George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #7

[Nymeria]

Interesting Harmony. I have never heard anyone say that.
Going to get some earbuds out and really give it a listen, Thanks!

Tell us what you hear.

Harmony mentioned a couple days ago that she though she may have heard "Don't Shoot" in the 911 audio (I did not go back to find her exact quote, it is in thread 5 though).
I said I would check it out with earbuds. I finally got around to it during the recess.

Got to say these get harder to listen to each time.
I did hear something, I can not be sure though. I probably will try again leter.

Harmony, was it around the time the 911 operator asks whether they (voices, I think) are male or female?
I hear what could be "don't shoot", and about 2 seconds later I think I hear "oh no!"...this is all about 10-15 seconds before the gunshot.
Again folks....just saying what it COULD be to MY ears...I wish someone would clean this up and remove the operator and the caller, just let us hear the screams.

This is the one I thought I heard it on, at the 20 second mark (the Oh No! is at 22 seconds)-Audio played in court

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MJ9t12L7v8"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MJ9t12L7v8[/ame]

Also will post a couple more, one each from GZ supporters and TM supporters, to be fair-

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmHRbD0AgY0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmHRbD0AgY0[/ame]

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYxJieDtLo0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AYxJieDtLo0[/ame]


PS- Helps to close your eyes and listen, the video is distracting, IMO

 

[William N]

Very helpful link!! Thank you very much !!
He was an awfully skinny boy!! I weigh more than that!! :seeya:

Yeah right. He could have easily IMO run away from GZ as I have written several times.

 

[billiejo]

IMO common sense tells me that IF TM had a weapon of any kind he would have been using it and not his fist!
Also I have endured beatings on carpet that left wounds far surpassing GZ so his wounds have always looked extremely minor too me.
Some think it is significant that TM has no injuries from GZ hitting him.And it is significant in that it tells us that GZ didn't even try to fight back or block his blows because he went straight for his gun!
Like I said IF TM had a weapon he would have been using it so GZ logicly had to know TM had NO WEAPON!

ps.Hey George I got weekly beatings from my momma when I was ten that make your wounds look like "love pats"!

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

"God's Plan". OMG!!! GZ said this to Hannity?? Wow... :furious:

Okay not the smartest comment.. I will give you that..

However as a Christian If he is indeed one, he believes that all things work together for good and that everything is God's plan.

So if I put that together with his faith, I get it..

Just like when someone says to a woman who lost her child.. " It was God's will."

A super duper dumb thing to say but all it proves is they know how to swallow their foot. Not that they committed a crime..

OMO

 

[gracielee]

IMO - My point was that if your kid ended up dead (while he was unarmed and walking back from the 7-11) and the only person that states that your kid started the fight was the person that shot him...that scenario would cause you to blame yourself and not have any problems whatsoever with the person that shot your kid?

This is again, JMO. Having volunteered in my kids schools for over 20 years and observing first hand the degree to which parents these days go to condone the actions of their children rather then holding them responsible for their own actions, yes. If I had a troubled kid, one who got suspended from school numerous times, I'd know if my kid had the propensity to get into trouble. On the few occasions issues concerning my kids, brought to my attention, I took care of the problem immediately, so as to not let my kid get to the point where they didn't accept responsibility for their actions. I read someones remark in these threads awhile back today. I'd said the exact same words to my own kid when they were young. "Don't try to tell me so and so MADE you do something!" "Nobody but YOU are responsible for your actions." "Nobody but you can get you into trouble!" "So don't try to tell me otherwise." MOO Me personally finds it telling that when Tracy Martin couldn't locate his son the following day he called the cops to see if he'd been arrested. If one of my kids was *missing*, I never thought of calling to see if they'd been arrested. I called friends parents, hospitals, worried about a plethora of stuff, but not 'gee, has my kid been arrested.' That one never crossed my mind. MOO JMO

 

[pkz]

Tried to stay outta here and just be a ghost but I cannot do it!

MMA training includes lotsa leg work...doesn't anybody think a teenage straddling a full grown man would be thrown off?

 

[William N]

and GZ should know not to kill someone..

And if TM hadn't attacked GZ, he wouldn't have been killed IMO.

 

[billiejo]

The autopsy report stated TM height at 5'!!".

 

[shygrl]

Imo they have went through the audio with a fine tooth comb. I don't think that with the multiple experts and their equipment anything on those tapes has been missed.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

 

[csziggy]

About time we heard some factual information about the 'killer' concrete.
Hey GZ, go buy the biggest bandages you can find and put them on your head please.
How about a knuckle bandage GZ? IMO

And those come in the same box as the other oversized Band-Aids he was wearing!
http://www.cvs.com/shop/product-detail/Band-Aid-Bandages-Knuckle-And-Fingertip?skuId=127555

I guess Nurse Shellie didn't have any gauze or GZ would have showed up looking like the Mummy!

IMO

 

[Nezumi]

You know what surprises me most? If TM was pummeling GZ in the head why does he not have split knuckles....seems especially obvious since he was on the long and lean size.

Also~ sport organizations are notorious for over exaggerating size and weight, I would go with the ME's report

We haven't heard the medical examiner's testimony yet so we don't know anything about the condition of TM body or his hands or whether or not he was under the influence of an illegal substance.

 

[DIBSY]

Hour after hour of O'Mara's grating voice ( I listen and watch because I am genuinely interested in knowing how this defense operates so I can speak about it with some degree of knowledge ) ...and NOW he's changed where the injury location took place to The Edge of the sidewalk...not on the flat surface of it....but on the edge with not one whit of evidence, even George's , to back it up. He's inventing absurd scenarios to fit his wild speculation. IMO He assumes by repeating an off the wall pet theory of his, over and over and over that the jury will adopt it as gospel. He tries to wear down a witness much like they did in prison camps during the wars. IMO

 

[Karmady]

Not knowing that one is seriously injured is another matter and irrelevant to the case, IMHO, if Z didn't think he was seriously injured then why would he shoot to kill in the first place?

So he claimed he was seriously injured, or in fear of being severely hurt, i.e. it's all in his head, pardon the pun,:blushing: this is where evidence are needed to prove his claims.

IMO

I am still hoping to hear from anyone who might know if Z could scream the way as heard in the 911 call if he was being concussed?

From my own experience falling on concrete, I was stunned, dazed and sat on the ground for a while, unable to utter much at all.

The point was that it goes both ways. A person can reasonably believe they're about to be killed and not actually be killed or even seriously injured. Conversely, a person can be seriously injured and not have any idea that they are seriously injured and will die. When you are injured about the head, there's no way of knowing which way it will go. And just like George, Natasha assumed that since she got up and walked away and the doc said she was fine that she was, in fact, fine. He didn't die, but he could have, just as she did. So the fact that he didn't get significant or immediate medical care beyond what the EMT's did is not relevant to whether he believed at the time he was sustaining the injury that he was threatened with great bodily harm or death. jmo

Unless someone was also trying to beat you up after you fell on the concrete, I don't think your fall necessarily has any relevance either. In fact, I don't think it does regardless of the circumstances. And certainly doesn't prove anything at all beyond a reasonable doubt, or even by a preponderance. all jmo

 

[gracielee]

To me, 17 is a boy. He's certainly not a man. And he was barely 17 at that - I believe he was killed just about a month after his birthday.

During WW2 my father enlisted in the army at 17. They didn't think he was a boy apparently. JMO

 

[William N]

Never before and I hope never again to see a judge allow this huge degree of witness baderging on the part of the defense. Maybe Florida's laws are far more lax than those in other states but this has gotten way out of hand. IMO The idea they badgered Rachel for days was insufferable IMO
So much repetition leading NO where should be outlawed. IMO Help your client, of course , but not by devious bullying methods. IMO

This is a cross examination in a murder trial.

 

[AngelWings444]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horace Finklestein View Post
If he started a fight like TM did (imo) and was killed, I'd look in the mirror to see where I went wrong as a parent, I wouldn't blame the guy defending himself. But my kid wouldn't be out in the dark in the rain buying snacks for an unsupervised 12 year old while on a 10 day suspension from school. I'd be monitoring him like a hawk. Also, I'm not one who believes GZ was out to kill a "kid" that evening. I also wouldn't sue the HOA, but that's just me.





I agree with what Horace said. If I had a teenager that was on his third suspension from school, had been apprehended in the possession of stolen goods/jewelry, and a burglary tool, and had been sent to me by my former spouse because his behavior was in question, I would be monitoring said kid like a hawk. But then, I would have also done a lot of disciplining prior to this point. But by this time, my kid would have been on complete lockdown/restriction/grounded, not out roaming the streets after dark. JMO having raised three former teenagers, now married parents themselves.

Those alleged incidents are not coming into this trial. It's been ruled on. I don't think we should go there here, because people will bring up GZ past history of violence etc..

Until it comes into the trial, I think we should leave it alone. JMO

 

[Love Never Fails]

My husband was in a car accident in 1980 and put his head through the sunroof. He was in a coma for 10 days and still has cognitive difficulties. However, at the time of the crash, all he had was an injury to his forehead. The damage was internal and couldn't be judged by just looking at him.

If GZ was hit over and over, without defending himself, he could have been irreparably brain damaged. IMO, he was right to stop the attack when he did (and no, I am not advocating murder so don't suggest it).

Exactly. And the defense hasn't even begun its case.

 

[costalpilot]

IMO - My point was that if your kid ended up dead (while he was unarmed and walking back from the 7-11) and the only person that states that your kid started the fight was the person that shot him...that scenario would cause you to blame yourself and not have any problems whatsoever with the person that shot your kid?

what I thought would depend on what I knew about my child. his history. his predilections.

if my punk kid was involved, I would think one thing.

if my always careful, never in trouble kid was, I'd think another.

this is not opinion. this is how I think.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Hour after hour of O'Mara's grating voice ( I listen and watch because I am genuinely interested in knowing how this defense operates so I can speak about it with some degree of knowledge ) ...and NOW he's changed where the injury location took place to The Edge of the sidewalk...not on the flat surface of it....but on the edge with not one whit of evidence, even George's , to back it up. He's inventing absurd scenarios to fit his wild speculation. IMO He assumes by repeating an off the wall pet theory of his, over and over and over that the jury will adopt it as gospel. He tries to wear down a witness much like they did in prison camps during the wars. IMO

My personal opinion is in the dark and rain that night, Even GZ would not know EXACTLY where it all started and went along.. Just where it ended. It just seems normal to me that someone would have an issue with finding the exact location because it was so dark and wet and slippery... OMO

 

[Love Never Fails]

This is a cross examination in a murder trial.

And there is NO witness badgering.