3. LGS. DNA was on a hacksaw*
4. A wrapper for the same brand hacksaw was found in MCDS. APT.*
5. Mcd has been in lock since Approximately. 23 hours after the torso was found.
6. The other body parts have not been found, even after an extensive search of a two mile radius of the apartment complex.*
7. The torso Was found in a rolling trash bin.*
8.'A group. Of friends came over at midnight. To look for LG. Mcd assisted them.
9. A reporter went and got Mcd. For the infamous interview, he did not go to the reporter. (don't have link it is on news central.com )
10. No le is discussing the case not even with family members ( I know this because I ama family member of one of the few in the know on this investigation )

Bessie's additions:*

11. On Thursday, June 30th, McD told a reporter on camera was home all night on Wednesday, June 29th, the night prior to the discovery of LG's remains, and had been home most of the week studying for the bar exam. He also stated, “I hadn’t seen anyone or heard anything,” he said. “I don’t know anyone who would want to hurt her.”

12. McD was arrested and charged with burglary on July 1, 2011. He is alleged to have entered two apartments in BH complex without permission stealing a condom from each one. Both crimes are said to have occurred during the last week of December, 2008 and the first week of January, 2009.

13. On August 5, 2011, Stephen McDaniel was charged with the murder of Lauren Giddings.

14. The arrest warrant states McD had in his possession "a master key that opened every door" in the complex; and

15. a key to LG's apartment.

16. McD has said previously that "he could commit murder and provided details to avoid detection which are similar to the facts and circumstances surrounding the killing of Lauren Giddings.

17. Lauren Gidding's cell phone and computer activity ceased at about 10:30 p.m. on Saturday, June 25, 2011. She was never heard from again.

Will anyone else add to the list?

Smooth's Additional details

18.) we know there was a Stanley hacksaw recovered from BH apts that's blade was found to test positive for Lauren Giddings DNA

19.) we know that Stephen McDaniels since having been incarcerated has now recovered a memory from middle of the night Thursday, June 23(less than 48 hrs prior to Lauren's last being heard from) of coming face to face with whom he states is the "real killer" that was on Lauren's balcony and told Stephen that he was about to cut what is now known to be imaginary grass.

20.) we know per Glenda McDaniel that LE searched Stephen's apt for anything that would have blue or gray fibers

21.) and according to Glenda her son has told her that DD, the "real killer" has blue and gray interior of his car..

22.) We know that after graduation Lauren had gone back home to Maryland to be a bridesmaid in her sister Kaitlyn's wedding where she insisted on making 50 homemade cupcakes decorated as Kaitlyn's favorite flower the sunflower.

23.) Lauren returned to Macon on June 14 from being in Maryland for her sis wedding..*

24.) 11 short days later after having returned to Macon to study for the bar, Lauren was last seen at Saturday, June 25, 6:30pm on Zaxby's video of drive thru picking up an order
 
Continued list of things that are known for certain

25.) Lauren was set to be moved from BH apts in Macon to Atlanta by Thursday, June 30(sadly the very day that her torso was found near a ground floor apt in a trashbin)

26.) something that we now know that was not originally known is that the last communication ever sent from Lauren's laptop on June 25 @10:30pm was infact sent to her boyfriend, DV's email address.

27.) in speaking of bf, DV he was questioned very early on and not found to be a POI as he was actually in California at the time that Lauren went missing(June 25)

28.) another newly found fact is more of what Lauren was
Doing on that last day that she was seen.. We now know that she actually had gone to a local country club who he bf was a member of and was able to use his name to relax and enjoy that Saturday outside laying out and swimming in the pool there.. This is where Lauren was heading home from when she stopped for the 6:30 drive thru meal from Zaxby's(last known sighting) just a few blocks from her BH apt..
 
I agree, Knox. The trash can was just 20' or so from the apartment door. Rolling the can up to the door would take more time, create noise, and possibly attract attention. So much easier and cleaner to walk over to the can.


Absolutely. If the dismemberment was done in Lauren's apartment (which seems to be more likely than in any of the other apartments) the killer would have had to carry everything downstairs at some point anyway - the torso to apartment # 1 and the rest - who knows. I doubt that the torso would have been heavy enough to be unmanageable. Keep in mind that this was "move-out" time for almost all of the residents in this complex since the school year was over. It would not have been unusual for someone to be carrying large bags to the garbage. IMO, McD had lots of previous experience sneaking in and out of his neighbors' apartments and new how to do it so he wouldn't be noticed.
 
AA- D**n girl, you'regood! I hope you write a novel or true crime story one day. I'll buy!

I know that the chief debunked rumors a few weeks ago about a serial killer being on the loose but it occurs to me that if SM were not incarcerated, a serial killer in the making could still be on the loose....
 
18) repeats one of the facts already given
19) we don't know any such thing, only that his mom has told something suggesting this21) she didn't say anything about the car interior, only that she suspects blue or grey fibers may be found in the car


BBM - McD's attorney acknowledged being told about the MM after his arrest also, not just his mother. McD distinctly stated on the day of his infamous interview that he heard nothing, knew nothing, etc. He was adamant. Of course WE didn't actually HEAR McD tell his attorney or his mother anything, but they both have acknowledged being told. Until I hear otherwise, I'm ok with assuming that this is a fact.
 
BBM - McD's attorney acknowledged being told about the MM after his arrest also, not just his mother. McD distinctly stated on the day of his infamous interview that he heard nothing, knew nothing, etc. He was adamant. Of course WE didn't actually HEAR McD tell his attorney or his mother anything, but they both have acknowledged being told. Until I hear otherwise, I'm ok with assuming that this is a fact.

think it needs to be reworded somehow; we don't really know when he recovered it (if he did)
Something like "SM has said that he remembers..."
 
Ok, I obviously misunderstood what you were trying to say.
I've thought about this myself. In fact, I thought it would be cool to have a companion site for "case facts".
Something where users could create a 'fact' for a case, with supporting info (links, attachments, etc.),
and each fact would be 'scored' based on the type of supporting info, along with other user's 'affirming' it.
Users could 'challenge' a fact, etc, etc...
It could be really nice - but obviously would take a lot of time and effort to develop.

ETA: I think to track a list here, it would need to be in it's own thread - like the media links.
It won't take long before such a list will be larger than a single post will allow.
Not to mention, the constant quoting of this list will eat up pages quickly. :twocents:

Great idea, I think, but, like you said, a lot of work. Would need an editor to check accuracy (although of course we could all provide input) and keep things pretty straightforward, without a lot of embellishment
 
Regarding how the body was transported to the trash bin: I bet SM used a bag of some sort to transport the remains wrapped in plastic, that way just in case someone did run into him as he was going to the trash can or the Mercer dumpster, he wasn't so obviously disposing of human remains.
Any passersby wouldn't make much note of a guy carrying a bag. He may have even carried some kind of garbage with him to look even more believable? He would then empty the contents of the bag/container, the remains wrapped in plastic material.

On the other hand, why dump the torso OUT Of a large trash bag into the trash bin, why not just discard the whole bag with body in it into the can. Was he recycling the bag? I would not guess he would use something of value to haul the torso in. That WOULD look suspicious if seen, dumping something that big out of another bag into trash.......

Makes me wonder if BB DID throw it in the bin on the 29th, what brought that up in the article?

Of course, she would not have known what it was unless it was half wrapped or wouldn't have investigated if it didnt' have too much weight. If no fluids in it then would it have been lighter than the avg 50 lb or so torso? And by how much?

What would be the purpose of the bleaching of torso? Odor? Bug elimination? Dehydration? blood bleaching?
 
See, this is where "facts" become subjective to me.

Do we believe only the facts from LE? From the attorney/district attorney? From the mother? From other family members? From friends?

Do we believe it's a fact only if we see a video of the person saying it?

And finally, do we believe exactly what's reported by the media, which is where most of this originates?

Where do you draw the line with "facts"? I guess it's a personal thing.
 
On the other hand, why dump the torso OUT Of a large trash bag into the trash bin, why not just discard the whole bag with body in it into the can. Was he recycling the bag? I would not guess he would use something of value to haul the torso in. That WOULD look suspicious if seen, dumping something that big out of another bag into trash.......

Makes me wonder if BB DID throw it in the bin on the 29th, what brought that up in the article?

Of course, she would not have known what it was unless it was half wrapped or wouldn't have investigated if it didnt' have too much weight. If no fluids in it then would it have been lighter than the avg 50 lb or so torso? And by how much?

What would be the purpose of the bleaching of torso? Odor? Bug elimination? Dehydration? blood bleaching?

regarding what I bolded above: What we settled on when this was discussed before was that a poorly constructed sentence in the article left the impression that she might have -- but that what really was meant was that, while throwing something else in that trash bin on the day before the remains were found there, she didn't smell anything unusual (thus indicating the torso was not in the bin yet). If you go back and look at the article, think you'll see what I mean. I don't have the link right at hand, though
 
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