GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 9

[watcher9]

Where was it reported that Ms. D was put into water after she died? By the time her body was recovered, it would be impossible to determine whether there was water in her lungs or not. How could it be known that she was already dead?

Shirley Dermond, 87, died of blunt force trauma to the head and was dead when she was dumped in the lake, Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. She did not drown and she was not alive when she was put in the water, he said.

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/source-investigators-find-body-putnam-county/nfyK5/

 

[Backwoods]

Elderly man's head never found; Investigators take second look at family

Read more: http://www.cbs46.com/story/27981671...tors-take-second-look-at-family#ixzz3QJFQr85O

Thanks for posting! It has been ever so long since any news of this case has come out. I wonder if the murder of the Runions in Telfair Co., GA prompted media to hunt Sills up for the latest?

I really think that second part of the headline is a LITTLE misleading -- doesn't seem, from the body of the article, that "looking at the family again" really deserves that emphasis -- more like EVERYONE who had close contact with the Dermonds shortly before they died will be re-interviewed.

From link above^^
Among other things, Sills says,
"The last six months, I'll be very candid with you, haven't been very productive at all," said Sheriff Sills.

Well, I guess he wasn't very on top of it. How much time was wasted??

He also says MrsD was beaten to death. Then says the first blow could have killed her but it may have been the second blow. That made me think that she was beaten by something other than a fist, like maybe a bat, piece of lumber, fire poker, a cement block, a rock, etc.

Read more: http://www.cbs46.com/story/27981671...tors-take-second-look-at-family#ixzz3QKIsCwfb

I think this is new as well, isn't it (the knife part)? Stated so strongly, at least -- or have I just forgotten?

Mr. Dermond was decapitated inside his garage and his head was never found.


"We do know that was post-mortem. It was after he was already dead," said Sheriff Sills.


"Based on the incision, it appears to me and both the pathologists that it was a knife," he adds, referring to the method in which Mr. Dermond was decapitated.

Interesting questions about HOW it could be determined whether or not Mrs. Dermond was dead before being placed in the water...

Where was it reported that Ms. D was put into water after she died? By the time her body was recovered, it would be impossible to determine whether there was water in her lungs or not. How could it be known that she was already dead?

Shirley Dermond, 87, died of blunt force trauma to the head and was dead when she was dumped in the lake, Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills told The Atlanta Journal-Constitution. She did not drown and she was not alive when she was put in the water, he said.

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/source-investigators-find-body-putnam-county/nfyK5/

I wonder if they just assume she was dead before going into the water because of the severity of the beating wounds?

Or -- could she possibly have been held for a time and was then killed/placed in the water much later than we have thought? (And was discovered in time that postmortem exam COULD determine she had not drowned.)

 

[Backwoods]

Why did they only show one granddaughter? And she is from the one that was murdered, right? The daughter in SC has 2 college-age boys, IIRC. What about the 2 sons? Don't they have children?

bbm: That really is odd. Maybe just sloppy reporting, attempting to answer questions some have raised about the deceased son (did he have kids, etc.). ...??

 

[Foxfire]

Imo, we are witnessing the obvious and tragic results of Sheriff Howard Sill's decision to squander the vast investigative resources of the GBI<Georgia Bureau of Investigations>.. After almost nine months since the heinous murders of the Dermonds, imo it is past time to request the GBI's assistance to hopefully get answers and insure justice for the Dermonds and their family... jmo

 

[margarita25]

Was it confirmed that Mr. Dermond collected swords? IIRC, there was a picture of swords (apparently taken on a vacation) which led to speculation.

(O/T, FWIW, IIRC, ARS, JR's killer collected swords?)

 

[margarita25]

Imo, we are witnessing the obvious and tragic results of Sheriff Howard Sill's decision to squander the vast investigative resources of the GBI<Georgia Bureau of Investigations>.. After almost nine months since the heinous murders of the Dermonds, imo it is past time to request the GBI's assistance to hopefully get answers and insure justice for the Dermonds and their family... jmo

GBI isn't involved? They were involved in the Runion's case...

 

[southernmimi]

They were involved with the Runion case, and it was solved immediately.

 

[True Crime Lover]

Correct me if I am wrong (I know y'all will!), but when SS was asked about his decision not to use GBI resources, he said in his defense that the GBI had done the autopsies, indicating he had no animosity towards the GBI. I believe that he pretty much HAD to have the autopsies done at the GBI. Putnam County is under the Coroner system, not the Medical Examiner system (as maybe 5 large counties are), and therefore had no Medical Examiner (who is a medical doctor) on staff. Has the sheriff, in the 9 months since this murder, asked for help from the GBI? Sure wish a new unbiased nonpolitical set of eyes would. for example, examine the D's last bank checking account statement (or maybe last 2 statements dependent on the banking cycle) with no preconceived ideas. I remember seeing a clip of the sheriff surrounded by numerous boxes of records saying the he had gone through 10 years of records with the result being "Nothing." What could having ONE GOOD DETECTIVE have a fresh look at the evidence hurt?
Regarding the statement that Ms D was already deceased before being put in the water, it may be that the head trauma wound (and recently woundS) may have been deemed by a medical doctor to have been unsurvivable to a human. The large volume of blood at death scenes where the body has been removed is sometimes used to determine that the missing individual is deceased because no human could survive that amount of blood loss.
Of course and as always, JMO.

 

[Happyshoes]

Imo, we are witnessing the obvious and tragic results of Sheriff Howard Sill's decision to squander the vast investigative resources of the GBI<Georgia Bureau of Investigations>.. After almost nine months since the heinous murders of the Dermonds, imo it is past time to request the GBI's assistance to hopefully get answers and insure justice for the Dermonds and their family... jmo

I just don't understand why the family isn't crying out for justice, talking to the media, or hiring their own investigator? Who can go over SS' head to get something done? I wish there was something WE could do, letter to the MSGR.com? Why doesn't SS call in a fresh set of eyes? I would not be satisfied with the job done so far, esp if I was their son/daughter. JMO

 

[Foxfire]

GBI isn't involved? They were involved in the Runion's case...

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/resident-question-decision-not-call-gbi-help-putna/nfxjF/

May 15, 2014 Residents question decision not to call GBI for help in Putnam Co. beheading

Sheriff Sills said his department has not found many clues to the crime or to Shirley Dermond&#8217;s whereabouts, but he said he is not prepared to call the GBI for help, instead relying on his own 40 years in law enforcement.

&#8220;If you can tell me something the GBI knows how to do that I don&#8217;t know how to do then I will be glad and call them,&#8221; Sills said.
<sniped - read more>

They were involved with the Runion case, and it was solved immediately.

"So true, southernmimi, so true"...

Correct me if I am wrong (I know y'all will!), but when SS was asked about his decision not to use GBI resources, he said in his defense that the GBI had done the autopsies, indicating he had no animosity towards the GBI. I believe that he pretty much HAD to have the autopsies done at the GBI. Putnam County is under the Coroner system, not the Medical Examiner system (as maybe 5 large counties are), and therefore had no Medical Examiner (who is a medical doctor) on staff. Has the sheriff, in the 9 months since this murder, asked for help from the GBI? Sure wish a new unbiased nonpolitical set of eyes would. for example, examine the D's last bank checking account statement (or maybe last 2 statements dependent on the banking cycle) with no preconceived ideas. I remember seeing a clip of the sheriff surrounded by numerous boxes of records saying the he had gone through 10 years of records with the result being "Nothing." What could having ONE GOOD DETECTIVE have a fresh look at the evidence hurt?
Regarding the statement that Ms D was already deceased before being put in the water, it may be that the head trauma wound (and recently woundS) may have been deemed by a medical doctor to have been unsurvivable to a human. The large volume of blood at death scenes where the body has been removed is sometimes used to determine that the missing individual is deceased because no human could survive that amount of blood loss.
Of course and as always, JMO.

True Crime Lover, Sheriff Sills has been very transparent as to why he refuses to request the GBI's assistance in the Dermond murder investigation. He does not want to render rural Sheriffs and Sheriff's Departments unnecessary or obsolete, causing them to eventually become extinct as did the dinosaurs... There is also one other very significant reason that can't be discussed on this thread.

Hopefully, we can all agree that awareness is the key in missing/murdered person's investigations in the 21st century, and that all available resources should be utilized by investigators to insure a probable successful resolution and eventual justice for the victims and their family..

It concerns me very much that this appears not to be the case in the Dermond's abduction/murders/decapitation investigation..
Why would Sheriff Howard Sills continue to refuse these valuable investigative resources; the GBI's elite special agents as well as internet social media; facebook, twitter, etc., to inform the citizenry?

We have all witnessed many successful murder investigations over the past nine months in GA with GBI assistance, including but not limited to the identification and arrest of an Atlanta serial killer, and the recent identification and arrest of the suspect in the Elrey "Bud" and his wife, June Runion murders in rural McRae, Ga. Unlike the Dermond abduction/decapitation/murder investigation, all available investigative resources were utilized...


Interactive Social Media: The Value for Law Enforcement
http://leb.fbi.gov/2013/september/interactive-social-media-the-value-for-law-enforcement

Just curious, if anyone has any plausible explanation, or ideas as to why the silence by SS, lack of investigative updates/pressers, and the absence of msm coverage by WSB2 Mark Winne, AJC's Christian Boone, Athens Banner Herald's crimewriter Joe Johnson, and the Eatonton Messenger News?

I just don't understand why the family isn't crying out for justice, talking to the media, or hiring their own investigator? Who can go over SS' head to get something done? I wish there was something WE could do, letter to the MSGR.com? Why doesn't SS call in a fresh set of eyes? I would not be satisfied with the job done so far, esp if I was their son/daughter. JMO

Happyshoes, only the GA Governor can override the authority of Sheriff Sills' refusal to request the GBI's assistance in the Dermond murder investigation.
I asked why the GBI wasn't involved in the Dermond murder investigation on their facebook page. Their reply was that they must be requested by the Sheriff or the GA Governor..<paraphrased>

 

[True Crime Lover]

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local/resident-question-decision-not-call-gbi-help-putna/nfxjF/

May 15, 2014 Residents question decision not to call GBI for help in Putnam Co. beheading

Sheriff Sills said his department has not found many clues to the crime or to Shirley Dermond&#8217;s whereabouts, but he said he is not prepared to call the GBI for help, instead relying on his own 40 years in law enforcement.

&#8220;If you can tell me something the GBI knows how to do that I don&#8217;t know how to do then I will be glad and call them,&#8221; Sills said.
<sniped - read more>


Sheriff Sills has been very transparent as to why he refuses to request the GBI's assistance in the Dermond murder investigation. He does not want to render rural Sheriffs and Sheriff's Departments unnecessary or obsolete, causing them to eventually become extinct as did the dinosaurs... There is also one other very significant reason that can't be discussed on this thread.

I had been keeping up with this case until several months ago, expecting arrests in this case long before now. I have yet to see where SS made such a ridiculous "dinosaur" statement as to why he has not called in the GBI. Is there a valid link for this? As for the statement regarding "relying on his own 40 years in law enforcement," hasn't he been sheriff of a small county for at least 15 years? How many murders has he been involved in the last 15 years? Think of the advancements in technology and investigation techniques that have occurred in 15 years, as well as the tendency of skills to diminish if not used in years. It must come down to the reason which cannot be discussed on this forum.
I really do not understand either why the family has not shown an apparent interest in finding the killers.
Has anyone drawn the similarities between the professional gambler Ernest Scherer III who killed his wealthy parents, particularly as someone above mentioned possibility of Ds owning swords? Excellent LE work solved this case. However, I do not believe that these murders were perpetrated by a family member.
As always, JMO.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/poker-pro-suspected-in-double-murder/

 

[wildebeest]

I am very frustrated with the lack of progress in this case, as well as many of you are. I'm hoping that with the speedy arrest of the suspect in Telfair county, perhaps SS is rethinking the investigation, and may reconsider asking for help!

IMHO

 

[Foxfire]

I had been keeping up with this case until several months ago, expecting arrests in this case long before now. I have yet to see where SS made such a ridiculous "dinosaur" statement as to why he has not called in the GBI. Is there a valid link for this? As for the statement regarding "relying on his own 40 years in law enforcement," hasn't he been sheriff of a small county for at least 15 years? How many murders has he been involved in the last 15 years? Think of the advancements in technology and investigation techniques that have occurred in 15 years, as well as the tendency of skills to diminish if not used in years. It must come down to the reason which cannot be discussed on this forum.
I really do not understand either why the family has not shown an apparent interest in finding the killers.
Has anyone drawn the similarities between the professional gambler Ernest Scherer III who killed his wealthy parents, particularly as someone above mentioned possibility of Ds owning swords? Excellent LE work solved this case. However, I do not believe that these murders were perpetrated by a family member.
As always, JMO.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/poker-pro-suspected-in-double-murder/

Sheriff of the Year 2013 - Howard Sills <VIDEO>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5Md1kqgvgY#t=900

<BBM for Focus>
http://www.examiner.com/article/put...sills-profile-of-cop-over-dermond-couple-case

May 15, 2014 - Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills: Profile of cop over Dermond couple case

Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills is an enigma to the hundreds of news journalists reporting about him and the bizarre murder and missing person case he is currently overseeing in the state of Georgia. And the local paper, the Eatonton Messenger, says the Southern sheriff has said he isn't talking anymore about the case until he has something to talk about.

Interestingly, the Putnam County lawman chose to spend a portion of his time on stage discussing his hobby of Paleontology, the study of prehistoric life, likening the Tyrannosaurus "T rex" as "the baddest *advertiser censored* of them all," saying T rex "was the sheriff of the dinosaurs." But he also pointed out that the dinosaurs suffered from a brain so small that the part of it that did the thinking was only the size of a walnut, despite the height, length and weight of these large dinosaurs.

And then the sheriff began talking about how one of the most powerful offices in the land--the sheriff's office--was being done away with in some states and communities, like Connecticut. He said that Rhode Island has no elected sheriffs, as their sheriff's are a "division of the department of safety" instead. He quoted one New Hampshire representative as saying that the state police, not local sheriffs, should be the ones running investigations.

Putnam's sheriff appears to be concerned that the office of sheriff will go the way of dinosaurs, as if the county lawman leader will one day be extinct in the wake of a public seeking to downsize so much they fold that office into an arm of more state government, and he cautions his fellow lawmen to maintain the integrity of the office, by observing a strict and honorable code of conduct, as one way to prevent that from happening.

In addition, Sheriff Sills insists that his peers need to refrain from having their agencies personnel answer the phone as "law enforcement center" instead of "sheriff's office" when they greet phone callers. He feels that is eroding the office of the sheriff in the simplest of terms, which might explain why you do not see him make press conferences in conjunction with the GBI or FBI, but rather, on his own, in the Dermond case.

"You are the only person in Georgia law that has the duty to protect the lives, persons, property, health and morals of the people. Nobody else has that duty. City police are authorized to enforce laws, state patrol are authorized by the legislature to enforce laws on the highway, and GBI has certain authorizations, but nobody has the duty that you do. The Supreme Court said that a long time ago," Sheriff Sills said.
<snipped - read more>

 

[southernmimi]

Sometimes reality is more frightening than the unknown. Maybe SS wants to stay where it's safe.

 

[DAMIFINO]

dancinunderthemoon---Yes, it does seem odd that phone records in the Runion case were pulled up immediately, while it seemed to take an act of Congress for SS to do the same. I think there was more to this story. I don't understand drop phones, either, need to study up on them!

Please set me straight if I am mistaken, but I think that in the Dermond case, the phone records requested were for any phone numbers that were picked up by certain towers. I remember that SS said it was a huge amount of data. I think they were not looking for someone who had called the Dermonds, but someone who had made a call/calls between certain dates/times and in a certain area which would place the caller at the location at a certain time. Considering the proximity to I-20, that would be a lot of pings.
In the Runion case, they knew that someone had called Mr. Runion to set up the meeting, so they had a number if even if it was a disposable phone and could work from there.
Does that make sense?

 

[Happyshoes]

It just occurred to me that there may not be any phone calls involved in this case. If the perp came by boat, he had planned what day, what time they would be home - may have been hired, may have been someone that had it in for Mr. D, and was somewhat local or familiar with the lake (and/or the family). After this happened, I remember hearing about "someone" going into a Huddle House nearby and asking for the videotape from their security camera. I guess nothing came of that? SS needs to get a fresh set of eyes on this. I will never understand the family's lack of outrage. JMO

 

[2Hope4]

I'm really starting to wonder if this was a stranger. The last few cases of a missing elderly couple has been murder by strangers, and yes the bodies were moved from the home, or lured from home. At this point, we don't know if the Dermonds were lured somewhere, and then the deed happened. Well, I guess truly, we don't know much as fact!!!

I hope we have answers and SOON!

 

[Happyshoes]

I was somewhat under the impression it happened on their property. And I think that's why there's not much DNA (although didn't SS say there was some?). I was thinking that whoever did it didn't even go in the house. I was at first thinking this was done by a young person, probably on meth, that went there to steal something, or just very mad at Mr. D - but now I think it was planned and hired out to someone. It seems to be whoever wanted it done, did not want any bullets or any way to have it traced back to them.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Sheriff of the Year 2013 - Howard Sills <VIDEO>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5Md1kqgvgY#t=900

<BBM for Focus>
http://www.examiner.com/article/put...sills-profile-of-cop-over-dermond-couple-case

May 15, 2014 - Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills: Profile of cop over Dermond couple case

Putnam County Sheriff Howard Sills is an enigma to the hundreds of news journalists reporting about him and the bizarre murder and missing person case he is currently overseeing in the state of Georgia. And the local paper, the Eatonton Messenger, says the Southern sheriff has said he isn't talking anymore about the case until he has something to talk about.

Interestingly, the Putnam County lawman chose to spend a portion of his time on stage discussing his hobby of Paleontology, the study of prehistoric life, likening the Tyrannosaurus "T rex" as "the baddest *advertiser censored* of them all," saying T rex "was the sheriff of the dinosaurs." But he also pointed out that the dinosaurs suffered from a brain so small that the part of it that did the thinking was only the size of a walnut, despite the height, length and weight of these large dinosaurs.

And then the sheriff began talking about how one of the most powerful offices in the land--the sheriff's office--was being done away with in some states and communities, like Connecticut. He said that Rhode Island has no elected sheriffs, as their sheriff's are a "division of the department of safety" instead. He quoted one New Hampshire representative as saying that the state police, not local sheriffs, should be the ones running investigations.

Putnam's sheriff appears to be concerned that the office of sheriff will go the way of dinosaurs, as if the county lawman leader will one day be extinct in the wake of a public seeking to downsize so much they fold that office into an arm of more state government, and he cautions his fellow lawmen to maintain the integrity of the office, by observing a strict and honorable code of conduct, as one way to prevent that from happening.

In addition, Sheriff Sills insists that his peers need to refrain from having their agencies personnel answer the phone as "law enforcement center" instead of "sheriff's office" when they greet phone callers. He feels that is eroding the office of the sheriff in the simplest of terms, which might explain why you do not see him make press conferences in conjunction with the GBI or FBI, but rather, on his own, in the Dermond case.

"You are the only person in Georgia law that has the duty to protect the lives, persons, property, health and morals of the people. Nobody else has that duty. City police are authorized to enforce laws, state patrol are authorized by the legislature to enforce laws on the highway, and GBI has certain authorizations, but nobody has the duty that you do. The Supreme Court said that a long time ago," Sheriff Sills said.
<snipped - read more>

A possibility is that he was trying to say that American's are being indoctrinated for a future police state, ridding the sheriffs and police depts and that these authorities watch out for their city/county unlike having troops or gbi fbi only on american soil to do this job, in a police state, you have no rights

On the other hand, he should utilize GBI as well in this case, he calls the shots anyway, but if what he was implying above, then why even call the FBI

Sounds pompass but if you look at any possible deeper meaning too, not so much

he probably can't readily say it outright without looking foolish, well these statements seem silly too, but most people don't listen to this stuff and why the U.S. could easily become a police state if people dont' pay attention,

just sayin' lol

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I was somewhat under the impression it happened on their property. And I think that's why there's not much DNA (although didn't SS say there was some?). I was thinking that whoever did it didn't even go in the house. I was at first thinking this was done by a young person, probably on meth, that went there to steal something, or just very mad at Mr. D - but now I think it was planned and hired out to someone. It seems to be whoever wanted it done, did not want any bullets or any way to have it traced back to them.

hmmmm, my sentiments exactly............now WHO would gain from their deaths?

A person on the streets isn't likely going to be found in phone records or banking acct, so why is SS looking there.........

People making statements to the police can lead the investigation if they try or atleast others/LE may get suspicious of such

this was too clean to be meth and why would they want to behead in stead of just shoot and run

Whoever did this did NOT want to be caught, who would have the most fear of being caught?

And the crime itself makes one thing cartel or other such where beheadings occur, the body was removed from the scene, anchored in the lake to hopefully ensure no one knew where she was, which confused the investigation, just like the beheading, leads people to beleive one thing or another but not obviously what happened, that may have also been to confuse the investigation

glad the duaghter and grandchild got to see them the week prior to the murders, the D's probably would have been alone there after Easter, un til the summer when family or friends would be visiiting again as is the custom on lake property , did someone know this???

Just MHO