GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #2

[LisaB]

Why do the reports keep saying they are not able to verify that the boy was actually in the car at 9am?
What would cause them to think this?
What would the ramifications be?
The ONLY thing that makes this statement make sense is if they have surveillance video of someone (him or another person) placing the boy into the car seat after 9am.
What I am saying next makes no logical sense, I do not think it happened, and am not accusing anyone of anything... it is PURELY hypothetical...

Suppose the father left the son with someone all morning, possibly even handing the boy off at the Chik Fil A restaurant. He then went to work, having checked the time it would take for an "animal" to die in a hot car ahead of time, and found that an hour was more than enough time.

At "lunchtime" he could have met the person who had been tending to the child at the car and placed the boy (an item?) inside, OR just left the car unlocked so the "accomplice" could place the child in the car while the father was accounted for at his workstation (and during the hottest part of the day).

I do not think this happened. I do not think he had an accomplice, assuming the death was premeditated, since I can't imagine how one would even APPROACH a friend or relative to suggest cooperating with such a thing. I DO, however, think it would be an alternative explanation for his going to the car mid-day, and for the child still being sweaty when removed from the vehicle that, is not inconsistent with what LE has released to date.

I can attest to the fact that retail Home Depot locations have some of the most AWESOME surveillance. I had my checkbook stolen about 10 years ago and requested video from every place checks were written. Home Depot had great coverage of every aisle, clear and in full color at a time when many others had grainy black and white, or a system that snapped shots every few seconds or just at the checkouts. the only store with better quality video was JCPenney. I was able to find the culprits and have them convicted.

 

[Simply Caustic]

I guess I'm referring to comments where the person uses an actual facebook account, and when you go to it you can see a history of the person knowing the subject of the articles.

I agree, completely anonymous postings can be outrageous. But I think all of us here have also seen cases where they turn out to be exactly true.

Agree wholeheartedly. It's a guessing game to discern those with real inside knowledge, from those feigning it. Yet, when linked to a FB account - or when the commentator shares information that's later verified correct...well, I've learned many things ahead of the curve, by following along.

Via Kindle, like a true Amazon junkie

 

[blue22]

Why do the reports keep saying they are not able to verify that the boy was actually in the car at 9am?
What would cause them to think this?
What would the ramifications be?
The ONLY thing that makes this statement make sense is if they have surveillance video of someone (him or another person) placing the boy into the car seat after 9am.
What I am saying next makes no logical sense, I do not think it happened, and am not accusing anyone of anything... it is PURELY hypothetical...

Suppose the father left the son with someone all morning, possibly even handing the boy off at the Chik Fil A restaurant. He then went to work, having checked the time it would take for an "animal" to die in a hot car ahead of time, and found that an hour was more than enough time.

At "lunchtime" he could have met the person who had been tending to the child at the car and placed the boy (an item?) inside, OR just left the car unlocked so the "accomplice" could place the child in the car while the father was accounted for at his workstation (and during the hottest part of the day).

I do not think this happened. I do not think he had an accomplice, assuming the death was premeditated, since I can't imagine how one would even APPROACH a friend or relative to suggest cooperating with such a thing. I DO, however, think it would be an alternative explanation for his going to the car mid-day, and for the child still being sweaty when removed from the vehicle that, is not inconsistent with what LE has released to date.

I can attest to the fact that retail Home Depot locations have some of the most AWESOME surveillance. I had my checkbook stolen about 10 years ago and requested video from every place checks were written. Home Depot had great coverage of every aisle, clear and in full color at a time when many others had grainy black and white, or a system that snapped shots every few seconds or just at the checkouts. the only store with better quality video was JCPenney. I was able to find the culprits and have them convicted.

The Police have said since that comment was made, that he was in the car. JMO, but I think they said that before they had the verification of chickfila and when his car arrived to work. Upon seeing the child enter the car there and him arrive at work, that is a couple minutes. The child can't go anywhere between then. That was said pretty early one while they were likely still nailing down the timeline. Until they verified breakfast, there was probably nothing tangible to show them the boy was in the car at 9am. Not based in fact, just my speculating

 

[JeannaT]

Anyone can act/appear like an insider on news comment sites. I take news comments with a GOS.:twocents:

Not when they sign in with a facebook page and when you go to their facebook page, you see they are friends with someone in the news article. Or you can tell they work for the same company as is mentioned in the article, etc.

Or anyway, I've certainly been able to verify through facebook who is actually an insider.

 

[JSR]

I understand the distrust of the criminal justice system. There are major problems with it. [modsnip]

I look at facts. The facts generally speak for themselves. Yes, sometimes those facts make it obvious that LE is wrong and an innocent person is being railroaded. For example, Tonya Craft and the recent Steiniger/Weiner case. Most times, however, the arrest and charging of an innocent, middle class white person is rare. And the arrest of the dad here, based on the little that has been reported, shows this dude has likely done something horrible to his child, other than forgetting him in the car.

Oh, and as to hot car deaths, those actually do not happen often. An average of 38 kids per year die in this country from such events. But we have a population of 314 million. About 62 million are kids. So the percentage is so small it can almost not be quantified.

Of course it happens. It's just that common sense tells it didn't happen here.
1. The guy apparently searched on his computer, days before he claims his child died in a hot car, how long it takes an animal to die in a hot car.
2. The man forgot his only child in 3 minutes.
3. The man claimed he never went back to his car until the end of work. But cameras show otherwise.
4. The police arrested him very quickly, and charged him with felony murder, which is unusual in these cases.

Another fact that is extremely telling to me is that Harris is being held WITHOUT bail. That's huge to me. It says that LE knows something we don't and leaves no doubt about if this is a accident or not.

And another fact is the smell that was undoubtedly in the car by 4:00 pm that day. There's no way he didn't smell it the minute he opened the car to go home. I find it suspect he got in that smelly car and drove any length of time in the car before "remembering"

As an aside I've read in this thread that these parents had trouble conceiving. That makes this case even more heartbreaking. My own husband and I have been there done that and are expecting our first child next month. And we experienced frightening circumstances even after me getting pregnant being on bed rest for 3 months. I can say that parents who have had to fight to become parents are of a different breed. I think we become hyper aware and far more over zealous which makes me wonder why something didn't click in this guys head during those 7 long hours.

I realize that all parents make mistakes and some might leave a kid in a car if they are on autopilot but they would surely not forget for 7 long hours!!!

 

[LisaB]

I want to post an image off my computer of HD bldg and parking lot. But it asks for http address of image. How can you upload a map image to this thread that isn't from a web address?

"Choose File" and then "Upload"

 

[blue22]

Another fact that is extremely telling to me is that Harris is being held WITHOUT bail. That's huge to me. It says that LE knows something we don't and leaves no doubt about if this is a accident or not.

And another fact is the smell that was undoubtedly in the car by 4:00 pm that day. There's no way he didn't smell it the minute he opened the car to go home. I find it suspect he got in that smelly car and drove any length of time in the car before "remembering"

As an aside I've read in this thread that these parents had trouble conceiving. That makes this case even more heartbreaking. My own husband and I have been there done that and are expecting our first child next month. And we experienced frightening circumstances even after me getting pregnant being on bed rest for 3 months. I can say that parents who have had to fight to become parents are of a different breed. I think we become hyper aware and far more over zealous which makes me wonder why something didn't click in this guys head during those 7 long hours.

I realize that all parents make mistakes and some might leave a kid in a car if they are on autopilot but they would surely not forget for 7 long hours!!!

I agree. LE doesn't decide if he gets bail or not. The court looks at the evidence, hears the argument, and decides. The charges, the bail...that was all the court. At the time, they did not have enough to show intent. Since then, they are working toward finding intent and raise the charges, or finding that the charges right now are what the evidence supports. I was just thinking in my head of all the things they would have to look into when looking for motive and intent. Just over a week later, I can't imagine they've crossed very many off the list. It takes time to scour a person's life. I do believe they have much more than we know (they always do,) but the evidence hunt is just beginning.

 

[JSR]

I agree. LE doesn't decide if he gets bail or not. The court looks at the evidence, hears the argument, and decides. The charges, the bail...that was all the court. At the time, they did not have enough to show intent. Since then, they are working toward finding intent and raise the charges, or finding that the charges right now are what the evidence supports. I was just thinking in my head of all the things they would have to look into when looking for motive and intent. Just over a week later, I can't imagine they've crossed very many off the list. It takes time to scour a person's life. I do believe they have much more than we know (they always do,) but the evidence hunt is just beginning.

I know LE isn't responsible for issues regarding bail but they do submit information to the Court that assists the Court in determining if bail is warranted. So whatever LE submitted to the Court indicates to me that they have substantial information that allowed the Judge to feel comfortable in not allowing any bail. That's huge to me.

 

[gngr~snap]

WSB TV just stated that Harris' computers both from his home and office contain incriminating evidence.

That is why they are refusing to download images of Cooper to give to the family.
If there is incriminating evidence on the home computer I have to say life may not have been how people thought it was behind closed doors.
moo

 

[katinva]

And the media. I would really like to see a return to Walter Chronkite reporting, rather than all this guessing.

I agree! Another case on here some people actually stopped posting because members were quoting the media and most of it was all wrong. Its kind of like the telephone game from when you were kids. One word leads into this huge ordeal and each person adds to it.

 

[blue22]

I know LE isn't responsible for issues regarding bail but they do submit information to the Court that assists the Court in determining if bail is warranted. So whatever LE submitted to the Court indicates to me that they have substantial information that allowed the Judge to feel comfortable in not allowing any bail. That's huge to me.

Oh, me too. I was kind of rambling. I was meaning that LE has to prove to the court, that the evidence is there. LE had enough to convince the court that he shouldn't have bail. LE can't make the court do anything, and the fact that they saw enough to agree is really big.

I agree with you, it's huge to me as well.

 

[JudyBolton]

I have a question. For those of you who have used "professional" day care (as opposed to a family or friend keeping children in their home) - would it be the usual procedure that if you did not show up with your child at the expected time - they would call either parent to check on why they are not there?

I never used day care but I still feel this is an important part of this case and I'm sure LE has interviewed the Day Care workers.

Assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse - even if it was at that moment that he realized, "OMG - the baby is still in the car".

TIA for any input on this......

 

[JeannaT]

I have a question. For those of you who have used "professional" day care (as opposed to a family or friend keeping children in their home) - would it be the usual procedure that if you did not show up with your child at the expected time - they would call either parent to check on why they are not there?

I never used day care but I still feel this is an important part of this case and I'm sure LE has interviewed the Day Care workers.

Assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse - even if it was at that moment that he realized, "OMG - the baby is still in the car".

TIA for any input on this......

Judy, I think you've made a huge leap here. From a question about whether it's typical policy to call, and then "assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse".

I think if daycare called him that day and he gave a lying excuse, this case would be over. That's it. I think LE would lead with that, and anyone who doubted he was murdered on purpose would drift away. That would have been in the warrant, rather than the trip to the car where it's left up to the imagination whether Harris could see the baby/knew he was there/could smell him. If someone called and said hey he was never dropped off, case closed.

As it is, he's only being charged with accidentally leaving the baby in the car, resulting in death.

 

[gngr~snap]

"The family is trying to obtain pictures from the family's laptop that was seized as a part of the investigation into Cooper's father Justin Ross Harris."

"Cobb County Police say they aren't allowing that because the laptop is being used as evidence in the on-going criminal investigation into Ross Harris."

http://www.fox5vegas.com/story/2588...rris-denied-access-to-seized-laptops-pictures

 

[Melanie]

When my son was a baby, I'd put him down for his nap and take one myself. I've never in my life before or since have been able to fall asleep so fast! Lol
Naps are so refreshing!!!




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yup - I did that once. Fell asleep so deep I didn't know my toddler was up running around the house. Lucky he didn't turn the stove on, or walk out the door. To this day I still beat myself up about it, but I wouldn't call it being a horrible parent. He eventually pounded me in the face to wake up and give him some juice! Thankfully, it was a happy ending, but trust me - it never happened again!

MOO

Mel

 

[blue22]

I have a question. For those of you who have used "professional" day care (as opposed to a family or friend keeping children in their home) - would it be the usual procedure that if you did not show up with your child at the expected time - they would call either parent to check on why they are not there?

I never used day care but I still feel this is an important part of this case and I'm sure LE has interviewed the Day Care workers.

Assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse - even if it was at that moment that he realized, "OMG - the baby is still in the car".

TIA for any input on this......

I wish there was a definitive answer, but it really just depends on the individual center. Every center has their own policies. I am sure that information is one of the first things LE sought out, though.

In my experience, there was policy in place to call the parent(s) when the child was scheduled to be there and was not. Like I said, that's not necessarily universal.

 

[JSR]

I have a question. For those of you who have used "professional" day care (as opposed to a family or friend keeping children in their home) - would it be the usual procedure that if you did not show up with your child at the expected time - they would call either parent to check on why they are not there?

I never used day care but I still feel this is an important part of this case and I'm sure LE has interviewed the Day Care workers.

Assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse - even if it was at that moment that he realized, "OMG - the baby is still in the car".

TIA for any input on this......

I have a family member who ran a home daycare and yes if the parents did not drop off a child or pick up a child on time a call was always made. Now I'm not sure that procedure would apply to a corporate babysitting facility like the one Home Depot provides for it's employees.

 

[BrianInBirmingham]

Another fact that is extremely telling to me is that Harris is being held WITHOUT bail. That's huge to me. It says that LE knows something we don't and leaves no doubt about if this is a accident or not.

And another fact is the smell that was undoubtedly in the car by 4:00 pm that day. There's no way he didn't smell it the minute he opened the car to go home. I find it suspect he got in that smelly car and drove any length of time in the car before "remembering"

As an aside I've read in this thread that these parents had trouble conceiving. That makes this case even more heartbreaking. My own husband and I have been there done that and are expecting our first child next month. And we experienced frightening circumstances even after me getting pregnant being on bed rest for 3 months. I can say that parents who have had to fight to become parents are of a different breed. I think we become hyper aware and far more over zealous which makes me wonder why something didn't click in this guys head during those 7 long hours.

I realize that all parents make mistakes and some might leave a kid in a car if they are on autopilot but they would surely not forget for 7 long hours!!!

My understanding is that the Judge presiding didn't have the authority/jurisdiction to change or set bail. So LE and a Magistrate agreed at the beginning and now it's postponed until the July hearing.

 

[blue22]

Judy, I think you've made a huge leap here. From a question about whether it's typical policy to call, and then "assuming they called the father he must have given some excuse".

I think if daycare called him that day and he gave a lying excuse, this case would be over. That's it. I think LE would lead with that, and anyone who doubted he was murdered on purpose would drift away.

As it is, he's only being charged with accidentally leaving the baby in the car, resulting in death.

He is being charged with grossly and negligently leaving his son in the car, CAUSING his death. Not trying to argue, I just think there is a big difference, that I think deserves to be specified.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I'm going to wait and see.
At this point, I'm trusting law enforcement.
The stench, the web search, claims the child was choking...


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