IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #24

[chelsea6]

Thank you Chelsea, your work is appreciated! I am not a local, so it is helpful to see the areas where the girls may have ridden their bikes and try to figure out what could have happened.

You are very welcome! :seeya: Since there hasn't been any news, I thought posting pictures of the scenes in question every once in awhile will spark some new ideas about the clues we've been given. :websleuther:

 

[Marilynilpa]

Sitting here watching the snow storm coming in. I like snow, but worry about all the stray kitties. That's just me.

I'm waiting on our snow, we won't be getting any until Friday night.

I worry about the stray cats, too. I have a big igloo-style dog house that I put out for the cats when the weather turns cold, and I give them dry food every day. The number of cats varies, anywhere from 3 to 10 or more. I borrow humane traps from Animal Friends, where I take the cats after I trap them. They spay/neuter these cats, give them their shots, and provide whatever other medical attention they require. This is a no kill shelter, and to me they are heaven-sent.

If it wasn't for Animal Friends, I would have way more than two cats right now, and I'd be known as the Crazy Cat Lady of Pittsburgh.:what:

 

[Marilynilpa]

First of all, Mr G's sighting was only ever reported as "around 12.20".

Secondly, no where does Abben (or anyone really) confirm this time in relation to the sighting of the bikes.

Thirdly, I have watched the other witnesses on youtube(whos timing fits perfectly with Mr G's) and I believe they have been told to be vague probably by LE. Mr C goes to say something definite about time and Mrs C jumps in and gives the 12-1 timeframe.

Finally, we never did have confirmation that the bikes Mr G swerved around, belonged to the girls.

Of course, all opinion only.

:cow:

I know we have never received confirmation that the girls' bikes were seen by TG. My post was in response to your statement that the 12:23 and the 12:30-1:00 sightings were only MSM reporting or rumors. I pointed out that it was an official statement made by Abben.

The fact that LE has never said "we have information that the girls' bikes were seen at approximately 12:20 p.m. on the trail at Meyers Lake" leads me to believe that, for whatever reason(s), LE has not deemed TG's sighting credible. JMO

 

[cindersoot]

Going back to earlier thoughts with your pic...the gate was open (which is not apparently normal) shouldn't there have been foot prints of the girls on the sandy area? Was this taken during the draining of the lake? It looks like a much bigger sand area than I'm used to seeing at the lake.

If this was before the draining of the lake there still should have been foot prints of where the girls were, unless they stayed right there on the rock entrance by the drain pipe.

If the gates were unlocked, why? Did someone leave them unlocked or was that normal for it to be open to access the lake from the far side?

This was after the lake was drained, there would not of been a sandy area. Maybe a path around the lake on rocks.

 

[cindersoot]

I'm waiting on our snow, we won't be getting any until Friday night.

I worry about the stray cats, too. I have a big igloo-style dog house that I put out for the cats when the weather turns cold, and I give them dry food every day. The number of cats varies, anywhere from 3 to 10 or more. I borrow humane traps from Animal Friends, where I take the cats after I trap them. They spay/neuter these cats, give them their shots, and provide whatever other medical attention they require. This is a no kill shelter, and to me they are heaven-sent.

If it wasn't for Animal Friends, I would have way more than two cats right now, and I'd be known as the Crazy Cat Lady of Pittsburgh.:what:

Oh, God Bless you. I also take care of many strays and we don't have a trap neuter program anywhere near or around me, so I have to deal everyday with sickness, litters, you name it. I feed them and provide shelter, many won't let me touch them. I spend about 30 dollars a week on cat food. I don't know what else to do, it is so stressful and I have a big heart. Sorry, off subject.

 

[cindersoot]

Looking from the front of the auction house towards Collins house. About Two weeks after they went missing : (

 

[roseofsharon]

View attachment 28682 Looking from the front of the auction house towards Collins house. About Two weeks after they went missing : (

Thanks Cinder! Is Cornbelt Auctions right next door to Ledermans? So WC could look out front and see the girls in the Lederman's parking lot?

The Collin's home and the parking lot where WC last saw the girls is so much closer than what I imagined.

How in the world did this abduction happen so quickly!!! It's almost as though the perp saw WC turn her back for a second.



IMO

 

[cindersoot]

 

[Squeeze]

BBM - Well, let's see:

#1 - You have recently relocated to IA
#2 - You have recently "flown the family nest" & set up a new household sans snow shovel
#3 - Your neighbor/in-law borrowed your shovel and never returned it ):
#4 - Etc.
Just sayin..

The people that said this, none of the above. Maybe they misplaced it, since we had very little snow last year.

 

[cindersoot]

Thanks Cinder! Is Cornbelt Auctions right next door to Ledermans? So WC could look out front and see the girls in the Lederman's parking lot?

The Collin's home and the parking lot where WC last saw the girls is so much closer than what I imagined.

How in the world did this abduction happen so quickly!!! It's almost as though the perp saw WC turn her back for a second.



IMO

Yes to your questions. That's why I think they were abducted at the lake.

 

[elepher50]

Oh my, but I am very late in checking in here. Thankfully they have been found. Rest little ones and may the perp(s) be found and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

Very sad.

 

[roseofsharon]

View attachment 28686

I can't quite make out the writing on the white truck. Does it say Cornbelt Auctions? TIA

Does CA do pick ups and deliveries?

:waitasec:

 

[SapphireSteel]

I know we have never received confirmation that the girls' bikes were seen by TG. My post was in response to your statement that the 12:23 and the 12:30-1:00 sightings were only MSM reporting or rumors. I pointed out that it was an official statement made by Abben.

The fact that LE has never said "we have information that the girls' bikes were seen at approximately 12:20 p.m. on the trail at Meyers Lake" leads me to believe that, for whatever reason(s), LE has not deemed TG's sighting credible. JMO

I'm taking it.

I agree, it is incredibly tight timing, on the face of things.

My problem is, I have never had the exact time of Mr G's sighting confirmed by anybody official, it's just too much guesswork for me. Also, Breault referred to him as a jogger, so there's another little discrepancy...or is it?

Do you see where I'm going here? Maybe there is a third witness that we do not know about, a jogger, who also ran past the bikes.

I just think Mr G is unlikely to be mistaken and I can't get past the fact that though the timing is tight, it is actually perfect for one particular scenario that has always seemed most likely to me.

Someone drove along, swooped up the girls, deposited their bikes at the opposite end of where they actually were taken to distract the investigation and imply a random off the highway, and drove away.

This could conceivably be accomplished within 3 minutes, unseen, if we believe the girls had got as far as Mr C's between 12-1.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Why do you think Abben never acknowledged the reporters question about TG? He had to of known, he was a witness. What would be the reason to deny knowing?

Because LE never comments publicly on what witnesses say unless it is absolutely necessary. Remember, the aim of LE is to eventually supply the ingredients for charges to the prosector; the last thing they want is to say something publicly before they know the whole story that will come back to bite them in court.

 

[GrainneDhu]

blizzard warning, doubt much will go on today
http://www.kwwl.com/

When the going gets cold and snowy, Mr and Mrs Grainne do what good Iowans do: make French toast. Gotta keep up our energy for watching silly movies, you know.

 

[GrainneDhu]

To me, "staging" is something that requires more thought and planning, and I don't think the perp necessarily did that. He just wanted to dump them and get away. But if we want to define "staging" your way, that works for me.

I don't think my definition is better than yours; I actually rather like your definition, in some ways more than my own.

But it helps in communication if everyone is on the same page.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I've heard several people comment "well, I'd better go buy a shovel"... Uh, why don't you have a shovel?? You live in Iowa for cryin' out loud! Yes, the first snowfall is always interesting. The scanner will be popping, I'm sure. But then again, we have been the recipient of false "big storm" claims before, so let's see if this actually materializes.

It's because the cheap shovels available these days are so flimsy that they only really hold up for one normal winter. The front rim is easily dented and bent up, the blade starts wobbling on the handle very quickly and it gets so scratched up that more snow sticks to it than flies off it when thrown. By spring, they are just about done for but the stores aren't selling those cheap snow shovels any more. So that replacement for the broken down shovel waits until snow is imminent.

I did what farmers do: I bought a grain shovel 30+ years ago and it is still as good as new. The front rim is true and the blade doesn't wobble at all on the handle.

Of course, moving out into the country has spoiled me. My neighbour rents my pole barn in return for plowing us out, so we only have about 20 feet of front walk to clear. Plus, we invite him in for coffee and cookies, so we get filled in on the local gossip.

 

[Marilynilpa]

When the going gets cold and snowy, Mr and Mrs Grainne do what good Iowans do: make French toast. Gotta keep up our energy for watching silly movies, you know.

I'm not an Iowan, but I enjoy French toast on snowy days too. French toast, a great cup of coffee, followed by at least a couple of Thin Man movies.

Now I'm looking forward to the snow we're expecting on Friday night.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Would it even be possible for dogs to track the girls if they were on their bikes? Without them having physically touched anything?

Yes, with a few exceptions. The major exception would be if they went through a gas station; the fumes can dull the dog's sense of smell. But a smart handler would just take the dog to a point on the other side of the gas station and re-cast the dog.

No one knows for sure what it is that dogs smell when they track people. The leading theory is that dogs are smelling skin rafts, the microscopic flakes of skin and microbial goodies that humans shed literally by the thousands per second (skin rafts are what make up a lot of the dust in a normal house).

Riding a bicycle provides its own breeze, which helps skin rafts leave the skin and eventually (within a matter of feet) settle on the ground. If it's warm enough to ride a bicycle in short sleeves, those skin rafts are likely to be nice and moist with vapor or actual sweat, which helps stick them to whatever they land on.

 

[GrainneDhu]

As much as I crave more information, I would much rather this be the scenario than everyone running around spewing "facts" that weren't "facts" like they did last week in Newtown. That has to be a huge lesson learned in what NOT to do. So many things were later found to be untrue, like the guys NAME for one, and that the mother was a teacher at the school. But listening to the ACTUAL press conference from ACTUAL law enforcement, he did not confirm any information that was later deemed false. At first, they had reported that the brother was dead, in another town, but he wouldn't confirm any of that, just that there was a secondary crime scene. Nor the name of the attacker. Even yesterday, Wolf Blitzer talked with a local law enforcement official who was the official spokesperson, and he said that he did not know that the computer the perp had was damaged,and that they were unable to get any info from it, and that any information on that would have come from him. And then later in the day, a reporter on CNN stated to Wolf that the computer was damaged and they couldn't get info from it. Well, I would have thought Wolf would have said "according to so and so, that's not true".... but he didn't.

So, in the case of our girls, as much as I want to know more details, I would hate for anything not concrete to be said that sends people in a tizzy, possibly turning their attention somewhere where it shouldn't be. IF they have a perp in mind, the last thing they want to do is tip off the public that they have their suspicions about this person, because an old fashioned lynch mob would likely ensue.

According to both Drew and Heather Collins, their impression is that LE has some suspects.

So I am happy that LE is playing it close to the vest.