GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 6

[gngr~snap]

That is a very well written article gngr~snap. Thank you. I don't think I had read it before. The timeline is straight and it just brings back to light what a strange case this is for everyone!

He sure said bullet early for a man with no head.
moo

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

 

[Foxfire]

Early on this is what I remember him saying.

“I want the doctor to tell me if even the death occurred there,” Sills said. “There’s no evidence of a bullet hole in the wall or anything.”
http://www.macon.com/2014/05/08/3087453/decapitation-unlikely-cause-of.html

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

'One thing I think, or at least I hope we can all agree on is that there is at least one more, missing crime scene location'..jmo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

In that case, did LE serve a search warrant to obtain a buccal swab before he was arrested?

Hi there Bessie, we feel very special when you walk into the room.

Iirc, they got a court order to obtain his DNA profile through a buccal swabbing. He was already a POI at that time but I don't think he was arrested at the time when they asked for his DNA. Once they got the results back though I do think he was arrested after then and then that is when they got a full scale SW of his home. I also believe they took both head hairs and pubic samples as well when they did the buccal swab.

That is to the best of my memory and its been years ago now but I never forgot how they nail his butt when his flesh was found under her fingernails.

The ME always scrapes under the nails of any homicide victim and then clips the nails also to have them tested.

Hope this helps.

 

[gngr~snap]

'One thing I think, or at least I hope, we can all agree on is that there is at least one more, missing crime scene location'..

For me. 100%
My opinion? IT'S A BOAT.

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

 

[gngr~snap]

Hi there Bessie, we feel very special when you walk into the room.

Iirc, they got a court order to obtain his DNA profile through a buccal swabbing. He was already a POI at that time but I don't think he was arrested at the time when they asked for his DNA. Once they got the results back though I do think he was arrested after then and then that is when they got a full scale SW of his home. I also believe they took both head hairs and pubic samples as well when they did the buccal swab.

That is to the best of my memory and its been years ago now but I never forgot how they nail his butt when his flesh was found under her fingernails.

The ME always scrapes under the nails of any homicide victim and then clips the nails also to have them tested.

Hope this helps.

DOH! Did SD still have the perps flesh under her nails????
Oh please! oh please! oh please!


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[Bootsctr]

My thoughts as well, BBM

also ME and forensics specialist play a really really big roll in this too

I'm glad you brought up the ME tomcat! I watched the video a kindly Websleuther posted the other day of the reporter interview with the gentleman (bless his heart). He sounded like he was in over his head a bit. Said he had never worked a beheading case before. Shouldn't a specialist be brought in, or at least someone who has dealt with a beheading before to double check things?

 

[Cardinal47]

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=245893&page=15&highlight=shirley+dermond

10,150 views in 2 days on the Shirley Dermond WS Thread #6.. Awareness is the Key in Missing/Murdered Investigations, imo..

I always wonder if the killer is reading and following along?

This person with definite mental problems and probably social problems too surely has a computer and if living in that affluent community has internet service.

I hope when they read all of this they know...Sheriff Sills is coming..slow but sure he's coming.

'You can run but you can't hide'
No matter where you go, the consequences of your past action will catch up with you.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

http://mobile.officer.com/article/10232805/lying-for-dna

Surreptitious sampling. Trash on the street is public property. Cigarette butts dropped and spitting on the street too.
Not sure how legal it is but it's done.

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It is very legal. Anything thrown away in the public or trash put on the curb means the person who owned the property no longer wants it therefore it can be taken by anyone legally.

I have seen so many cases lately on the Discovery Channel where LE is doing that more and more to get DNA profiles on someone they suspect.

Did you see the one case where a man was innocent but had been sent to prison for a murder he didn't commit. His own wife proved he was innocent. She asked someone she knew that was in the same jail as the one she suspected of really doing the murder to get an item where she could have it tested. It turned out to be a positive match of the DNA found on the victim which I think was this lady's mom. It took her a couple of more years going to each court but she finally got her husband freed and proved he was innocent.

So maybe the person that called Sills needs to get a sample out of his trash that he has touched........like a cigarette or maybe a throw away cup that he drank from and bring it to Sills.

I wonder though if the killer has read the breaking news article today and whoever called Sills may really be in grave danger.

IMO

 

[2Hope4]

I don't agree. If a murderer plans to kill someone, and I believe this was all very well planned, it's not hard to get a gun anywhere that won't be linked back to you (the shooter), or the bullets from that gun leading back to shooter. A bullet is a bullet and there's only so much info LE can glean from one unless it's something very unusual. Heck, a killer could steal someone's gun to use in a crime. I'm pretty sure, IMO, the killer(s) her took ever step, if a gun was used to kill MrD, to ensure there was no way that the bullet could be traced back.

The longer this goes unsolved, the more I feel that this was a super calculated, planned, orchestrated tragedy.............and that it was very personal..............and the taking of his head was to elicit shock and horrow and fear at whomever the real target is (I feel revenge, or payback directed at someone in the D family). JMO.

Many handguns are NOT registered. Therefore, even with a gun, they wouldn't know who it belonged to. There's groups on facebook, yardsales, word of mouth, stolen guns, etc., that people buy/trade/exchange guns all the time. Some people have guns that have been in the family for generations, and were never registered, though bought new. So unless you can put the gun belonging to the suspect, and match it to whatever crime scene, you still don't have much. Dr. Barton Corbin was on trial for killing his girlfriend in college, and his then wife. He was adamant he was innocent and both deaths were suicides. Until while during trial, prosecutors had finally been able to put the gun in his hands. He had drove to another state and bought it, it wasn't registered, but the seller came forth! Corbin then pled guilty of both murders.

:jail:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

DOH! Did SD still have the perps flesh under her nails????
Oh please! oh please! oh please!


All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

It sure sounds that way to me gngr.

Tissue samples means only one thing when they are included as evidence found. It means tissue samples of the killer have been found under the nails. That is the only place I think that will hold tissue samples.

I don't know if it was Shirley or Russ. Now she was submerged for 11 days in water and decomp can degrade tissue under the nails but Russ would have been in much better shape when found.

Maybe he tried to grab the killer's arms to keep him from striking him and Russ dug his nails .......lets say......deep into his forearms trying desperately to prevent him from killing him.

ETA: Also skin cells are shed by the thousands a day by a normal person and even now they can get a DNA profile from those skin cell tissues. IIRC, it only takes maybe four or five skin cells to get a profile. I think the skin cells are called skin rads if I am not mistaken.

I really am thinking now that Russ' torso yielded most of the evidence they have.

JMO though

 

[2Hope4]

Skin tissue on a rock, brick, any rough surface, brushed against the garage opening while placing Mr. Dermond there. "IF" a knife was used, it's possible the perp cut themself and some blood was left behind.

IF the killer used the water hose, might have left something on the spigot or maybe they did find a murder weapon, and something from the perp was left behind on that.

Do the smaller boats like on the lake have anchors? If so, are they heavy? Smooth, or have any rough areas? Would a body be able to be held down with boat anchors? Well I mean obviously Mrs. Dermond didn't stay underwater, but I'm just wondering if she was weighted down, what was used?? In past cases I've heard of weighting down with rocks, cement blocks, can't remember what else, and it might work in some cases where the body is never found, but I've read many cases here where it didn't work.

 

[tomkat]

So the big companies don't come in and pick up trash? You have to go to the landfill?

dumpster on pearidge and on Twin bridges road, not landfill

for sinclair, probalby trash pickup or dumpster closer to RP

 

[tomkat]

yes they do, small medium large, different type, differnt types for different mooring needs, some pointed, some sortof round and solid

Skin tissue on a rock, brick, any rough surface, brushed against the garage opening while placing Mr. Dermond there. "IF" a knife was used, it's possible the perp cut themself and some blood was left behind.

IF the killer used the water hose, might have left something on the spigot or maybe they did find a murder weapon, and something from the perp was left behind on that.

Do the smaller boats like on the lake have anchors? If so, are they heavy? Smooth, or have any rough areas? Would a body be able to be held down with boat anchors? Well I mean obviously Mrs. Dermond didn't stay underwater, but I'm just wondering if she was weighted down, what was used?? In past cases I've heard of weighting down with rocks, cement blocks, can't remember what else, and it might work in some cases where the body is never found, but I've read many cases here where it didn't work.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

For me. 100%
My opinion? IT'S A BOAT.

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

For me the actual murder location is another location entirely.

I just think it would be way too risky to murder two people on a boat when sound travels much further in open air. I think the murder location was an enclosed area most like a basement.

I don't think the murders themselves were done on a boat but I do believe that is the transportation method he used to dispose of Shirley and the head. Also I think he came from the backside of the Dermond home, docking at their unoccupied dock,in order to drag the torso a short 50-60 feet into the garage.

I am not 100% certain about anything. I sure wish I was though, but I do feel comfortable with my opinions/theories.

The main thing for me anyway....... theories or not ........is finding out who did this to Shirley and Russ who deserved to live the life they had before it was so cruelly taken from them.

 

[tomkat]

can compare the type of bullet to other crimes where same bullet/same gun type was used (if in the case of other similar murders as one under investigation)

Many handguns are NOT registered. Therefore, even with a gun, they wouldn't know who it belonged to. There's groups on facebook, yardsales, word of mouth, stolen guns, etc., that people buy/trade/exchange guns all the time. Some people have guns that have been in the family for generations, and were never registered, though bought new. So unless you can put the gun belonging to the suspect, and match it to whatever crime scene, you still don't have much. Dr. Barton Corbin was on trial for killing his girlfriend in college, and his then wife. He was adamant he was innocent and both deaths were suicides. Until while during trial, prosecutors had finally been able to put the gun in his hands. He had drove to another state and bought it, it wasn't registered, but the seller came forth! Corbin then pled guilty of both murders.

:jail:

 

[2Hope4]

I keep wondering, why even bring Mr Dermond's body into the garage if that wasn't the crime scene? I'm just not convinced that it wasn't within the home, or in the garage. I know blood splatter would be present if it's an open wound to the head, but, there's close wounds as well that cause such brain damage it kills the person. And if a drain was in the garage, or a utility sink area, well, bleach and lots of water down the drain. Same thing if it was in the bathtub or shower.

I know I read where dogs were brought in, and they should have hit on any blood on the property IF they were allowed to walk every inch of it. If the bodies had been drug on a tarp, or sheet, the dogs still should have hit on that. And maybe they did, but we haven't been told.

I don't know, but I would guess they would have to have an article from the suspect for the dogs to track their path to the lake or whatever.

Really OFFTOPIC SKIP IF YOU WANT!

I have some orphan piglets right now. I keep trying to introduce them to the sow in hopes she will accept them. BUT, as of today, I realize they are imprinted on me, and my scent, and voice. I took them outside and put them in the pig lot near their Mom today, and walked away out of the Mom's sight, in hopes she would hear them squeal and realize they were hers. Those tiny little piglets instead put their nose to the ground, and followed MY scent right back to me, climb up on my feet and were content. They are only two days old!!

 

[Razz]

A little off topic for a bit. About the tax deductible reward money. I guess if you take the deduction, you don't expect to get it back. And since most rewards aren't paid out, where does that money go?

 

[tomkat]

I'm glad you brought up the ME tomcat! I watched the video a kindly Websleuther posted the other day of the reporter interview with the gentleman (bless his heart). He sounded like he was in over his head a bit. Said he had never worked a beheading case before. Shouldn't a specialist be brought in, or at least someone who has dealt with a beheading before to double check things?

I'm not sure but many many other clues and forensics can have leads that are unbelievable and hard to fathom to the amateur, like myself, they amaze me how they can put things together

of course, we'd hope that we have a very good ME, but many I'm sure have not handled beheadings, ME may even be discussing (for whatever reasons) it with those few in this world who have dealt with beheadings

They be pretty smart I think LOL

 

[Razz]

I keep wondering, why even bring Mr Dermond's body into the garage if that wasn't the crime scene? I'm just not convinced that it wasn't within the home, or in the garage. I know blood splatter would be present if it's an open wound to the head, but, there's close wounds as well that cause such brain damage it kills the person. And if a drain was in the garage, or a utility sink area, well, bleach and lots of water down the drain. Same thing if it was in the bathtub or shower.

I know I read where dogs were brought in, and they should have hit on any blood on the property IF they were allowed to walk every inch of it. If the bodies had been drug on a tarp, or sheet, the dogs still should have hit on that. And maybe they did, but we haven't been told.

I don't know, but I would guess they would have to have an article from the suspect for the dogs to track their path to the lake or whatever.

Really OFFTOPIC SKIP IF YOU WANT!

I have some orphan piglets right now. I keep trying to introduce them to the sow in hopes she will accept them. BUT, as of today, I realize they are imprinted on me, and my scent, and voice. I took them outside and put them in the pig lot near their Mom today, and walked away out of the Mom's sight, in hopes she would hear them squeal and realize they were hers. Those tiny little piglets instead put their nose to the ground, and followed MY scent right back to me, climb up on my feet and were content. They are only two days old!!

Well, sounds like those sweet little piglets will be great house pets!

 

[tomkat]

A little off topic for a bit. About the tax deductible reward money. I guess if you take the deduction, you don't expect to get it back. And since most rewards aren't paid out, where does that money go?

:floorlaugh: my thoughts exactly, may not ever be a payout, refund policy likely not like walmart LOL

maybe for other future cases or new rides?