Holly Bobo, missing from TN 2014 discussion #4 ***ARRESTS***

[shefner]

"JP is probably a person with some knowledge simply due to his brother's involvement."

Wait, what "involvement" is being surmised here, or assumed?

MP hasn't been charged with any role in Holly's abduction or homicide.

For all we know, MP's total "involvement" may have been as benign as being present in a recorded conversation when ZA and JA one day said something about Holly.

But from what has been submitted to justify the arrests, there hasn't been a single allegation that either did anything to Holly. Just something supposedly to do with a (perhaps-mythical) video that somehow is said to pertain to Holly, and that no will (or can) give to the police.

The involvement I am surmising is whatever involvement MP has been arrested for...and I don't consider being present in a recorded conversation about Holly "benign." Each one of these witnesses makes me angry. Apparently, many people in the Darden and Parsons areas had knowledge, whether rumor or not, about what happened to Holly and yet, as far as we know, none of them took that information to authorities. Whatever the reason, there is no excuse for it.

I never said the MP or JP did anything directly related to Holly's actual disappearance. We have very little information as to what the investigators have against these brothers...or the others arrested. But if MP or JP tampered with evidence or failed to give information they had about this crime, then that is wrong.

 

[shefner]

My opinions only, no facts here:

When I think about the main jailed suspect, the second jailed suspect (the big guy), the younger brother of the main suspect, the informant, and the two new brothers, etc., I become dazed and confused and my mind wanders back to the FBI description of the kidnapper and Holly's brother's observations.

We have a kidnapping suspect who does not closely resemble either of the two jailed suspects; this unknown male apparently knew Holly well enough to talk and argue with her for maybe ten minutes or more, before leading her into the woods. This does not sound like a crazed drug-fueled kidnapping. If we did not know any of this other stuff about the "unlucky six", I believe that we would be theorizing about a troubled young man who was obsessed with Holly and trying in some bizarre and confused way to convince her to accept him. And failing that, he became more belligerent, forceful, violent, and panicky; eventually leading her away.

Remember, we have as much as 15 minutes between the initial scream and the event of Holly being led into the woods by the unidentified suspect. And after all that time, Holly is still burdened with her purse, lunch sack, cell phone, etc. Basically, she is carrying everything she left the house with.

In 99 out of a 100 female abductions, the victim would be immediately grabbed and taken out-of-sight and loose personal items would be dropped or ripped loose at the abduction scene, or at the least- tossed out a vehicle window within a mile or two of the abduction. In my opinion, something very odd happened that day, something that is yet to be fully comprehended.

Thank you for this post, Mr. Noatak. I have stated from the start that 15-20 minutes is a lifetime in terms of abductions. We know that Clint actually heard conversation going on between the abductor and Holly. He had time to make and receive phone calls by the time he saw Holly being led into the woods. So this type of abduction is an oddity considering how much time elapsed.

 

[SteveS]

But if MP or JP tampered with evidence or failed to give information they had about this crime, then that is wrong.

I would agree. IF.

 

[SteveS]

We have very little information as to what the investigators have against these brothers...or the others arrested.

We do know what they were arrested for, and what was offered in the legal filing as the basis to justify their arrest. Hopefully that's not everything, but it still offers a lot of insight into the core of what's being alleged and why - sometimes from what's there, sometimes from what's not.

 

[SteveS]

My opinions only, no facts here:

When I think about the main jailed suspect, the second jailed suspect (the big guy), the younger brother of the main suspect, the informant, and the two new brothers, etc., I become dazed and confused and my mind wanders back to the FBI description of the kidnapper and Holly's brother's observations.

We have a kidnapping suspect who does not closely resemble either of the two jailed suspects; this unknown male apparently knew Holly well enough to talk and argue with her for maybe ten minutes or more, before leading her into the woods. This does not sound like a crazed drug-fueled kidnapping. If we did not know any of this other stuff about the "unlucky six", I believe that we would be theorizing about a troubled young man who was obsessed with Holly and trying in some bizarre and confused way to convince her to accept him. And failing that, he became more belligerent, forceful, violent, and panicky; eventually leading her away.

Remember, we have as much as 15 minutes between the initial scream and the event of Holly being led into the woods by the unidentified suspect. And after all that time, Holly is still burdened with her purse, lunch sack, cell phone, etc. Basically, she is carrying everything she left the house with.

In 99 out of a 100 female abductions, the victim would be immediately grabbed and taken out-of-sight and loose personal items would be dropped or ripped loose at the abduction scene, or at the least- tossed out a vehicle window within a mile or two of the abduction. In my opinion, something very odd happened that day, something that is yet to be fully comprehended.

Thanks for this. It's an interesting angle to think through what's been said.

I've wondered several times about that initial interaction.

The extended time spent there, and the fact there was a conversation, certainly strongly implies she was interacting with someone she knew.

Also, the words that her brother heard her say, "No. Why?" - - those are conversational words, not ones of distress. It's early in the morning, she's on the way out, and yet she's engaging in a talk?

I think her words also give a bit of a hint. She was apparently asked a somewhat routine yes-no question, so easy as to quickly snap off a reply and then ask "why do you ask?" (that's how it appears to me). Again, the routine question to which she provided a simple answer, and then a question in reply, would seem to infer some familiarity.

Did your dad just call you? Have you talked to your boyfriend today? Have you seen your dog this morning? Did your mom tell you I was coming by?

So it makes it seem like either their suspect list is amiss, as neither JA or ZA would seem to fit either the physical profile or the relational profile, or, there is at least one other key participant in this stuff that is still to be identified.

 

[shefner]

In my mind I could hear the perp saying, "Do you know why I'm here?"
With Holly responding, "No, why?"

I believe ZA was the abductor. But I also believe he had some help in doing this...and covering his tracks. Which method did he use to remove Holly from the home? I am judging they went through the woods since her lunch bag was found there along with papers. The mention of a 4-wheeler makes some sense, although I don't know how easy it would be get through a wooded area on one. I know there was a wide path but I don't know how far it ran.

Some folks who live in the area said it would have been easy enough for the perp to get Holly through those woods onto an adjoining roadway, where a vehicle was waiting for them. Pure evil.

 

[Hatfield]

Thanks for this. It's an interesting angle to think through what's been said.

I've wondered several times about that initial interaction.

The extended time spent there, and the fact there was a conversation, certainly strongly implies she was interacting with someone she knew.

Also, the words that her brother heard her say, "No. Why?" - - those are conversational words, not ones of distress. It's early in the morning, she's on the way out, and yet she's engaging in a talk?

I think her words also give a bit of a hint. She was apparently asked a somewhat routine yes-no question, so easy as to quickly snap off a reply and then ask "why do you ask?" (that's how it appears to me). Again, the routine question to which she provided a simple answer, and then a question in reply, would seem to infer some familiarity.

Did your dad just call you? Have you talked to your boyfriend today? Have you seen your dog this morning? Did your mom tell you I was coming by?

So it makes it seem like either their suspect list is amiss, as neither JA or ZA would seem to fit either the physical profile or the relational profile, or, there is at least one other key participant in this stuff that is still to be identified.

It really is bizarre the way it was described as she was led off into the woods. From what I recall, I think it was even stated that they were "walking" off together which implied she was not struggling or fighting or being dragged off.

And we also have the kneeling down together which is bizarre as well. However, we cannot forget the scream(s) heard by the nearby neighbor. Those screams imply at some point she was aware the situation was not good and she was fighting at that point I believe.

Now if she was first punched or hit with something right at first, then perhaps that could have caused her to be kneeling down and maybe the perp(s) talked her into leaving with him so he would not hurt her anymore.
That could explain some of it.

But then we have some evidence being scattered about and the phone parts on the road. Just really bizarre that so much evidence was found away from the point of abduction.

I have also wondered if maybe there were more than 1 person near her garage and maybe the brother only saw 1 at a time but maybe there really was 2. It could explain the different descriptions of the perp. Like maybe he first saw person 1 and then that person went to retrieve the vehicle and then he saw person 2 lead her away.

I could see a situation where he may have only seen 1 at a time thinking it was only 1 person when maybe a 2nd person was there. Looking out a window only gives a small view and there is not much left or right viewing. The 2nd person could have been out of view and if 1 left while the other walked her away then maybe there were 2 actually there for a certain period of time. Or maybe even 3.

Its all so confusing right now. Hopefully all the answers will be found out by LE.

 

[Nana46]

I did a search again today for Mark Pearcy to see about his hearing...vinelink still not listing him.........hmm

ETA: at an undisclosed location.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

I did a search again today for Mark Pearcy to see about his hearing...vinelink still not listing him.........hmm

ETA: at an undisclosed location.

:seeya: I could not find anything either except for what was tweeted by Chris Conte on June 20:


https://twitter.com/chrisconte : @ Chris Conte · Jun 20

District Attorney tells us court appearance for #hollybobo suspect Mark Pearcy on Monday is canceled. Charges moved to Jackson @NC5



Hmmm ... I wonder WHAT is going on with MP ?

 

[Nana46]

:seeya: I could not find anything either except for what was tweeted by Chris Conte on June 20:


https://twitter.com/chrisconte : @ Chris Conte · Jun 20

District Attorney tells us court appearance for #hollybobo suspect Mark Pearcy on Monday is canceled. Charges moved to Jackson @NC5



Hmmm ... I wonder WHAT is going on with MP ?

I cannot imagine...they moved him but the tweets all said Jackson....so I assumed they meant Jackson,Tn until I googled and found out there is a Jackson County in Tn. I think I am gonna tweet some of these folks and see if they will answer.

I tweeted Chris Conte..will post here if he answers.

 

[Hatfield]

:seeya: I could not find anything either except for what was tweeted by Chris Conte on June 20:


https://twitter.com/chrisconte : @ Chris Conte · Jun 20

District Attorney tells us court appearance for #hollybobo suspect Mark Pearcy on Monday is canceled. Charges moved to Jackson @NC5



Hmmm ... I wonder WHAT is going on with MP ?

It really is strange he seems to have been moved. If a list is made of all the possible reasons a person would be moved would that help narrow down the reason.

Listing some possible reasons I can think of.

-Personal Safety - like if he was threatened or if he is going to become a states witness

-By Request - of someone like his attorney or by the state itself

-To be closer to a courthouse where he will have to appear soon

 

[Morag]

It really is strange he seems to have been moved. If a list is made of all the possible reasons a person would be moved would that help narrow down the reason.

Listing some possible reasons I can think of.

-Personal Safety - like if he was threatened or if he is going to become a states witness

-By Request - of someone like his attorney or by the state itself

-To be closer to a courthouse where he will have to appear soon

Or to put him in with someone who might get a jailhouse confession from him?

 

[dog.gone.cute]

It really is strange he seems to have been moved. If a list is made of all the possible reasons a person would be moved would that help narrow down the reason.

Listing some possible reasons I can think of.

-Personal Safety - like if he was threatened or if he is going to become a states witness

-By Request - of someone like his attorney or by the state itself

-To be closer to a courthouse where he will have to appear soon

- Or to put him in with someone who might get a jailhouse confession from him?

Adding :


- Keep him separated from other perps who have been indicted/charged with Holly's abduction/murder, or keep him separated from those who have not yet been indicted/charged with info on Holly's abduction/murder...

:twocents:

 

[OldSteve]

My opinions only, no facts here:

When I think about the main jailed suspect, the second jailed suspect (the big guy), the younger brother of the main suspect, the informant, and the two new brothers, etc., I become dazed and confused and my mind wanders back to the FBI description of the kidnapper and Holly's brother's observations.

We have a kidnapping suspect who does not closely resemble either of the two jailed suspects; this unknown male apparently knew Holly well enough to talk and argue with her for maybe ten minutes or more, before leading her into the woods. This does not sound like a crazed drug-fueled kidnapping. If we did not know any of this other stuff about the "unlucky six", I believe that we would be theorizing about a troubled young man who was obsessed with Holly and trying in some bizarre and confused way to convince her to accept him. And failing that, he became more belligerent, forceful, violent, and panicky; eventually leading her away.

Remember, we have as much as 15 minutes between the initial scream and the event of Holly being led into the woods by the unidentified suspect. And after all that time, Holly is still burdened with her purse, lunch sack, cell phone, etc. Basically, she is carrying everything she left the house with.

In 99 out of a 100 female abductions, the victim would be immediately grabbed and taken out-of-sight and loose personal items would be dropped or ripped loose at the abduction scene, or at the least- tossed out a vehicle window within a mile or two of the abduction. In my opinion, something very odd happened that day, something that is yet to be fully comprehended.

Good points!

I think a link to your timeline (it's in two parts) would be good at this point, so:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10473334&highlight=timeline#post10473334

What would be important to know is the exact time she screamed in the context of the 15 minutes she and her abductor were "talking". My guess - he's trying to convince her to go with him, and she is NOT buying whatever reason or ruse given --- failing that he cuts her, threatening to do more if she doesn't comply...

She may not have known this person, may never have met him before, but he holds her attention simply by mentioning others or events they knew of.... by catching her off guard, she might have figured he would simply go away if she humored him a bit - like getting rid of a pesky salesman...

 

[rob]

I always wonder why people think they know everything that LE knows. I think they usually keep things quiet, unless they want it to be known, especially when they are still gathering up players in the crime and cover-up.

MOO only

 

[dog.gone.cute]

My opinions only, no facts here:

When I think about the main jailed suspect, the second jailed suspect (the big guy), the younger brother of the main suspect, the informant, and the two new brothers, etc., I become dazed and confused and my mind wanders back to the FBI description of the kidnapper and Holly's brother's observations.

...

In my opinion, something very odd happened that day, something that is yet to be fully comprehended.

Respectfully Snipped:


RBBM: Exactly ... and I totally agree !

JMO but there is "something" definitely "missing" ...

But "what" one can only speculate !

:moo:

:seeya: And Thanks, Mr. N ! Always appreciate hearing from you !

 

[Nana46]

From Twitter:

CC ‏@courtchatter 5m

Court appearance today for Mark Pearcy in the #hollybobo case has been canceled.

 

[reedus23]

My concern is that over time, the pressure gets hotter on them to do something, and the heat gets turned up.

Then at some point, if they still don't really have enough, they may decide to "do something" to take the pressure off. Arrests bring praise, and thoughts that they are diligent - - even if they are bad arrests.

That's why, after all this time, I'm not as blindly trusting that all of these are good arrests. You would hope that more time spent making an arrest means a better case, but it could be just the opposite.

And they know that while the arrest certainly is going to ruin a defendant, no matter how the trial ends, rarely does an unmerited arrest backfire. If the arrested guy walks at trial because the case was crap, in most cases the defendant is impoverished, people look at him suspiciously even if he is completely innocent ("they wouldn't arrest him unless he was guilty of something," the thinking goes), but LE can usually fall back on the line that "We did our job but the jury screwed up."

Disagree. Prosecutors are too worried about their conviction rates to file charges without first being confident they can obtain a conviction. Failing to convict has some blowback on them as well in the form of losing their job. I would imagine this is even more so in high profile cases such as this. They aren't going to all of a sudden file charges all these years later just to get the pressure off their back or to get a pat on the back. That argument might hold more water if it was done way back when, when the talk of the A-Train first started.

And I don't think anyone is blindly trusting these were good arrests. First, they were good arrests or they wouldn't have been signed off on when arrest warrants were sought. Second, they wouldn't have gotten past a grand jury if they weren't good arrests. Now will they result in convictions? Only time will tell. Until then, I don't see one thing wrong with "sleuthing" any of the arrested or trying to piece together theories/possibilities. That is kind of what we do here. You want to question the arrests...that's fine. Others want to wonder what involvement they may have had with Holly....fine as well.

 

[shefner]

If I recall correctly, LE said during the initial search that there "is more going on here than meets the eye," or something to that effect. I need to look it up to get the exact wording. We discussed at length what the officer might have meant by that statement.

I do believe we do not know the entire story yet. And may not until trial.

 

[reedus23]

The involvement I am surmising is whatever involvement MP has been arrested for...and I don't consider being present in a recorded conversation about Holly "benign." Each one of these witnesses makes me angry. Apparently, many people in the Darden and Parsons areas had knowledge, whether rumor or not, about what happened to Holly and yet, as far as we know, none of them took that information to authorities. Whatever the reason, there is no excuse for it.

I never said the MP or JP did anything directly related to Holly's actual disappearance. We have very little information as to what the investigators have against these brothers...or the others arrested. But if MP or JP tampered with evidence or failed to give information they had about this crime, then that is wrong.

I will add that at this point I don't think there is one thing wrong with questioning if they actually had anything more directly to do with Holly. In fact, without having any facts to support it beyond what we all already know, my gut feeling and opinion is that they probably do have dirtier hands than is being let on.