Hannah Graham: Body Recovered, 18 Oct, 2014 **Awaiting Forensic Confirmation** #2

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I agree that it may be possible he was known to LE as someone who was talked to during the MH disappearance, and that this would have immediately set off a radar as soon as they identified him on the video and realized this.

However, if they were as focused on him as you believe they would have found a way to get his DNA from his trash or something - which would not have required a search warrant.

I wondered this too...what happened to the old coffee cup / cigarette butt trick we see on TV? Then again, maybe they did do this, but could not legally do anything with those results at the time...
 
I do not think LE had JLM on the short list for MH murder. If he was on short list, LE could have obtained dna by placing him under surveillance and testing a discarded straw or cig butt.

jinx, lol
 
I do not think LE had JLM on the short list for MH murder. If he was on short list, LE could have obtained dna by placing him under surveillance and testing a discarded straw or cig butt.

If they had obtained his DNA from trash or discarded cigarettes, they would have found the match and that would have been plenty to get a search warrant and more IMHO

EDIT: Sorry, I quoted the wrong post in this reply
 
Foxfire, in your opinion, does JM strike you as the "collector type", or is it hard to say? TIA
 
I totally agree except the assault charge happened before MH disappeared. I think when they didn't get the DNA in June or JUly 2009 they lost the opportunity. The law has changed, in recent years, where DNA can be obtained just for being charged with a felony...I'm not certain but in 2009 there might have been a conviction requirement before LE had the ability to obtain a DNA Sample.

I do think they were happy for him to take off/flee LE and drive recklessly enough to be charged with putting others at risk. I'm not sure if those were felony charges but if they were LE finally had charges that would legally allow them to get the DNA Sample.

Oh, yes, those were felony charges.

But, still, they let him go....all the way to Texas. :(
 
So by this logic, you are telling us that once you become accused of a crime you can never again be considered innocent???
"Innocent until proven guilty" means you are innocent and stay innocent until it is proven you aren't. If that is never proven than you remain innocent.
Maybe I am not quite understanding what you are saying here...

I'm not LI Mom or a lawyer but this is my understanding:

Yes, legally you are considered innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.

However, a not guilty verdict does not equal a judgment of innocent. It means you were not proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt as the legal standard requires.

This is the reason that the verdict is always not guilty, rather than innocent. You were not proven guilty. That doesn't mean you were proven innocent. It just means the jury did not find the proof of your guilt presented by the prosecution compelling enough to render a guilty verdict.

It is not the same thing as saying you are innocent, not at all.
 
It has also been tough for Jesse Matthew’s father, who through a friend told CBS 6 News that he is heartbroken for Hannah’s family and his own, as they come to grips with mounting serious allegations against their son who so many thought they knew.
http://wtvr.com/2014/10/20/hannah-graham-suspect-lived-near-where-human-remains-were-discovered/
Very sad to have to come to terms with the fact that your child could be a monster. I can't imagine what that would be like. I can't imagine what either family is going through. bbm
 
I do not think LE had JLM on the short list for MH murder. If he was on short list, LE could have obtained dna by placing him under surveillance and testing a discarded straw or cig butt.
True, but they would still need a legal or clean sample. I'm not sure they could arrest him based on a random discarded cig or soda cup. etc.
 
True, but they would still need a legal or clean sample. I'm not sure they could arrest him based on a random discarded cig or soda cup. etc.

Pretty sure that absolutely would be plenty to get a search warrant and probably charges.
 
So by this logic, you are telling us that once you become accused of a crime you can never again be considered innocent???
"Innocent until proven guilty" means you are innocent and stay innocent until it is proven you aren't. If that is never proven than you remain innocent.
Maybe I am not quite understanding what you are saying here...

I think it is one of many contradictions in our legal system. You are presumed innocent but are only found not guilty. The reality is that you cannot be tried again and found guilty. It's just semantics to me.
 
I wondered this too...what happened to the old coffee cup / cigarette butt trick we see on TV? Then again, maybe they did do this, but could not legally do anything with those results at the time...

That's exactly how they caught the Charlottesville rapist years ago. His straw in the McDonald's trash can.
 
BBM:

I imagine it could be possible that there are two separate scenes. One where the murder happened and a second where he left her body?
How long would it have been since that guard house/booth was in operation?

This would make sense too, imo.
 
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I think we're going to find out Jesse Matthew wasn't on anyone's radar.

He may have been interviewed as one of many, many cabbies - and they didn't have his DNA in their database to match to anything.

People tend to think LE knows everything like CSI, when that is far from the truth. Those Videos on the mall threw a monkeywench into JM's crime life.

'
 
On whether or not he's a "Collector"... It's looking like, at the very least, he's accumulating crimes/memories... A while back it was being discussed how a lot of the disappearances in VA were in the Fall, around the time school would start. I also believe (not sure) that JM's alleged rapes were often around that time of year. If - and we're being hypothetical here - JM were responsible for a good chunk of those disappearances, each in Fall, each a young, intoxicated, woman... It sounds (just sounds) like Hannah's shirt was not found with the body, but her pants were. Morgan's shirt was not with the body.

It sounds very habitual, very ritualistic. He sounds like he treats these crimes as an event that he anticipates, gets excited for... It's something he cares about. He may very well keep many, many, many trophies, not just the one or two generally kept by those types of serial killers. He could have Hannah's shirt on display somewhere and her watch/bracelet, undergarments, cell phone... Somewhere on or near his property.

Don't want to keep bringing up Mickey over and over and over, but early on, LE found her ID and Lisa Pate's ID in his apartment. They kept it quiet for months, but that was why they knew it was him. LE didn't behave as though they found very much in JM's apartment... But they certainly seemed to think, if quietly, that he was their guy.

I'll be very interested to see what information comes out in the coming months. Everyone, including me, thinks that the Cville PD was shockingly forthcoming with information. There may have been so much information that there's still plenty to come. Maybe they already knew of the link with Morgan and were pushing JM to his limits with the Hannah investigation.

Sorry for the long post! Anyway, this should be interesting.
 
I don't think ST meant to make that mistake if he did...I'm sure it was easy to get caught up in the excitement of his discovery and more than what he wanted to say just came out. He also might not have known that such details might be considered compromising to the case. I think he was just stating what he saw, bless his heart. jmo

I don't agree. He is a LE professional whose training presumably places great emphasis on what and what not to say to the media. He had to have known that revealing the details he did would be considered compromising to the case.

Now the question of why he did it is another story (i.e. excitement over the discovery), but I don't believe for one second that he didn't know the details he was revealing might compromise the case.

It's very curious.
 
'
I think we're going to find out Jesse Matthew wasn't any on anyone's radar.

He may have been interviewed as one of many, many cabbies - and they didn't have his DNA in their database to match to anything.

People tend to think LE knows everything like CSI, when that is far from the truth. Those Videos on the mall threw a monkeywench into JM's crime life.

'

Completely agree - thankfully his luck finally ran out.
 
Oh, yes, those were felony charges.

But, still, they let him go....all the way to Texas. :(

I don't think assault is a DNA Qualified felony in Virginia. The reckless driving charges were misdemeanor. But as you say, they did let him get away.
 
Foxfire, in your opinion, does JM strike you as the "collector type", or is it hard to say? TIA

Possibly, margarita25. I feel that the cyber forensics investigation likely being conducted on his internet history and cell phone will be very revealing. It also concerns me that MH's camera was never located..
 
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