George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #14 Friday July 12

[Etiana]

The one thing that M'OM does that he needs to be careful of is go on and on. And, he even tells the jury that he has tons of material and things to go over which creates even in my mind a "moan and groan" I think he's excellent, I just hope he reins back from saying too much. He was talking a few minutes ago and I was totally lost on what he was saying. Sometimes in his quest to clear things up, he makes it complicated.

 

[cityslick]

They are proving it. It doesn't make sense. GZ is a liar, the prosecution showed that. I don't believe him. Therefore I think his self defense claim is bogus. If his self defense claim is bogus then he committed manslaughter. IMO


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How have they proved it? How have they proved that GZ was not in fear for his life? The evidence already shows that TM was on top of GZ, in a position of power.

 

[especiallyheather]

The state would have to make a decision whether or not to re-try the case with a whole new jury.

iMHO

So this judge does NOT get to decide? Right?

 

[lisasalinger]

Quick Question:
What happens if it is a hung jury? Does the judge decide or do they have to get a new jury like JA's case (PLEASE SAY NO!)
TIA

The judge does not decide. The state would need to decide if they are going to re-try the case and if they decide to proceed, then they will pick a whole new jury and start from the beginning.

IMO

 

[Hopeful One]

Good morning, everyone!! :seeya:

I have a heavy heart this morning. After coming to the conclusion yesterday that I think the proper verdict would be 'not guilty', I truly feel that no matter what, I won't be able to celebrate this verdict as I do most that I agree with.

Trayvon is still dead. There are still soooo many unanswered questions floating around in my brain. No matter what happens, it's not a happy day.

But I'm sending prayers to the jurors to give them strength and guidance to make the just and proper decision.

Justice for Trayvon AND GZ.

IMO

 

[logicalgirl]

MOM is doing, IMO, a slamdunk job so far. He is presenting the case, clear and concisely. Makes the prosecution, IMO, look like amateurs, for NOT presenting facts.

As a PP stated, you can't convict a man of murder based in what ifs.

OMO

Keep in mind that the State makes the last presentation.....

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

BBM The key to my backdoor does not fit my front door. Maybe, Trayvon had a front door key and had to go around to get it. Would that have put him closer to George?

A whole lot of supposing. No facts in evidence. it does not matter to the case and what the state has to prove.

 

[JeannaT]

So this judge does NOT get to decide? Right?

Right.

The judge actually DOES have the right (seldom used) to "vacate" the jury verdict, that is, to overturn it. I don't think that will happen.

IMHO

 

[faefrost]

GZ also said in one of his statements that he didn’t think he shot TM after he fired the shot and yet he said he holstered his weapon right after. So, how can you shoot someone in the heart and not know it when you are just inches away from that person and then tell the neighbor to tell his wife he shot someone. Lord help me, I’m confused :waitasec:

If you look at the autopsy photos it becomes clear. There was a small barely noticeable puncture wound and virtually no external bleeding. This isn't Hollywood with exploding blood packs. He legitimately may not have realized that the kid had been shot or hit until LE arrived.

 

[defense101]

More tweets:

Kathi Belich, WFTV @KBelichWFTV

The defense told the jury they now have #Zimmermanon9 's 6th police call to protect children from cars that the state withheld

.............
Yep this is the call that was widely misreported as to GZ calling 911 on a 7-9yr old. That one even had me swaying the other way until I heard the WHOLE truth regarding the call. He wasn't calling to report a child but to PROTECT one.

These calls have been online for over a year so to say that they didn't have access to this is just wrong. IMO

https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documen...327330/george-zimmerrman-911-call-history.pdf

 

[PaperDoll]

I missed that in testimony, did GZ tell the cops he didn't think he shot him or didn't think he killed him. I thought I heard he said he knew he shot him because he fired his gun. IMO

He didn't learn that TM died until a hour later when at the police station. If you listen to his multiple statements he said he shot him, then he didn't know if he did and thought he missed. His story changes. He said he holstered his gun right after he shot him, then gets on top to spread out his hands, then the neighbor comes. Then he tell another version that he holstered his gun after he got off TM when he said he spread out his hands to see if he hand anything in them. He also said he never looked back at TM's. So, then you must know you shot him if you are no longer fearful of your life...

 

[logicalgirl]

First MOM says to the jury - don't fill in the evidence - now he's saying we have to sort of fill in the timeline......
So far your defense is as clear as mud MOM
IMO

 

[Sonya610]

Kathy Belich tweeted that juror B29 nodded her head 'yes' when Mr. O'Mara said not to fill in the gaps in the evidence to reach a verdict.

Her tweets can be read at the livestream link below.

http://www.wftv.com/s/zimmerman-livestream/

Wasn't B29 the one that wouldn't even LOOK at the prosecutor during his closing argument?

Wow. Obviously the lack of eye contact was not due to shyness but due to disgust. IMO.

The jury has to be unanimous right? To reach a verdict? Sounds like there is at least one wise and sensible woman in George's corner.

IMO.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Good morning, everyone!! :seeya:

I have a heavy heart this morning. After coming to the conclusion yesterday that I think the proper verdict would be 'not guilty', I truly feel that no matter what, I won't be able to celebrate this verdict as I do most that I agree with.

Trayvon is still dead. There are still soooo many unanswered questions floating around in my brain. No matter what happens, it's not a happy day.

But I'm sending prayers to the jurors to give them strength and guidance to make the just and proper decision.

Justice for Trayvon AND GZ.

IMO

There is no good answer that is going to bring back TM. The truth is that had TM not touched GZ, most likely none of this would have happened or if indeed GZ had shot him anyway we would be able to convict with M2.

But the evidence shows that GZ was beaten and that is all it takes to see that he had reasonable fear of great bodily harm or death.

I have to apply the law.

The LAW says GZ has a right to shoot to defend himself and there is no way around the law. The state has not proven anything else.

 

[Perthgirl62]

Sure, but the word you used, scenario, is exactly what MOM is talking about. You can't convict based on what if, theories, etc. Not if there is no evidence to support it.

I agree and again I am not talking about convictions, but this is a quite feasible scenario and can't be discounted as there is not one shred of evidence stating who started the fight.

Many people here are stating that it is fact that TM did, as yet they are unable to show any evidence of this though.

 

[faefrost]

Right.

The judge actually DOES have the right (seldom used) to "vacate" the jury verdict, that is, to overturn it. I don't think that will happen.

IMHO

The Judge can only vacate a jury verdict of Guilty. A Jury verdict of not guilty is untouchable.

 

[defense101]

If you look at the autopsy photos it becomes clear. There was a small barely noticeable puncture wound and virtually no external bleeding. This isn't Hollywood with exploding blood packs. He legitimately may not have realized that the kid had been shot or hit until LE arrived.

Then why did he tell the neighbor to phone his wife and tell her he just shot someone? IMO

 

[bellaalex]

BBM Right now I am in back of MY house....am I in the driveway? the vegetable garden? the gazebo? the pool? the patio? am I in my car or in the truck? on the mower? get where I am going with this?

However, the back of these closely built townhomes is clear and has only 25-35ft or so of open grass. No back driveway, garden, gazebo, pool etc. So I do not get where you are going at all. Only more what ifs that don't match the evidence. IMO

 

[glamourkitty1922]

We should all give thanks that none of Our children nor any of Our Grandchildren, or Brothers, or Sisters, or Friends were GZ's " suspects" that shameful night.

IMO[/QUOTE]

My son would never attack a man so I don't have to worry about that.
I know that to be truth, not merely my opinion.
:blushing:

 

[miimaa]

BBM

IMO, most people assume that we don't believe Rachel because of the way she presented herself, and I would like to clear that up for myself only.

I have credibility issues with Rachel because:

1. She knew that her close friend was being watched that night, that he had contact with him, the phone went dead, and she never heard back from him... AND SHE NEVER TOLD ANYBODY.

2. She found out two days later that he was dead AND SHE NEVER TOLD ANYBODY about the phone call.

3. She continued to not say a word until the family came looking for her weeks later. WHY? It is not logical for me to believe that she just didn't want to get involved in her GOOD friend's supposed murder.

4. She lied about her name and age. She lied about why she didn't go to the funeral.

5. She never told anybody in her deposition that Trayvon said "get off, get off". WHY? Nobody asked her. I'll keep that tidbit to myself for a year and half because nobody specifically asked me. That simply doesn't make sense.

As a juror, those people have the right and job to either credit or discredit witnesses. I would seriously think about the items listed above and ask WHY?

IMO

Wish I could thank x 10 your post. I still wonder why RJ didn't call TM the next day, or the day after that? I think -- moo -- that she thought he got caught doing something. TM was there because he was suspended from school. It is not in evidence but he had a bag of jewelry and tools in his backpack at school. So if RJ was his good friend she would have know that background.