IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #23

[Dr. Know?]

Police should look at men that live in the area and who had their cell phones turned off after 12:30 on July 13. I bet there's a connection there, especially if the phone was turned off until the late evening or the next morning.

Scott Peterson called people shortly after murdering his wife where he pretended, with friends, that everything was normal re their upcoming plans to have couples get togethers. The person that did this to Elizabeth and Lyric may have gone home for supper that day. He may have had the freedom to show up very late in the evening with no explanation. Either way, I suspect that his cell phone was turned off between noon on July 13 and July 14 for several continuous hours. That's two facts, enough to lead to the perp in Blackhawk County and possibly within 12 radial miles of Dunkerton, Iowa, in my opinion ... but it would take a lot of phone log searching ... probably a couple of months to find the person that didn't use his phone after the girls were missing, then acted weird, then got smug.

I hope this has already been done.

eta, Thanks Otto! I appreciate your hard work and your knowledge. I'm learning.

 

[otto]

Thank you button wasn't enough. I really doubt it's an RSO, they are the first to be checked when a child goes missing. I have a friend who is a victim advocate and she says she doesn't ever worry about RSOs, she knows who they are and where they are and how to avoid them, she worries about the ones that haven't been caught yet.

I would sincerely doubt this is the work of an RSO, if it was a sexually motivated crime, I'd pick someone who isn't on the radar yet as a sex offender.

I keep thinking about Austin Sigg, he is 17 years old. Who saw that coming? I have two people in mind for this case based on what we already know. But I have also considered someone home from college for the summer or even a high school boy. The risk is high because there are two girls, but if it was someone young like that they might have known the girls through school or siblings or cousins.

Registered sex offenders were indeed the first investigative tool ... that, and draining the lake. Police had no clue about what happened and who did this, and for the first 18 hours they weren't even sure that this was an abduction. The bikes are like a red herring but at the same time it's plausible. Maybe the bikes were left at a secluded part of the lake by the girls, and maybe they were planted, or staged. I'm inclined to think that they were staged, but that would completely exclude the sighting by the cyclist at 12:20 PM. The bikes were found at about 3:40, officially at 3:58. The cyclist's sighting has always skewed the timeline. The girls could not have ridden their bikes there so fast, opened the drainage gate, sat down beside a purse and wandered off leaving a purse in less than 10 or 15 minutes. The sighting from the cyclist has to be off ... somewhere, it seem's off. Maybe he's one of those guys that is full of crap trying to make himself seem important to relatives and daughters. If the perp had from 12:30 - 4 to deposit the bikes at Meyers Lake and until the next day to leave bodies at 7 Bridges Park ... I'm thinking that if this person isn't caught by Spring, we'll have another victim.

The location of the bodies is within the perp's comfort zone, as is Evandale and the Seven Bridges County Park ... and everywhere in between plus the backroads.

"The timeline shows police were considering abduction as a possibility early on. Interviews with sex offenders started at 7 p.m. the day of disappearance and continued for days, and what became a nightly survey of trash Dumpsters began Saturday.

"We weren't leaving any stone unturned. We didn't take anything off the plate," Smock said."

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_e1decc44-3f79-55a1-85f6-f26635373bb5.html

 

[otto]

I'm curious ... after police put crime scene tape up at 7 Bridges Park, did they look for any other bodies? ... or are they certain that this local person has not done this before? I think is worthwhile sending a trained search party to the park one more time to ensure that there are no other bodies in the nearby vicinity. Casey Anthony reportedly buried animals in the same location where she left her daughter. Maybe the guy associates the area with dead animals.

Anyone know how long the park has no longer been looked after in terms of having children's attractions and organized activities? When did the 270 Street Bridge collapse? Did this perp discover this park after it was abandoned, does he have experience with hunting in the area and what year was hunting first allowed in the county park?

I don't believe that this is the first violent offense for this murderer. Morgan Harrington's mother said that no one starts with murdering a young woman ... let alone two children. No one starts with multiple victim child murders. This guy has to be on police or neighbor radar as being gregarious, but not friendly.

Are they any rural people that shut down their cell phone service between July 13 at noon and July 14 at about 5 AM ... and have a lot of cats?

 

[chicagofa13]

I am thinking that they cut down some of the grass around the bodies. Bullets in trees? There was a photo posted earlier that seems to show the nearby trees intact in maps when the bodies were found and after the bodies were removed.

I don't know to whom I should attribute this photo (apologies ... it's just open on the computer now), but it's perfect! I'm just wondering if the vantage point for the photo is a bit to the right ... because of the different positions of the twisted tree in the two photos.

That's why I said please, no rumors. Simply providing yet another reason trees are removed from crime scenes.

Clearly we have no idea what was taken, when a tree was cut, etc.

 

[otto]

This is the timeline according to the Abben, including the 12:30 sighting at Gilbert and Elmer (not Lake Avenue ... assuming he knows the difference). I've highlighted one possible route given the direction they were riding when they were last seen ... but the bikes could be staged.

I'm almost thinking that the person that did this is a married man that had it all sorted out ahead or time, or someone that lives in his mother's basement.

 

[otto]

That's why I said please, no rumors. Simply providing yet another reason trees are removed from crime scenes.

Clearly we have no idea what was taken, when a tree was cut, etc.

We don't know what was cut because there are no good photos showing that anything was cut. If anything was cut, it has to be because there is a possibility that there is evidence. There's no other reason ... except maybe someone wanted to back a vehicle into the area, but I doubt it. Anything that was cut for forensic reasons would have been cut with a chain saw. Anything eaten by a beaver has a cone shaped chew pattern. Anything that fell down or has a bent trunk doesn't count.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_c3933712-40ae-11e2-9eac-001a4bcf887a.html. Heather's sister in law's facebook awareness page would have happened no matter what, but I can't figure out the other person's connection yet.

ETA: I'm not sure I would give as much credit to facebook as facebook takes ... it seems to me that sometime the facebook pages grow out of the public awareness, not the other way around.

 

[chicagofa13]

I don't disagree with any part of your statement. I wanted to point out there were other options for a tree being removed besides the girls being chained to a tree (very unlikely imo). I felt the tree being possibly cut down was heading in the direction of the hogs, KWIm?!

And growing up in an area where beavers made dams, I've seen what they can do!

 

[betterthaniusedtobe]

Please forgive me in advance, but I am new to posting. Usually just lurk. I do not really know how to maneuver around yet. Can someone give me a brief explanation of the Readlyn incident? Thanks ;-)

 

[hollyblue]

We don't know what was cut because there are no good photos showing that anything was cut. If anything was cut, it has to be because there is a possibility that there is evidence. There's no other reason ... except maybe someone wanted to back a vehicle into the area, but I doubt it. Anything that was cut for forensic reasons would have been cut with a chain saw. Anything eaten by a beaver has a cone shaped chew pattern. Anything that fell down or has a bent trunk doesn't count.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...cle_c3933712-40ae-11e2-9eac-001a4bcf887a.html. Heather's sister in law's facebook awareness page would have happened no matter what, but I can't figure out the other person's connection yet.

ETA: I'm not sure I would give as much credit to facebook as facebook takes ... it seems to me that sometime the facebook pages grow out of the public awareness, not the other way around.

Otto, I zoomed in at 600% on the first little tree on the left...and there are several very fresh cuts where someone cut off the branches and not like the stumps.

 

[threecrazykids]

OT sorry, yes Urbana stinks. I have always blamed Decatur (the ADM plant there)

When the wind blows this direction Springfield stinks. It usually blows toward Urbana I guess.

Ok...completely off topic but what's funny is apparently there are 2 Urbana's that stink...one in IL and the one in IA too! :floorlaugh: I was talking about the one here in IA, but apparently it's just an "Urbana thing".:floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Otto, I zoomed in at 600% on the first little tree on the left...and there are several very fresh cuts where someone cut off the branches and not like the stumps.

I can see two very clear and clean cuts

 

[Elley Mae]

After looking at Otto's maps and pictures posted and google maps it is my opinion that they were in an open area out at the turn in the river. Just an observation.

 

[cindersoot]

Heather Collins talks with reporter, says, we will bury Elizabeths "body". On Kwwl today.

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Thank You!

Otto, I do want to say how much I do appreciate the maps you add to the many cases I have followed. They are an added bonus and very much looked at by these eyes.

I second that!

Otto your maps are fantastic and very appreciated, Thank you so very much for all your work

 

[cindersoot]

I can see two very clear and clean cuts

Could be blood or hair evidence. I don't think bullet hole, the branch is too small.

 

[TxLady2]

BBM

Under normal circumstances, I agree with this. However, if there were EVER a time to watch your kid more closely, it is when there is a known kidnapper and/or killer of children on the loose in your neighborhood!! Had the Westminster police warned the community about the attempted abductions, Jessica Ridgeway's mom might have given her a ride to school that day and she'd still be alive.

Parents can't know when to hold their kids close and when to give them freedom if they don't have all the information! If LE believes Lyric and Elizabeth were abducted at random, the community MOST DEFINITELY deserves to know that so they can choose to not give their kids freedom until that killer is caught.

What about the people who don't read the papers or watch the news? Or the ones who don't pay attention when things like that happen?
More importantly, have there been any other children from around Evansdale or Waterloo abducted since the girls?
LE should not have to issue public warnings to parents, EVERY parent should know to take extra precautions where their kids are concerned. Still, there will always be some who can't or won't pay attention. LE can't MAKE parents heed their warnings. Sometimes even with the best intentions, things happen that we have no control over.
I've known of LE holding seminars on public awareness in my area, warning women not to walk or jog alone, to find a partner to walk with, to carry a can of pepper spray. Yet just last week, there was an attempted rape of a woman out jogging by herself when it was almost dark. The assailant drug her off the trail into a wooded area, but she screamed and fought and he ran off. She was lucky. There have been several instances of attacks over the past year, and STILL there are young women who don't pay attention. Do you think it would make a difference if LE went on t.v. and issued a warning? Probably not. Humans tend to think they're invincible and I guess some parents think it can't happen to their child.

 

[RNER]

BBM

Under normal circumstances, I agree with this. However, if there were EVER a time to watch your kid more closely, it is when there is a known kidnapper and/or killer of children on the loose in your neighborhood!! Had the Westminster police warned the community about the attempted abductions, Jessica Ridgeway's mom might have given her a ride to school that day and she'd still be alive.

Parents can't know when to hold their kids close and when to give them freedom if they don't have all the information! If LE believes Lyric and Elizabeth were abducted at random, the community MOST DEFINITELY deserves to know that so they can choose to not give their kids freedom until that killer is caught.

I am thankful to live in a community where alerts and warnings ARE provided to the public in all kinds of situations from strings of home invasions, assaults and/or rapes on the bike path, purse snatchings at the local Walmart, to "killer on the loose". There are even warnings issued when a potentially dangerous animal is loose!

Locallly, when such a warning IS NOT issued with a certain crime, it is usually because a supect is already in custody, known to LE, or somehow connected to a victim through affiliation, drugs, family, or targeting.

Just my opinion, as always!

 

[masootz]

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdale_search/update-missing-cousins-bodies-found-in-remote-area-of-seven/article_eb5c81b6-42db-11e2-b39a-001a4bcf887a.html

"Two small strips of yellow tape declaring “Caution Sheriff Line Do Not Cross” remain tied to logs, and an occasional orange-and-silver striped ribbon marker can be seen in the brush.

Tall grass that once covered the area was cut in the search, and bushes and saplings were clipped."

 

[tlcya]

Wasn't there a campfire in this area mentioned when this first broke or residue? I know I heard something like that. gah...now where? Live feed?

I've burned green wood, it wasn't easy but needed in the wet woods. You practically have to bake it to well done with whatever you can find to burn, if you have a match or lighter that is. At least for us in our travels.

The is a local poster who had been in the area during the summer month (maybe) who commented about the low water level and the sandy/silty area. Poster also mentioned the remains of an old campfire.

It was in the previous thread. Far as I know there has been no mention in msm of a campfire at the scene.

Hope that helps.

 

[palaminodee]

I truely admire someone like Dr. Bill Bass and the body farm scientists.
Anyone who helps put criminals behind bars.
And special thanks to the brave souls that donate their bodies for science.
Medical schools need cadavers also.

thanks for the video, had no idea what occurs, very interesting.
not as gross as I thought it would be.
isn't this where Adam Mayes was sent to? (MS killer)