Hannah Graham: Body Recovered, 18 Oct, 2014 **Awaiting Forensic Confirmation** #3

[gitana1]

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Dr. Michael Baden: (speaking on the reported condition of the body):

They have enough circumstantial evidence for probable cause, but in a Trial it may be difficult, with these conditions.

Guys, I have been in court all day so I missed it: How do we know the condition of the body that was found?

 

[sunflowerchick]

Slightly off topic..... Looking at all of these pictures I realize this is a very beautiful area. If it weren't for all the creepy things that have happened, I would almost consider living there. Even the abandoned property where she was found IMO is beautiful but sadly, now it is tarnished forever.

 

[emmanan]

For all those wondering if the recovered remains would have washed downstream from elsewhere, it occurred to me that the last big rain with potential to flood the creek in the area was last week. The landscapers account regarding the buzzards was from October 5/6.

If the body washed to the abandoned property last week during that rain, that would mean it was intact when it did so and THEN was picked clean, since the report from the finder stated the vertebrae was "long" -- it would be miraculous for a skeleton to wash downstream and land in an articulated fashion. I just don't think the timelines line up for the remains to have washed from one place to another, and the body has been laying there all along.

 

[Broadway26]

If truth be known, I do have a vulture story. I live on the Maumee river in Toledo, OH. One side of the property is surrounded by woods. During the search for Baby Elaina, I saw an abundance of vultures swarming and diving near the woods. I decided to take a hike and investigate. Sure enough, there was a dead carcass of a small animal, possibly a possum or beaver. Not a pretty site, but I felt good that I took the time to check it out. Note, this was public property, so I didn't feel as if I was trespassing. I can clearly understand why the gentleman was hesitant about spending too much time on the property where Hannah was eventually found. I give him credit for taking the time to stop and take a quick walk around. The fact that he even went a step farther and called in a tip. He is to be commended IMO.

 

[Phoebeb]

I know what cattle gates and all kinds of other gates look like. I just can't see ANYTHING, much less a gate! I have no problems seeing the house, cottage, crime scene tape, vehicles, etc, but I have looked everywhere and I can't find a gate. I know it must be there, I just can't see it!

Are you on street view when you open the link? Looks like a close up of trees and the gate's in there.

 

[mirv22]

Thanks so much, but still no luck

Does this help?

 

[Soulsad]

I've left the original posters' time and information so as not to take credit for his/her post. I did clarify the gate picture in my PSP 7 program.


Quote Originally Posted by ILOKAL View Post
I have looked and looked at every photo and map and I cannot see the gate or property being discussed. Help!

https://www.google.com/maps/@37.922...ata=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1stL24mF8kwPCOmxFd4mHw6g!2e0

 

[Concerned Mama]

For all those wondering if the recovered remains would have washed downstream from elsewhere, it occurred to me that the last big rain with potential to flood the creek in the area was last week. The landscapers account regarding the buzzards was from October 5/6.

If the body washed to the abandoned property last week during that rain, that would mean it was intact when it did so and THEN was picked clean, since the report from the finder stated the vertebrae was "long" -- it would be miraculous for a skeleton to wash downstream and land in an articulated fashion. I just don't think the timelines line up for the remains to have washed from one place to another, and the body has been laying there all along.

JMO, but I'd tend to agree. It seems more likely she was perhaps partially covered and the rains washed away the soil that had covered her in the creek bed. If the scalp had reached the "slippage" stage from decomp, maybe the run-off stream washed it off and down into the main branch of the Ammonett. Just my guessing.

I have a dry creek bed that runs along my property where I live. No water except when it rains and the runoff flows downstream to the main creek. Lots of trash and trinkets get washed onto my property during heavy rains, then left behind when the water dries away.

 

[ILOKAL]

View attachment 61798

I see nothing but trees! Can everyone else see the gate?

 

[mirv22]

Does this help?
View attachment 61800

Or this?

 

[nella]

They was a fairly high profile case in the last few months, that the the coroner did release or confirmed the identity of the victim although the autopsy was not complete at that time. Maybe different states have different procedures on when they release the identity as a possibility. Uggh...I can't think of the case, but maybe someone else will.

I don't really understand the protocol here. A friend of mine went missing earlier in the year and when her body was recovered her identity was confirmed within the hour before it was even transported despite her body being in pretty bad shape, but then I read about the Anna Smith case that happened a few weeks ago where her body was still relatively intact and it took a day or two for confirmation despite her having a distinctive tattoo.

 

[ILOKAL]

I've left the original posters' time and information so as not to take credit for his/her post. I did clarify the gate picture in my PSP 7 program.View attachment 61801


Quote Originally Posted by ILOKAL View Post
I have looked and looked at every photo and map and I cannot see the gate or property being discussed. Help!

YES!!!! NOW I see the gate! Thanks Soulsad and everyone else for helping!

 

[whiskers]

I'm lost about the gate. Can someone please catch me up why it's so important? I see the pic. It's for cattle and farm equipment.

 

[GhostGhost]

Guys, I have been in court all day so I missed it: How do we know the condition of the body that was found?

.,
The searcher that found the body said it was skeletonized.

Baden said 35 days open in the elements, in a dry creek bed.

We know he hasn't seen the body. He said he wouldn't expect to find DNA from the perpetrator in these conditions.

,

 

[Concerned Mama]

I see nothing but trees! Can everyone else see the gate?

I'm sorry, but :slap: Look at mirv's post above, #666 (oooo, how sinister!)

Sorry, I don't mean any offense. Just wondering why you can't see it. :gaah:

 

[Batman's Mommy]

I see nothing but trees! Can everyone else see the gate?

Yes. If you look where it appears there is a path, you can see just parts of the gate. It is just a common metal cattle gate with a couple of bars. They appear tan if you look. Look at the path, follow the path to the foliage, look up just a little, you should see part of it.

 

[4 Free Speech]

Try this, it's a tad more zoomed in. Street view, not aerial map

https://www.google.com/maps/@37.922...!1e1!3m2!1stL24mF8kwPCOmxFd4mHw6g!2e0!6m1!1e1

If you zoom in you can see the cattle gate. This would be enough to damage the front end of the burnt orange car. Especially if JLM was drunk (he had been to a few bars that night) we know he was familiar with the area, maybe he thought the gate would be open and it wasn't. Maybe Hannah was fighting him when she knew this was not good being so far away, and he tried to crash through the gate. I read that he had scratch marks on his face when he was arrested in TX and in the pics of him both getting off the plane and in the courtroom. Horrible to think about the last moments.

 

[TheBunk]

If you zoom in you can see the cattle gate. This would be enough to damage the front end of the burnt orange car. Especially if JLM was drunk (he had been to a few bars that night) we know he was familiar with the area, maybe he thought the gate would be open and it wasn't. Maybe Hannah was fighting him when she knew this was not good being so far away, and he tried to crash through the gate. I read that he had scratch marks on his face when he was arrested in TX and in the pics of him both getting off the plane and in the courtroom. Horrible to think about the last moments.

Where'd you read/see this?

 

[Phoebeb]

On CNN, Jean Cesarez saying this is difficult crime scene "skeletal remains were amongst the entire field in the area, and they are basically putting together a skeleton so it is taking a long time, so the net result will be that it will be processed by the chief ME here in VA." Hmm... so not intact? or what?

 

[mirv22]

I'm lost about the gate. Can someone please catch me up why it's so important? I see the pic. It's for cattle and farm equipment.

I think the primary speculation is that it could have been an entry point for JLM to dump the body. In the woods or creek.