IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #22

[georger]

I agree with much of the above.

One thing both sites have in common is that they are very close to places that have been used by teen partiers. Maiden Lane is just a stone's throw from the bike trail around Meyer's Lake and the dead end close to where the girls' bodies were found is also known as a teen party spot.

In any case, both known crime sites scream local knowledge.

Law enforcement has said that neither family is suspected. But that doesn't mean it couldn't have been someone with a casual connection, such as seeing one or both girls at the store, being connected through any community or church group they attended, etc.

I look at the place the bicycles were found and I think the perp was standing in the trail and when one girl tried to ride by, he just stepped over, grabbed her by the arm or hair and yanked her off her bicycle. When I was a kid, there was a little patch of woods that we rode through and a couple kids thought it was fun to ambush the rest of us in just that manner. A 60 pound kid can yank a 120 pound kid off a bicycle that way quite easily, it's the sideways pull that does it.

If the perp had physical control over one girl (grabbing her by the arm or hair), I think the other girl would be easy to control and overall, it would actually be easier to abduct two than it would to abduct one. Threatening one kid would keep the other under control. You can tell people that if their buddy is threatened, the best thing they can do is run for help but how many people could do that? How many adults, let alone children? I know it is the best strategy in theory but if I were standing there watching some guy hold a knife to my cousin's throat I don't know that I could actually force myself to run away. I hope I could but I can't say for sure that I could.

And if he failed? He'd just let go and run away, as we've seen in so many cases of suspected abduction attempts. The abductor isn't risking much so long as they have some method of getting away quickly. In this case, it would be a vehicle hidden on Maiden Lane.

I agree with most of this - some people will do anything due to drugs, if
that is behind this. The kids always suffer. Families get ruined. Its a
nightmare ... not saying this is involved in this case but it could be.

I missed the drug culture in my rural area growing up. Today the area is
flowing with drugs! I NEVER would have imaged such a thing possible.

Again, Im not saying drugs are behind this - I have no way whatever of
knowing - ........ you get where Im coming from.

Maybe there will be news tomorrow. Our prayers go with this family and
those in LE trying to help. I hope they get to the bottom of this soon.
Night.

G.

 

[TeenyTaurus]

I know most criminals are not real bright but it would take an even dimmer criminal than most to commit a crime such as murdering two girls if he thought he was going to be caught.

That's the problem with stiffer penalties in general: the vast majority of criminals don't expect to get caught. That's why they do things like wear gloves, make sure there are no witnesses, etc.

Oh well, every governmental body has a version of a village idiot in it and I guess we've revealed who Iowa's governmental idiot is. One of the virtues of a free press is the right of the politician to make a fool of themself and be published for it.

:silly: omg, that made my night!

 

[Foxfire]

Repost for info: (snipped for relevance)

7 Bridges had been a full-fledged park at one time but county officials ceased maintaining it several years ago.
“It’s not really a park anymore, more of a hunting access,” Riley said (Neighbor). “Usually pretty quiet.”
Other residents said it is popular for fishing, mushroom hunting and underage beer parties.

The park has been used to dispose of evidence in the past. In November 2007, Martaves Keys went to the park to get rid of the gun he used to kill Anissa Schroeder and Ronald Scullark in Waterloo and burn his bloody clothing. A search diver recovered the weapon from the Wapsipinicon River after a witness came forward.

... the odds of finding missing persons’ remains — or evidence of other crimes — increase during the shotgun deer season, when more than 70,000 hunters comb through remote woods and fields. More Iowans are afield during the two shotgun deer seasons (Dec. 1-5 and Dec. 8-16) than at any other time of the year.
... it is not uncommon for outdoors enthusiasts to play a role in law enforcement efforts
... kayakers found the body of 5-year-old Evelyn Miller in the Cedar River in 2005
... anglers and boaters often discover the bodies of drowning victims.
... deer hunters have also found evidence of meth labs”

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_394b71f6-3f2c-11e2-8ae9-0019bb2963f4.html

RE: More Iowans are afield during the two shotgun deer seasons (Dec. 1-5 and Dec 8 - 16)

B4igo2it, thanx for sharing. This adds credence to the theory that the hunters were 'still hunting', as opposed to stalk hunting. For folks that aren't familiar with hunting terminology, these descriptive names may be confusing. Still hunters slowly and methodically approach an area from the downwind side of the area to hunt, paying close attention to tracks, trails, and other signs. and cover a lot of ground. A stalk hunter would hunt from a stand or fixed position scanning a specific area for movement.

It was mentioned earlier that the COD may be from a gunshot. If the bodys were placed there soon after the abduction. Imo, unless a silencer was used, this is unlikely due to the loud noise bringing unwanted attention to the perp. Gunshots would be very suspicious in July. Due to the age & size of the girls, a knife, blunt force trauma, or strangulation would be much more likely, imo.

If there are any locals viewing/posting that are familiar with the 7 bridges area. Are there any sheds, barns, abandoned houses, or other structures in the general area of the body dump? TIA

Although the cancellation date of the plea agreement, being one day before the abduction, is a very suspicious coincidence leading one to conclude that the motive has a drug connection. If this abduction was a drug revenge killing. It is likely that their remains would have not been located, imo.
An opportunist abduction by a sexual predator is indicated due to the location and method of body disposal, imo..

 

[hollyblue]

All I see is farmland and the city of Readlyn to the west of the area. A few barns or farm houses/homes scattered but large acre farms with fields then the woods around 7 bridges. I think that after the perp(s) left Evansdales city limits, it's pretty much out in the open with scattered homes or whatever here and there. Locals would know better, I'm basing my facts on possibly an antiquated google map at the moment.

jmo

ETA: Duh forgot map link! http://goo.gl/maps/y9CWf

Both of the nearest towns have a population of around 800 people. Very tiny towns that probably don't even have a grocery store, but just convenience stores for gas, cigs, milk and lottery tickets. If you zoom in and grab the little man to get you a street view on a HWY vs county road you can just see how desolate it is.....and mind you..you are on a hwy with with yellow lines down the middle and not just a Co Rd that is blacktopped which is probably the case on CR270 leading into the park. Looks like a normal rural farming community within 2-3 radius, with houses every 1/2 mile or so. Very desolate....and wouldn't be surprised if beyond the locals more than 20 vehicles per day would venture onto them...if that. Add the height of corn in July with the flat lands....your not going to see much beyond that and the road. IMO Not familiar with IA farmland, but am in central IL...and figure it's very much the same.

The talk of park rangers or park attendants is nil, imo. It's an unattended county park. I'd be surprised if anyone came in to mow the shoulders of the road leading in to it more than once a month...just to keep the sign visible. You can tell by the logs in the pic by the "river"..no one clearing those or keeping maintenance up inside.

So hoping cinderoot or another local will take pics just to show how isolated this area is. lease:

IMO

 

[hollyblue]

Would it be possible for one of our "Map Wizards" to look at this?

112 miles down river. http://goo.gl/maps/jAFlw

 

[hollyblue]

That's what I think. If from the blown up picture Otto posted, the trail was higher, and the grass whether green or dying off was as tall as it appears in the picture, with no trail coming in from the other side of that area, well, I can see it being missed.

I think of it as standing on one mountain looking at another. I can see way more at the base & slope of the one I'm looking at than the one I'm standing on. iykwim...

I wonder if the hunters came in from the end of the road where the LE were parked and walked in from the back to where the girls were found. You could see them much better it appears. jmo

I wish we had pics from north and east (per pics) of where the bodies were found too. (the other side)

 

[Dr. Know?]

40 years of it. I think I understand it, I guess. I just hate the water bill to keep our little rare forest alive here. Our trees... It's a great sanctuary for so many birds, squirrels and the dreaded hawks. Not to mention the coyotes, javalina's etc...We will need more rain & if not, I'm afraid of another hard freeze here by Feb. darn.. May you have rain Iowa. Spill it over here when you have too much please! Tyvm

 

[Angleena]

So ... maybe the medical examiner checked the area, body temp, collected some bugs, and returned after 24 hours to do it again ... to test bug growth and maybe compare that to 24 hours later? Are these 2 feet off the ground, seven feet long and 4 feet wide?

Yes they are, they are used to cover the deceased to protect all evidence and to preserve the ground under the body so they can collect bugs and such that are under the body.

Here is an interesting easy to understand wiki about Entomological evidence collection (bug collection) at a crime scene.

 

[Whisperer]

I am trying to get familiar with the case and started researching. I found this article dated 7/27/12. It mentions that an "uncle", Jeremiah Cook, attempted and overdose when he found out about the girls. I thought it odd...but the whole case appears odd.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/27/lyric-cook-morrissey-elizabeth-collins_n_1710467.html

 

[hollyblue]

The reason I don't believe it was a drug retalition against the father is because of little Elizabeth and the location. The Gma and Lyric lived in Waterloo and were only in Evansdale to help Heather. If someone was after Lyric, they wouldn't be looking in E'dale, but watching for her in Waterloo. IMO I believe the Collins' family has now moved to Waterloo if the FB is correct. ?? Anyone know for certain? I can't say I don't blame them if they did. It could be anyone with sick issues known by either family or the girls.

Whoever it is, I hope they round them up quickly and get them off the streets.

imo

 

[GrainneDhu]

I agree with most of this - some people will do anything due to drugs, if
that is behind this. The kids always suffer. Families get ruined. Its a
nightmare ... not saying this is involved in this case but it could be.

I missed the drug culture in my rural area growing up. Today the area is
flowing with drugs! I NEVER would have imaged such a thing possible.

Again, Im not saying drugs are behind this - I have no way whatever of
knowing - ........ you get where Im coming from.

Maybe there will be news tomorrow. Our prayers go with this family and
those in LE trying to help. I hope they get to the bottom of this soon.
Night.

G.

Meth has devastated Iowa, that's for sure. No thanks to Lori Arnold:

http://www.thefix.com/content/how-americas-meth-queen-melted-down?page=all

My own personal theory is that meth does not make people do things they never dreamed of, it just lowers their inhibitions so that they do things they always wanted to do.

My sense is that Lyric was protected from most of this by the fact that first the Collinses and then her grandmother took over legal guardianship and custody of her.

 

[iSleuth]

Do you mean those hogs in the paddle/pedal boat and driving the white van ??

Thankfully while i was sleeping the wild hogs were ruled -out. New Ws terminology- SOHD ( some other Hog didit)

 

[GrainneDhu]

ETA: Duh forgot map link! http://goo.gl/maps/y9CWf

Both of the nearest towns have a population of around 800 people. Very tiny towns that probably don't even have a grocery store, but just convenience stores for gas, cigs, milk and lottery tickets. If you zoom in and grab the little man to get you a street view on a HWY vs county road you can just see how desolate it is.....and mind you..you are on a hwy with with yellow lines down the middle and not just a Co Rd that is blacktopped which is probably the case on CR270 leading into the park. Looks like a normal rural farming community within 2-3 radius, with houses every 1/2 mile or so. Very desolate....and wouldn't be surprised if beyond the locals more than 20 vehicles per day would venture onto them...if that. Add the height of corn in July with the flat lands....your not going to see much beyond that and the road. IMO Not familiar with IA farmland, but am in central IL...and figure it's very much the same.

The talk of park rangers or park attendants is nil, imo. It's an unattended county park. I'd be surprised if anyone came in to mow the shoulders of the road leading in to it more than once a month...just to keep the sign visible. You can tell by the logs in the pic by the "river"..no one clearing those or keeping maintenance up inside.

So hoping cinderoot or another local will take pics just to show how isolated this area is. lease:

IMO

To me, desolate is LA or NYC, where people are jammed together elbow to elbow and there isn't room to grow anything!

Iowa has more houses than central Illinois. The land is more rolling than central IL, so the fields are smaller.

As for paving, in Iowa you're on a road that goes somewhere if it is paved. We have a lot more gravel roads that Illinois.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I am trying to get familiar with the case and started researching. I found this article dated 7/27/12. It mentions that an "uncle", Jeremiah Cook, attempted and overdose when he found out about the girls. I thought it odd...but the whole case appears odd.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/27/lyric-cook-morrissey-elizabeth-collins_n_1710467.html

Not sure why you put uncle in quote marks since he is apparently a brother to both Heather and Misty.

As I recall, he has had arrests for drug use, so my guess is that his coping mechanisms are not very good. I don't know how to put this... I'm thinking something along the lines that it is really difficult to have a substance abuse problem at the best of times. When the people you might ordinarily turn to all of a sudden have a big, huge, horrible emergency in their lives, most people with substance abuse problems are not able to suddenly grow adequate coping skills.

I think it could be thinking something like "why wasn't it f'ed up me that was taken rather than my beautiful innocent nieces?"

That is all just a guess, though.

 

[nikkiw319]

The reason I don't believe it was a drug retalition against the father is because of little Elizabeth and the location. The Gma and Lyric lived in Waterloo and were only in Evansdale to help Heather. If someone was after Lyric, they wouldn't be looking in E'dale, but watching for her in Waterloo. IMO I believe the Collins' family has now moved to Waterloo if the FB is correct. ?? Anyone know for certain? I can't say I don't blame them if they did. It could be anyone with sick issues known by either family or the girls.

Whoever it is, I hope they round them up quickly and get them off the streets.

imo

Have you read that somewhere? As far as I know, the Collins have not moved from their home.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

As someone who works with people struggling with drug addiction every day, I must respectfully disagree with your statement that meth merely lowers inhibitions. For great information on the devastating effects that meth has on your brain, personality, and health, please visit www.narcanon.org. Meth most certainly does change one's personality.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

I apologize, I am on my phone, and the quotes I put in my post didn't appear. My last comment was respectfully directed at GrainneDhu's theory on meth. Meth is an awful, awful brain-ravaging drug. I wish it would go away

 

[palaminodee]

what bothers me about the photo of the two white sheets are two scenarios:

the perp made them get out of a vehicle and made them start walking, then took care of killing them one at a time, one girl trying to get away.
or
taking an ATV and just randomly dumping them off the vehicle.

sorry, they are both sickening thoughts, but that is what my mind comes up with seeing the distance between them.
just my opinion...who knows if that is even close to really what happened?

 

[rachaellouise]

I really hope the results of the autopsy are released sometime this week.. as well as news they've arrested the perp?

 

[GrainneDhu]

As someone who works with people struggling with drug addiction every day, I must respectfully disagree with your statement that meth merely lowers inhibitions. For great information on the devastating effects that meth has on your brain, personality, and health, please visit www.narcanon.org. Meth most certainly does change one's personality.

Your url didn't lead anywhere but it might be something weird with my computer. I'll have my husband check it for me when he wakes up.

I may not be explaining it right (I'm just a high school graduate, not an expert in anything except maybe dog training). What I'm trying to say is that, based solely on my own life experience, taking meth doesn't turn someone into a pedophile if they didn't already have that particular inclination. It also makes people a lot more likely to go "hey, why not" to ideas that are really, really stupid (like carsurfing).

It seems to me that meth intensifies the user's behaviour but it doesn't make them do anything that they would normally find completely unthinkable. If they normally had a good relationship with their mother, for instance, meth won't make a person break into the mother's house at night to kill her. It might make someone who was angry with their mother do so, though.

Of course, this could all be biased from being based on my small sample population, which is made up of people I know who got caught by meth.