Head blow vs strangulation

[BlueCrab]

BlueCrab, I'd like to take your points one at a time, if I may.

1. I agree that there was no intruder. But why would an exhausted six-year-old willingly accompany her nine-year-old brother down to the kitchen for a pineapple snack in the middle of the night? The children would have had to wait at least until their parents were in bed, if not longer, to do this, at which time JBR would most likely have been asleep. What we know of the relationship between JBR and BR seems like a fairly typical brother/sister relationship, in that they had the normal fights and squabbles siblings have. What would make an unwilling and tired kid get up, just because her brother wanted her to?

2. First, I've never heard 'one to two' hours as the likely digestion rate of the pineapple. Instead, I've heard 'two to four' or even 'two to five' for the pineapple to end up where it was (it wasn't in the stomach, IIRC). Second, time of death hasn't been conclusively determined, though I tend to agree that her death probably took place between midnight and 2am. Third, there's no real reason to presume her parents were both asleep when she died, especially considering that at least one of them appears to have been involved in a cover-up. Fourth, although the pineapple was found on the breakfast room table, there is no certain indication that any of it was consumed there, by JBR or anyone else.

3. This is the one that bugs me most. You, and other people, refer to the table as having an odd 'setting' (PR called it a 'setup') and conclude that since the adults in the house wouldn't have set the table this way, the children must have done so. But there is nothing to indicate that the table was ever actually 'set' in this way! Let me explain. It's Christmas, and your meals are not taken according to the usual routine. Pancakes are made late in the morning, and perhaps a bowl of pineapple ends up on the table, as a kind of accompaniment to the main dishes. Later the bowl is covered with plastic wrap or a lid (if it has one) and placed back into the fridge. This isn't the ordinary procedure; you have plastic containers, etc. But you're going out of town the next day and any food not eaten before you leave will be thrown away later, either by you or by your cleaning lady, so it doesn't seem worth the effort to clean up 'properly.' You go out to dinner at a friend's house; it's late when you return. You make a cup of tea; noticing that your son has left an empty water glass on the table, you dump the teabag into it, so you won't have to put a hot tea bag straight into the trash. Your daughter appears, ready for bed, but asking for a snack. You sigh, open the fridge, rummage around, and pull out the bowl of pineapple. You look for a spoon to dish it up with, but your daughter, trying to be helpful, has grabbed a spoon out of the drawer. It's way too big, but it doesn't matter, and you help her scoop the pineapple onto a paper plate. She asks if she can take it into the living room and watch her brother and father build a toy; you agree to the idea, tell her to throw the plate away when she's done, and head to the basement to finish wrapping gifts you're taking with you the next day.

See? No setup. No formal, "here, sit down and eat this," kind of meal. Something that probably went into and out of PR's mind until the pineapple became a crucial contradiction to the R's story that JBR was asleep when they arrived home.

4. The bowl and waterglass also contained PR's fingerprints. And BR's could have been placed on them at any time before or even after the murder; he could have fiddled with the things on the table while waiting to go to the White's house the morning of the 'kidnapping.'

There's just no evidence at all that BR and JBR were sitting at that table in the middle of the night, waiting for a third party to the 'sex game and murder' scenario.

Dru,

In this theory, Burke and JonBenet had pre-planned the late-night visit with that fifth person who showed up at the house that night. In rebuttal to your four points:

1. Children are very good at faking sleep, so I doubt that JonBenet was actually asleep when she was carried upstairs from the car around 9:30 PM or so. Everyone in the house was in bed by about 10:30 PM according to the Ramsey's version of events, so the children likely got up and went downstairs at about 11:00 or 11:30 PM. to sit at the breakfast room table, have a snack, and wait for their late-night visitor(s).

2. I did my own internet research on the digestion rate of pineapple. Eaten on an empty stomach (as was the case of JonBenet) the pineapple would have taken as little as 30 minutes and as much as 2 hours to arrive at the proximal portion (beginning) of the small intestine. Therefore, I arbitrarily selected one hour as my estimate in the JonBenet case. The estimates of others that range from 2 to 4 hours are based on the pineapple being mixed with other kinds of foods in the stomach, some which could take even longer than 4 hours to exit the stomach and enter the small intestine. The pineapple was likely consumed in the breakfast room (a separate room off from the kitchen and next to the formal dining room) because that's where the bowl of pineapple and the waterglass were sitting on the table in front of the chairs where each child normally sat.

3. IMO the strange setting at the breakfast room table (the bowl of pineapple left out all night, the big spoon, the waterglass with a tea bag in it, etc.) had children written all over it. According to the parents they had cleaned up after the Christmas late-morning pancake breakfast (the last meal eaten at the house) and there was nothing on the table when they went to bed that night. And not putting away perishables after taking them out of the refrigerator is more of a child's routine, not a parent's.

4. The security light turned off that night after being on for years; the bowl of pineapple; the waterglass with a tea bag in it; the fingerprints; a raped and murdered little girl in the basement; a weird ransom note and a ton of crime scene items missing from the house; speaks for itself. IMO there was a fifth person in the house late that night and he had been invited in by the children.

The parents are covering it up.

BlueCrab

 

[rashomon]

BlueCrab,

but if in your opinion the garrote contraption was a 'real' garrote and JB died during a kinky sex 'garroting' game, how did fibers from Patsy's jacket get in the wrappings of the garrote handle, in the paint tray where the broken paintbrush was found and on the duct tape which was put on JB's mouth?

 

[Solace]

BlueCrab,

but if in your opinion the garrote contraption was a 'real' garrote and JB died during a kinky sex 'garroting' game, how did fibers from Patsy's jacket get in the wrappings of the garrote handle, in the paint tray where the broken paintbrush was found and on the duct tape which was put on JB's mouth?

I am very interested in your answer BlueCrab.

 

[BlueCrab]

BlueCrab,

but if in your opinion the garrote contraption was a 'real' garrote and JB died during a kinky sex 'garroting' game, how did fibers from Patsy's jacket get in the wrappings of the garrote handle, in the paint tray where the broken paintbrush was found and on the duct tape which was put on JB's mouth?

rashomon,

IMO the Ramseys found JonBenet dead in the basement sometime around 1:00 to 3:00 AM, the victim of a sex crime, and spent the rest of the morning, until the 911 call at 5:52 AM, helping to stage the crime scene to look like a kidnapping. During the parents' likely hugging of JonBenet when the body was initially found, and the extensive staging activities that followed, there obviously were a lot of secondary transfers of fibers.

BlueCrab

 

[Dru]

Dru,

In this theory, Burke and JonBenet had pre-planned the late-night visit with that fifth person who showed up at the house that night. In rebuttal to your four points:

1. Children are very good at faking sleep, so I doubt that JonBenet was actually asleep when she was carried upstairs from the car around 9:30 PM or so. Everyone in the house was in bed by about 10:30 PM according to the Ramsey's version of events, so the children likely got up and went downstairs at about 11:00 or 11:30 PM. to sit at the breakfast room table, have a snack, and wait for their late-night visitor(s).

2. I did my own internet research on the digestion rate of pineapple. Eaten on an empty stomach (as was the case of JonBenet) the pineapple would have taken as little as 30 minutes and as much as 2 hours to arrive at the proximal portion (beginning) of the small intestine. Therefore, I arbitrarily selected one hour as my estimate in the JonBenet case. The estimates of others that range from 2 to 4 hours are based on the pineapple being mixed with other kinds of foods in the stomach, some which could take even longer than 4 hours to exit the stomach and enter the small intestine. The pineapple was likely consumed in the breakfast room (a separate room off from the kitchen and next to the formal dining room) because that's where the bowl of pineapple and the waterglass were sitting on the table in front of the chairs where each child normally sat.

3. IMO the strange setting at the breakfast room table (the bowl of pineapple left out all night, the big spoon, the waterglass with a tea bag in it, etc.) had children written all over it. According to the parents they had cleaned up after the Christmas late-morning pancake breakfast (the last meal eaten at the house) and there was nothing on the table when they went to bed that night. And not putting away perishables after taking them out of the refrigerator is more of a child's routine, not a parent's.

4. The security light turned off that night after being on for years; the bowl of pineapple; the waterglass with a tea bag in it; the fingerprints; a raped and murdered little girl in the basement; a weird ransom note and a ton of crime scene items missing from the house; speaks for itself. IMO there was a fifth person in the house late that night and he had been invited in by the children.

The parents are covering it up.

BlueCrab

Again, BlueCrab, I'd like to address your points one at a time.

1. Do you have children? I'm not looking for personal info about you; it's a rhetorical question. I can't imagine anyone with kids asserting that they're 'good at faking sleep.' Maybe 12, 13, 14-year olds, but before that? I've had a five, six, seven year old try to 'pretend' to be asleep; it usually lasts about 30 seconds before they giggle, twitch, or otherwise give themselves away. Yes, JBR was a 'pageant kid' and used to acting, but in those circumstances, her 'motivation' was clear, so to speak: she was trying to win. What would be her 'motivation' to remain motionless, silent, apparently asleep while being carried upstairs to bed, undressed, and put into the long johns? The promise of some pineapple with Burke later? Hardly.

Moreover, this was a child who routinely wet the bed. Even if she had been 'zonked' as PR stated, there would have been some attempt to wake her, to put her on the toilet before bed! I doubt whether the six-year-old Drew Barrymore could have acted that well, pretending to be asleep in the face of being undressed and also parents shaking her gently, murmuring to try to get her to wake up enough to use the bathroom.

Further, the 'toilet rage' people are fond of pointing out that PR usually did wake JBR to take her to the bathroom during the night--it'd be pretty hard to convince the mom who usually woke you from a sound sleep each night to take you to the bathroom that you were really, truly, sound asleep if you were actually faking!

And finally (as far as point #1 is concerned) in his first statement to police JR said the family arrived home at 10pm! This was later retracted, but I've often wondered if it wasn't the truth, or closer to it than the arrival home at 9 or so.

2. As regards the pineapple, I can only suppose that police have some reason to argue the 2-hour minimum digestion rate; maybe there's information about JBR's body that relates to this, which hasn't been released. I do know that if 30 minutes were even remotely possible, Lou Smit would have been all over that, as the chief 'bugaboo' in the case would have disappeared! No one can believe an intruder spent 2hrs with JBR before killing her; 30 minutes is quite believable! So, if this were really a possibility in JBR's specific case and given the medical information gleaned by her autopsy, why isn't Smit, or other Ramsey supporters, shouting it from the rooftops?

Now, as to the table. Yes, there's a breakfast room with a table. Yes, there's a bowl of pineapple and a glass containing only an empty tea bag on it. But tell me, what evidence is there that two children sat there and consumed anything on the night of the murder?

Where is/are the dishes the pineapple was put on? Where is/are the utensils used? Did JBR sit in front of the big bowl and use the big spoon to eat the pineapple? If she did, where are her fingerprints; where is her saliva on the spoon and mixed in with the rest of the pineapple in the bowl?

In fact, where are the sticky, pineapple fingerprints all over the table? I've fed six-year-olds; I highly doubt there wouldn't be any prints.

As regards Burke, where is the kettle he used to heat the water for the tea? Did he leave fingerprints on it, or on the stove? Were the imprint of his thumb on one side, and index finger on the other, found on the cardboard square of the teabag, if it was that type? Are his fingerprints on a sugar spoon/sugar bowl, or did a nine year old boy with a southern mama drink unsweetened tea? Are the prints of his lips on the rim of the glass? And did this child make tea and serve his sister pineapple in the middle of the night with the lights off in the kitchen?

3. I'm sorry, but I don't believe anything "according to the parents" in this case. I'd be more interested in LHP's opinion as to whether the parents, PR in particular, would be capable of leaving a bowl of pineapple on the table overnight, especially since they were leaving town early the next morning and didn't expect to be back in time to eat any of the food currently in the fridge. From what LHP has said about PR's housekeeping skills (and lack thereof) it doesn't seem outside the realm of possibility that she'd forget a bowl of pineapple put out the evening before. As for the not putting perishables away? Depends on the parent and on the situation. I've done it before, in times of stress, put something out for people to eat and forgotten it overnight. It's especially easy to do if you're unusually busy or tired, both of which PR would have been that night.

4. The security light being off for the first time in years makes you think of children? IMO, children that young wouldn't even have thought about turning it off. The pineapple I've covered. The waterglass with the teabag in it? Again, I fail to see how this suggest 'child,' since a glass of that type in which tea has been made will be too hot to be picked up by an adult, let alone a child! The fingerprints are only important in their stunning paucity; a sticky midnight snack unsupervised by parents would have been a fingerprint expert's heaven! The murdered child and ransom note suggest adults, not children, and though JBR did receive a sexual injury she wasn't 'raped' in the usual meaning of the word. Finally, for the number of missing crime scene items we have to look no further than PR's sister, and that solitary walk JR took the night of Dec. 26, when he left the Stines' house 'to be alone' for a while. It isn't necessary to invent a mythical participant in precocious sex games to account for any of these things, IMO.

 

[BlueCrab]

Dru,

Sorry, but I'm not going to rebut your rebuttal because it would be redundant since I can't go into more detail. I told you my theory; it's plausible; and it fits the evidence.

BlueCrab

 

[Toltec]

rashomon,

IMO the Ramseys found JonBenet dead in the basement sometime around 1:00 to 3:00 AM, the victim of a sex crime, and spent the rest of the morning, until the 911 call at 5:52 AM, helping to stage the crime scene to look like a kidnapping. During the parents' likely hugging of JonBenet when the body was initially found, and the extensive staging activities that followed, there obviously were a lot of secondary transfers of fibers.

BlueCrab

If Patsy and John discovered JonBenet in the wee hours of the morning...then what was Patsy doing wearing her Christmas sweater? I would think she would be wearing a robe.

The fibers from Patsy's sweater were discovered tangled in the garrote..and in the paint tote. Since her paintbrush was used to fashion the garrote...it stands to reason it was she who grabbed the brush.

One thing is certain...the cord around JonBenet's neck was staging. Her hair, necklace, and Patsy's fibers are entangled in the garrote. This cord was placed on JonBenet while she layed unconcious from the head blow. There is so much hair entangled in the cord and knot that she would have screamed bloody murder. I'm not talking one scream....but a constant screaming and crying. "OUCH"

 

[Dru]

Dru,

Sorry, but I'm not going to rebut your rebuttal because it would be redundant since I can't go into more detail. I told you my theory; it's plausible; and it fits the evidence.

BlueCrab

I appreciate your efforts, BlueCrab. As I said somewhere way above, I respect all posters and their theories, which show lots of effort and creative thinking.

All due respect, then, but I don't find your theory particularly plausible without some corroborating evidence that a) BR was extremely precocious and b) there actually was some other person in the house that night. (I'm also unsure which of the minors you think were involved struck the head blow; this is where some technical analysis of the evidence might be handy, regarding whether or not the direction and force of the blow are consistent with the ability of a minor child, who wasn't that much taller than JBR, IIRC.)

I also don't find that it fits the evidence. Like I said, where's the evidence of sticky fingerprints in the kitchen, or a tea kettle on the stove bearing BR's prints? (If he, or the adult stagers, were careful enough to wipe down and put away a kettle, why in heaven's name did they overlook the pineapple bowl?) Where's the evidence that JBR was actually 'tied up' with the wrist ligatures, when her wrists didn't show any signs that she'd struggled against them? Where's the evidence that any sexual activity was actually taking place, aside from the single, carefully placed sexual wound inflicted on JBR? Again, I don't want to be too graphic, but if some 'crazy mixed-up kids' thought a bondage/EA scenario would bring them gratification, where's the evidence that any, ahem, gratification occurred? For all their unchildlike careful planning, these kids seemed to be singularly unsuccessful at the 'sex' part of the 'sex game.'

In fact, my main objections to the scenario still stand: the time element, the ransom note, the presence of the 'unknown person' in the house, the lack of evidence of 'gratification,' (which, btw, is also an objection to the 'unknown pedophile' scenarios out there), BR's continued silence, and the State of Colorado's willingness to participate in the Karr debacle, something I think they'd avoid if they had the evidence/knowledge of the 'real' killer, but couldn't do anything about it because the 'real' killer was a minor.

 

[BlueCrab]

I appreciate your efforts, BlueCrab. As I said somewhere way above, I respect all posters and their theories, which show lots of effort and creative thinking.

All due respect, then, but I don't find your theory particularly plausible without some corroborating evidence that a) BR was extremely precocious and b) there actually was some other person in the house that night. (I'm also unsure which of the minors you think were involved struck the head blow; this is where some technical analysis of the evidence might be handy, regarding whether or not the direction and force of the blow are consistent with the ability of a minor child, who wasn't that much taller than JBR, IIRC.)

I also don't find that it fits the evidence. Like I said, where's the evidence of sticky fingerprints in the kitchen, or a tea kettle on the stove bearing BR's prints? (If he, or the adult stagers, were careful enough to wipe down and put away a kettle, why in heaven's name did they overlook the pineapple bowl?) Where's the evidence that JBR was actually 'tied up' with the wrist ligatures, when her wrists didn't show any signs that she'd struggled against them? Where's the evidence that any sexual activity was actually taking place, aside from the single, carefully placed sexual wound inflicted on JBR? Again, I don't want to be too graphic, but if some 'crazy mixed-up kids' thought a bondage/EA scenario would bring them gratification, where's the evidence that any, ahem, gratification occurred? For all their unchildlike careful planning, these kids seemed to be singularly unsuccessful at the 'sex' part of the 'sex game.'

In fact, my main objections to the scenario still stand: the time element, the ransom note, the presence of the 'unknown person' in the house, the lack of evidence of 'gratification,' (which, btw, is also an objection to the 'unknown pedophile' scenarios out there), BR's continued silence, and the State of Colorado's willingness to participate in the Karr debacle, something I think they'd avoid if they had the evidence/knowledge of the 'real' killer, but couldn't do anything about it because the 'real' killer was a minor.

Dru,

May we have the pleasure of knowing YOUR theory re' what happened at the Ramsey's house on Christmas night? Thank you.

BlueCrab

 

[BlueCrab]

If Patsy and John discovered JonBenet in the wee hours of the morning...then what was Patsy doing wearing her Christmas sweater? I would think she would be wearing a robe.

The fibers from Patsy's sweater were discovered tangled in the garrote..and in the paint tote. Since her paintbrush was used to fashion the garrote...it stands to reason it was she who grabbed the brush.

One thing is certain...the cord around JonBenet's neck was staging. Her hair, necklace, and Patsy's fibers are entangled in the garrote. This cord was placed on JonBenet while she layed unconcious from the head blow. There is so much hair entangled in the cord and knot that she would have screamed bloody murder. I'm not talking one scream....but a constant screaming and crying. "OUCH"

Toltec,

Why was Patsy still fully dressed when she and John discovered the body in the wee hours of the morning? Excellent question. And we can add that Patsy was still fully dressed when she made the 911 call at 5:52 AM.

WHY was she still fully dressed, makeup and all? Perhaps the answer is Patsy never went to bed that night. And, in fact, maybe she had just gotten back home after spending several hours with a male admirer. That's how neighborhood rumor has it.

In regard to the fibers from Patsy's jacket being in the knots of the EA device and on the duct tape, they are most likely secondary transfers. For instance, there were hundreds of microscopic fibers on the duct tape. Four of the fibers were consistent with the fibers of Patsy's jacket. Microscopic fibers float in the air, are everywhere in a house, and can easily lodge themselves into the crevices of the knots of a nylon cord and on a piece of duct tape that has been tossed to the floor at least several times. The secondary transfers would be especially likely have happened after discovering and hugging the dead child and after participating in the elaborate staging needed to make a sex murder look like a kidnap murder.

BlueCrab

 

[tumble]

Toltec,

Why was Patsy still fully dressed when she and John discovered the body in the wee hours of the morning? Excellent question. And we can add that Patsy was still fully dressed when she made the 911 call at 5:52 AM.

WHY was she still fully dressed, makeup and all? Perhaps the answer is Patsy never went to bed that night. And, in fact, maybe she had just gotten back home after spending several hours with a male admirer. That's how neighborhood rumor has it.

In regard to the fibers from Patsy's jacket being in the knots of the EA device and on the duct tape, they are most likely secondary transfers. For instance, there were hundreds of microscopic fibers on the duct tape. Four of the fibers were consistent with the fibers of Patsy's jacket. Microscopic fibers float in the air, are everywhere in a house, and can easily lodge themselves into the crevices of the knots of a nylon cord and on a piece of duct tape that has been tossed to the floor at least several times. The secondary transfers would be especially likely have happened after discovering and hugging the dead child and after participating in the elaborate staging needed to make a sex murder look like a kidnap murder.

BlueCrab

BlueCrab, it seems that you rule out that PR helped in the staging. Do you think BR hid JB in the winecellar by himself or with the help of a friend?

How does it come then that the winecellar door was latched?
For BR to latch that door he would have to climb a chair or something.

 

[Solace]

rashomon,

IMO the Ramseys found JonBenet dead in the basement sometime around 1:00 to 3:00 AM, the victim of a sex crime, and spent the rest of the morning, until the 911 call at 5:52 AM, helping to stage the crime scene to look like a kidnapping. During the parents' likely hugging of JonBenet when the body was initially found, and the extensive staging activities that followed, there obviously were a lot of secondary transfers of fibers.

BlueCrab

I knew Blue Crab would have an answer.

 

[Nuisanceposter]

So how did the Ramseys discover something terrible had happened to JonBenet? They found the note? They found the body? Burke told them? Who came up with the kidnapping scenario? How do the too-big underwear fit in?

 

[BlueCrab]

BlueCrab, it seems that you rule out that PR helped in the staging.

tumble,

No, I don't rule out Patsy as helping with the staging. IMO that's how the secondary tranfers from her jacket occurred.

BlueCrab

 

[rashomon]

rashomon,

IMO the Ramseys found JonBenet dead in the basement sometime around 1:00 to 3:00 AM, the victim of a sex crime, and spent the rest of the morning, until the 911 call at 5:52 AM, helping to stage the crime scene to look like a kidnapping. During the parents' likely hugging of JonBenet when the body was initially found, and the extensive staging activities that followed, there obviously were a lot of secondary transfers of fibers.

BlueCrab

But a sexual predator garroting scene is something totally different from a kidnapping scene.
Patsy's fibers were found inside the multiple wrappings of the a garrote handle, from which one can draw the inference that it was she who wrapped the garrote around JB's neck.
The same can be said of the paint tray, in which both the broken paintbrush and fibers from Patsy's jacket were found. This points to Patsy as being the one who broke that paintbrush and jabbed it into JB's vagina.

 

[UKGuy]

But a sexual predator garroting scene is something totally different from a kidnapping scene.
Patsy's fibers were found inside the multiple wrappings of the a garrote handle, from which one can draw the inference that it was she who wrapped the garrote around JB's neck.
The same can be said of the paint tray, in which both the broken paintbrush and fibers from Patsy's jacket were found. This points to Patsy as being the one who broke that paintbrush and jabbed it into JB's vagina.

rashomon,

broke that paintbrush and jabbed it into JB's vagina.

Why would Patsy break a paintbrush and jab it inside JonBenet, also who said JonBenet was assaulted with a paintbrush?

It may have been John or Burke or any other party who did this?


.

 

[Solace]

rashomon,


Why would Patsy break a paintbrush and jab it inside JonBenet, also who said JonBenet was assaulted with a paintbrush?

It may have been John or Burke or any other party who did this?


.

Steve Thomas says that splinters from the paintbrush were found inside JB. The only reason I can think of for Patsy doing this is to STAGE the scene so that it looks like an intruder did it. Why do you think she would not do this?

 

[BlueCrab]

So how did the Ramseys discover something terrible had happened to JonBenet? They found the note? They found the body? Burke told them? Who came up with the kidnapping scenario? How do the too-big underwear fit in?

Nuisanceposter,

IMO, the parents found the body between 1 and 3 AM, although the note could have been written and placed on the stairs prior to them finding the body only if they had found the body closer to 3 AM. Therefore, I lean toward 3 AM because of the time constraints. Plus, it appears much of the staging had already been completed by the time the parents found the body.

The over-sized 12/14 underwear found on JonBenet indicates to me the perps didn't know where her size 6 underwear was kept. IMO they had cleaned up JonBenet to hide the sexual aspects and wanted to put fresh underwear on the body. They were trying to make the crime look like a kidnapping gone bad, but they didn't know her underwear drawer was in the bathroom. The only underwear they found in her bedroom was the new package of size 12/14's, so that's what they used.

Patsy was not yet involved in the staging at this point because, of course, she would have known where the size 6 panties were kept. The size 6 panties removed from JonBenet are missing from the crime scene and, IMO, were carried out of the house by the mysterious fifth person who had been let in that night and who could be the killer.

BlueCrab

 

[UKGuy]

Steve Thomas says that splinters from the paintbrush were found inside JB. The only reason I can think of for Patsy doing this is to STAGE the scene so that it looks like an intruder did it. Why do you think she would not do this?

Solace,

Sure, thats what Steve Thomas says, Coroner Meyer refers only to birefringent foreign material, nowhere is there any reference to a genital injury sustained by a paintbrush assault.

If Steve Thomas is correct and its not another inferred assumption, then he knows more than he has made public.


.

 

[Solace]

Solace,

Sure, thats what Steve Thomas says, Coroner Meyer refers only to birefringent foreign material, nowhere is there any reference to a genital injury sustained by a paintbrush assault.

If Steve Thomas is correct and its not another inferred assumption, then he knows more than he has made public.


.

He does not say anything about assault. He does say "A 1 cm. red-purple area of abrasion is located on the right posterolateral area of the 1 x 1 cm hymenal orifice. The area of abrasion is present at approximately the 7:00 position..... and on.

So we can assume that something did this. It could have been a person's finger, it could have been the end of a paint brush or it could have been douching on a daily basis.

What do you think it was?