IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #25

[Ms Pragmatic]

Maybe he bought something for his kids and it got LEs attention. I believe that is the same Casey's they pulled receipts from. Maybe they wanted to match a purchase to a person? Say he bought two candy bars and two sprites....totally perfect for the girls, or innocently for his two kids.

I assume he has kids for the purpose of this post. Lol

Very good thought! And one I hadn't considered! Thank you

 

[georger]

Good morning all playing catch up here.

My theory has long been that LE know exactly who is behind this.

Now with these additional comments, it seems as though this may be the case.

“Part of that is, the only people that are going to know this information are the people who are responsible,” Smock said. “At least until somebody is arrested and we’re comfortable with that, that’s information we’ll keep confidential.”

~sbm~

“It’s not hampering us at all, but it is additional information that we’re looking forward to getting and putting with the case,” he said.
http://www.desmoinesregister.com/ar...aths-will-be-kept-confidential?nclick_check=1


I know a lot of people struggle with the concept of forensic linguistics here, but bear with me.

His language is unusual. We all know how careful and close lipped LE have been.

Smock speaks of the people responsible.

If he had no clue, or did not wish to give this away, LE speak is "person or persons responsible".

The fact that he actually said "people" (twice) implies to me that there are suspects, and they are plural.

The statement that they will "ADD" the COD indicates that they already have a case and are working one definite direction.

Put this together with the "we don't even have a gender" speech and I am fairly sure -

There was more than one perpetrator

The girls were not sexually abused.

They have a case, and are just waiting on the ducks to line up in a row.

:cow:

Your scenario leaves open the possibility that this was a deed just gone
horribly wrong! We know there are drugs in their lives, prosecutions,
bargaining, people's lives at stake already. Some 'idiot' might have
abducted the girls to make a point basically telling the family 'this could
be done - keep quiet!', intending all along to let the girls go hours later.

The first idiot makes a call informing some second idiot of what he has
done and the second smarter idiot says "WHAT! YOU DID WHAT!?" And he
informs the first idiot: "You have only made things worse. Now you have
to get rid of them".

Some people in a mess do really stupid things and things get out of control,
especially if there is some mentally derranged person involved.

This could be what Abben means by: "the people responsible". plural.

Because if this is not sexual then there almost has to be a drug-
prosecutions-pending connection ... and some of these people involved in
things like that really do not think straight in desparation with their lives
on the line ...

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

For those who are hoping that DNA will solve this crime, here's a relevant factoid: nationally there are over 400,000 rape kits that have not yet been processed. They are just sitting around in forensic labs.

So...we may be waiting awhile?

 

[threecrazykids]

Still doesn't make sense why they chose this man. Why? What would ever lead them to believe he had information to give? It was puzzling then and it still is. Iirc, it was the only time LE asked anyone specific to step forward. What is the connection here? There must be a reason.

My thoughts exactly! I have a feeling that point blank it was the white van. They aren't going to ADMIT that because it could be used against them as some sort of discriminatory profiling or something stupid like that if it ever went to court.

So...they SAY it's not because of the white van (and make sure they NOTE it's NOT because of the white van during the report)...but my guess is that it is. It certainly should be given the number of white van attempted abductions in the area this summer.

 

[threecrazykids]

Did you read the article that the Demoines Reg. said they may have a vidio of the vechele used in the abduction of the girls?

Yeah, that was said awhile ago...they also went on to state "and we may not even know it". Basically saying they may very well have the vehicle on camera but because they don't know who or what they are looking for they don't even know it's right in front of their face.

 

[chelsea6]

Maybe he bought something for his kids and it got LEs attention. I believe that is the same Casey's they pulled receipts from. Maybe they wanted to match a purchase to a person? Say he bought two candy bars and two sprites....totally perfect for the girls, or innocently for his two kids.

I assume he has kids for the purpose of this post. Lol

They also sell diesel at this station. Imagine Diesel + two candy bars and two sprites?

 

[GrainneDhu]

... Was just a report on WMT 1:00 news, saying 'tests are still being conducted in the case and wont be released to protect the confidentiality of the case' ... 'no word on when the tests will be finished' ...

Question: Liz' cell phone. Was it always not working? Did it work and did
she use any time on Jul 13th, especially during the morning? When they
asked to go out for a bike ride had they already been in contact with
someone ? Were they out looking for someone? Maybe someone they
were supposed to meet? All arranged on the cell phone?

I don't know when Elizabeth's phone went out of service but it was definitely before 13 July. The family talked about how she like to play games on the phone in such a way that it sounded like it was a long established thing.

That phone could have been used to make a 911 call but it would not connect to any other number and it would not show up in ping records.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

In my neck of the woods, we always say that's a molester van. It's never the shiny, well-cared for ones that we refer to as molester vans, but the older, white junky ones. We had a white rickety van on my street and always joked that it was a molester van and by instinct, I told my son never to go near the man that owns it. Turns out, the guy IS an RSO. My neighbor found out and warned us all. The guy ended up exposing himself to a couple if neighborhood kids not long after that. Crazily enough, the guy was picked up, and within 6 months is back in his house. Huh? How does that happen?

 

[Marilynilpa]

yes Otto. It always has been okay to discuss what is in the main stream media.

Also another reminder (not aimed at your post Otto.. this is just a general reminder):

1) do not discuss rumors (social media, etc)

2) do not discuss conversation at other forums.

georger, do you mean the Fareway store? The above post is nursebeeme's gentle reminder that we shouldn't be discussing these Facebook-based rumors.

 

[iamnotagolem]

They also sell diesel at this station. Imagine Diesel + two candy bars and two sprites?

Can you dumb it down for me? I'm not following. I don't believe Chevy astrovans come stock with a diesel engine.

 

[chelsea6]

In my neck of the woods, we always say that's a molester van. It's never the shiny, well-cared for ones that we refer to as molester vans, but the older, white junky ones. We had a white rickety van on my street and always joked that it was a molester van and by instinct, I told my son never to go near the man that owns it. Turns out, the guy IS an RSO. My neighbor found out and warned us all. The guy ended up exposing himself to a couple if neighborhood kids not long after that. Crazily enough, the guy was picked up, and within 6 months is back in his house. Huh? How does that happen?

:what: Ewwwwww!!! That is just wrong! :frown:

 

[Marilynilpa]

Still doesn't make sense why they chose this man. Why? What would ever lead them to believe he had information to give? It was puzzling then and it still is. Iirc, it was the only time LE asked anyone specific to step forward. What is the connection here? There must be a reason.

They were following up a lead - maybe he said something in Casey's and, after the girls disappeared, someone remembered his comment and notified LE. If no one at Casey's knew the guy by name, that would explain why LE/FBI showed the picture of him. It was the easiest way to find out who he was, IMO.

Just one possible explanation.

 

[Marilynilpa]

Just brainstorming: cold the perp(s) have a young companion to lure
young victims ?

That's a good idea, it's been known to happen.

 

[GrainneDhu]

What puzzles me with that is LE was surely told by Tammy about the supposed sighting. So why not clear the trail and the park immediately...which I think the family could have done from the get go. She stated LE even drove the cars upon the trail. That would have taken less than a minute to be sure the girls weren't on it. imo

Well, I have no idea why it didn't happen that way.

From watching AuntTB's many interviews, my impression of her is that she is a sincere, good hearted person but very excitable. And a bit scatterbrained, even though interviews are controlled and have definite goals.

I imagine that in an emergency situation, AuntTB would be wound even tighter, talking even faster and even more scatterbrained. Frankly, if I were the LE officer talking to a family group, I think I'd have to tune her out to make any sense out of the situation!

I do believe she means well but she isn't even on the top ten list of the people in that extended family that I would depend upon to get an accurate report.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Your scenario leaves open the possibility that this was a deed just gone
horribly wrong! We know there are drugs in their lives, prosecutions,
bargaining, people's lives at stake already. Some 'idiot' might have
abducted the girls to make a point basically telling the family 'this could
be done - keep quiet!', intending all along to let the girls go hours later.

The first idiot makes a call informing some second idiot of what he has
done and the second smarter idiot says "WHAT! YOU DID WHAT!?" And he
informs the first idiot: "You have only made things worse. Now you have
to get rid of them".

Some people in a mess do really stupid things and things get out of control,
especially if there is some mentally derranged person involved.

This could be what Abben means by: "the people responsible". plural.

Because if this is not sexual then there almost has to be a drug-
prosecutions-pending connection ... and some of these people involved in
things like that really do not think straight in desparation with their lives
on the line ...

Yup.

I don't think anything went horribly wrong though.

I think it all went perfectly according to plan.

I can see other motives too, like revenge, spite, convenience, and just plain meanness.

:sick:

 

[hollyblue]

Need a memory boost! Did LE ever ask to talk to anyone that was at the lake that day...before 4PM? TIA

 

[GrainneDhu]

I see your point, but its one more thing tying them to the crime. And if there is no DNA, every bit of circumstantial evidence helps. And as GrainneDhu stated, it has worked before. I know if I'm questioned by the police, I am not offering up any theories as to how the girls were murdered.

I'm not aware of any convictions that were based solely on perp knowing the cause of death but I know of lots of cases where the perp knowing the cause of death (or other salient details) focused LE in the correct direction.

For a recent example, the Evelyn Miller case. Casey Frederickson was a suspect from the very beginning but because he lived in the same household, there wasn't any relevant forensic evidence. It wasn't until he started telling people details about how Evelyn died that LE could build a case against him.

 

[chelsea6]

Can you dumb it down for me? I'm not following. I don't believe Chevy astrovans come stock with a diesel engine.

lol.. yes, I can. I wasn't referring to a Chevy Astrovan.. I'm linking that Casey's stop to one of my many possible scenerios of what may have happened.. Post # 1134. This scenerio involving a Semi cab/sleeper cab at the nearby station that does work on trucks/semis, and if it were a semi cab... a receipt showing diesel, plus items for the girls.. Sprites, candy bars like she /he mentioned. That receipt would be easy to find.

 

[JaimeInLA]

Maybe he bought something for his kids and it got LEs attention. I believe that is the same Casey's they pulled receipts from. Maybe they wanted to match a purchase to a person? Say he bought two candy bars and two sprites....totally perfect for the girls, or innocently for his two kids.

I assume he has kids for the purpose of this post. Lol

Maybe he was there right as the perp, who I will randomly call Fanny, was returning from 7 Bridges, and stopped at Casey's to hose off her truck. Fanny had to wash down the dust, fill'er up, and high tail it over to the lake to help look for missing girls. Hypothetically and MOO of course.

 

[carbuff]

They could have even said "I told grandma I'd watch you so you could keep playing until Misty gets off work." This would keep the girls from asking why they weren't headed to the hospital.

What if the friend/relative/other known person rode up on a bike and said that, and then said, "Well, since we're out already, how about if we ride down to the lake? I know you aren't allowed to go there without an adult..."