GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 5

[Eileen730]

It could have been early and the alarm not set yet. Or if Mr. D. went outside to run off the intruders at the dock, he would have unset the alarm. Also just jumped into my mind, if the alarm was set how did the neighbors go in to check on them or how did the LE get in? So, many questions. :banghead::banghead:

I thought they entered the garage
Le would just go on in.

 

[Canaille]

I have bolded what I think he could have done. I would do these things if it were me. Except approach them. I would not do that or threaten with the gun. But, sometimes I get so mad at the lack of respect shown by young people. jmo

They would definitely be confronted by a gun from our household. Not threatened, but definitely be made aware that they are in the wrong place.

I had to have my husband put up a no trespassing sign in our yard. We are one of about a dozen houses on a small pond and it always amazed me how some adult sized kids would drive into the neighborhood, park at the street and come into our yard to fish. I confronted one who got cocky with me when I told him he needed to leave. I can't stand people who have the attitude of "what's mine is mine and what's yours is mine". I told hubby to put up the sign before I get arrested for assault.

 

[Canaille]

BBM. I disagree with this statement. The young people I know respect their elders and learn from their elders.

I feel for sure there are some 'pants on the ground rapping druggies' that don't respect older citizens, but on the whole here are a LOT of nice kids out there.

I agree that there are a lot of nice kids out there. But, there are also lots of kids with an entitlement mentality. They think they have a right to do what they want, go where they want... including private property. They have absolutely NO boundaries.

 

[Eileen730]

Well for inheritance I don't think it's his children that would do this but ......The next generation
Maybe. His kids are what late 60 retirement age also. and their children would have children so...
Baffled I am!

 

[fred&edna]

1. He knew something and needed to be silenced. The decapitation was a message to others that may know something as well.

2. Was involved in a dispute with someone, the decap was to shock and throw LE off.

3. A secret out-of-wedlock child that was being cut off financially. The decap was part rage and part to torment the real kids that had "everything."

I lean towards something like Option 3 (with some variations of my own), OR...

The killer was a business associate of someone in the Dermond family and the murders were a botched extortion attempt.

 

[al66pine]

Personally I'm not inclined to see a long-held personal grudge against either one of the D's- say going back to 1994, time they still owned fast food bus. (in about 1994?) as a motive, but.... it's possible.

Dr. Anthony Garcia =
Thinking of one case like that ---in Nebraska, an intern or resident dr. At Creighton U. Med School, 2001, got bad reviews from a couple faculty members/supervisors, which resulted in his being fired, forced to leave the program.
He moved states away. Time passed.
A med school faculty home was invaded and household members killed, maybe a son and nanny.
Then 5+ yrs later, another faculty member and wife were killed.
Guy blamed his ruined med career on the reviews and held grudges against both. Was arrested in the past yr.
Found the last w's thread on this
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127507&highlight=creighton+university
Here's a news summary from July 2013
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...venge-killings-shot-stabbed-death-people.html


Looking at the D's- if it goes back to when they held FF bus, that's alooooooooooong time ago. a very oooooooooold grudge.

A disgruntled hamburger flipper, not likely imo.
Maybe a long term mgr who wanted to buy one of the stores.
A supplier?
A competitor?
A better "reasonable" grudge, but still not likely, imo.

Can anyone else recall cases w. old personal or business grudges held for 15 or 20 yrs, before the holder killed?

 

[Happyshoes]

Another question, probably off the mark. When Mr. D didn't show up on Sat to help the person he usually went to help (with therapy or whatever on Saturdays) came to the house to check on them, was the garage open? Was Mr. D just laying there? Aren't most SK's motive usually sexual in nature? 20 questions, sorry about that. I need to go do something else for a while, obviously. I also agree with those who say most young people have this entitlement attitude, just SOOOO different from when I was a kid.

 

[Cardinal47]

Another question, probably off the mark. When Mr. D didn't show up on Sat to help the person he usually went to help (with therapy or whatever on Saturdays) came to the house to check on them, was the garage open? Was Mr. D just laying there? Aren't most SK's motive usually sexual in nature? 20 questions, sorry about that. I need to go do something else for a while, obviously. I also agree with those who say most young people have this entitlement attitude, just SOOOO different from when I was a kid.

I hope I have this right. It wasn't the stroke victim friend of Mr. Dermonds that came to the house but rather a friend that was worried.

The friend called the sheriffs office to express his concern and met with a deputy at the Dermonds home.

They found a door unlocked and the deputy entered and searched the house ending in the garage and the terrible discovery of Mr. Dermond.

 

[fred&edna]

Gently teetering around this thought:

While we know of children and grandchildren, what if the victims had siblings or half-siblings?

 

[Rhyolite]

(snip)
And as far as money laundering ... there was a restaurant we went to near Emory back in the 80s. Italian. Awful. Awful. It was there for many years. It may still be there. Don't go over there any more.The only way it stayed in business, IMO, was channeling cash for some other enterprise.

(snip)

Back in about late 1983 my wife (then GF) and one evening we drove to a Japanese steakhouse for dinner. It was located in a northern suburban village outside Chicago. One of those towns with a disreputable past and present. The restaurant was in a lone location, set high, apparently with a cellar. Parking lot pretty full of cars. We had our dinner, and noticed we were only ones having dinner. Quiet, no apparent activity in the bar. The Japanese waitress arrives with our check and asks "do you have a GAMING COUPON?" What???. We leave, see the parking lot still very full.

 

[charminglane]

It would be interesting to know whether the killer cut medically, severing the spine between the 2nd and 3rd vertebrae for ease of movement.
That would help LE in the right direction.

 

[fred&edna]

It would be interesting to know whether the killer cut medically, severing the spine between the 2nd and 3rd vertebrae for ease of movement.
That would help LE in the right direction.

Dare I ask what happens if the spine isn't severed between 2 and 3?? :scared:

 

[wildebeest]

Personally I'm not inclined to see a long-held personal grudge against either one of the D's- say going back to 1994, time they still owned fast food bus. (in about 1994?) as a motive, but.... it's possible.

Dr. Anthony Garcia =
Thinking of one case like that ---in Nebraska, an intern or resident dr. At Creighton U. Med School, 2001, got bad reviews from a couple faculty members/supervisors, which resulted in his being fired, forced to leave the program.
He moved states away. Time passed.
A med school faculty home was invaded and household members killed, maybe a son and nanny.
Then 5+ yrs later, another faculty member and wife were killed.
Guy blamed his ruined med career on the reviews and held grudges against both. Was arrested in the past yr.
Found the last w's thread on this
http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127507&highlight=creighton+university
Here's a news summary from July 2013
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...venge-killings-shot-stabbed-death-people.html


Looking at the D's- if it goes back to when they held FF bus, that's alooooooooooong time ago. a very oooooooooold grudge.

A disgruntled hamburger flipper, not likely imo.
Maybe a long term mgr who wanted to buy one of the stores.
A supplier?
A competitor?
A better "reasonable" grudge, but still not likely, imo.

Can anyone else recall cases w. old personal or business grudges held for 15 or 20 yrs, before the holder killed?

Thank you for these links to these murders for revenge. This is a possibility. I think there had to be a reason someone wanted the Dermonds dead. I just can't imagine it was a random event! These two people in their late eighties would seem to have virtually no enemies.

I hope the new week will bring some news that an apprehension is close. :twocents:

IMHO

 

[mck16]

I thought they entered the garage
Le would just go on in.

Oh, okay. I thought I read they went through the front door to the garage. If LE just went in and the alarm was set the alarm would go off. Not that it would matter just create a commotion. jmo

 

[Eileen730]

I keep going back to the fact that nothing was taken -- no money, no property, no medication, no nothing. So, how exactly would murdering the Dermonds be of benefit to someone? What does removing the Dermonds open the door to? The only things that I can think of are (1) inheritance, (2) business opportunity, (3) perceived relief from pent-up pain or anger.

This is not a thrill kill to me. It was not rushed. Time and care were taken to leave the house in order and to remove Mrs. D's body and Mr.D's head from the scene.

What was the benefit? It seems that immediate access to money wasn't needed, or valuables would be missing. Immediate access to drugs wasn't needed. Immediate access to a car wasn't needed. Whatever the benefit, it wasn't immediate to the killer(s).

IMO.

Oh, okay. I thought I read they went through the front door to the garage. If LE just went in and the alarm was set the alarm would go off. Not that it would matter just create a commotion. jmo

lol I don't really know how they got in. All I remember was they found Mr. D in the garage ...

But I guess that shoots my theory out of the equation.

Back to the drawing board.

 

[Bethanthony]

If I'm not mistaken, there are probably 2 Trusts. One in her name and one in his.
That way they keep the assets divided and inheritance tax less? Not sure about this.

I actually think it's just one, depending really on state laws. It would typically be an A/B Trust to avoid the federal inheritance tax rates. The A/B refers to the ownership, with A and B being a married couple. Without establishing this kind of trust, a married couple would pay inheritance tax on anything over around a million that passes from one to the other in death. The amount in a trust that can be passed tax free between spouses is around $5 million before it is then subject to the federal inheritance tax rates.

So, essentially, if RD left everything to his children, anything over $1 million would be subject to the federal inheritance tax. But, by establishing a trust like this that goes thru both spouses (regardless if they die together or at separate times) and then filters down to another party, that tax free amount rises to around the $5 million mark.

That's not chump change, if you consider what the inheritance tax rate is!

 

[mck16]

lol I don't really know how they got in. All I remember was they found Mr. D in the garage ...

But I guess that shoots my theory out of the equation.

Back to the drawing board.

I have read 3 different versions as to who found him, how they found him, and when. There have actually been very little facts released in this case leaving much to the imagination and hypothetical guesses. jmo

 

[Eileen730]

Was this an execution maybe?
Why wait till the mans 89 tho?

 

[Rhyolite]

Elphaba

 

[mck16]

Locals or anyone. Is there anything going on there at the house or has there been any funeral arrangements announced? Is the house just sitting there or has the family moved anything out etc. This is just so sad and I can't imagine the scene of pure terror they had to of experienced. OMG