IA IA - Johnny Gosch, 12, W Des Moines, 5 Sept 1982 - What happened? - #2

[docwho3]

. . .The letter, postmarked from Tampa, Fla., identified all three people in the photos, West Des Moines police spokesman Jeff Miller said.

Great entire post! Thank you for the info!!

 

[Insguru]

Great entire post! Thank you for the info!!

Great news to have some "official" confirmation of things.

Question: Does this also cover the photo of the single boy? In other words, was he also in the photo of the 3 boys? Or are we still trying to figure out if he's Johnny?

 

[Insguru]

Ok this is totally bizarre. Go to Noreen's website and read her letter of today. In it, she says they have talked to the two parents of the boys in the photo (Johnny being the third), and that they are in fact missing / abducted.

Unless I read it wrong, what in the world is going on??? If they are missing, then who in the heck are they??

 

[docwho3]

Great news to have some "official" confirmation of things.

Question: Does this also cover the photo of the single boy? In other words, was he also in the photo of the 3 boys? Or are we still trying to figure out if he's Johnny?

My understanding, limited as it is, was that the single boy was one of the three people in the three boys pic. However, once the info about tampering and staged pics came out I really did not follow the claims of the pics supporters as closely as I might otherwise have done. Perhaps others can shed more light on that question.

 

[docwho3]

Ok this is totally bizarre. Go to Noreen's website and read her letter of today. In it, she says they have talked to the two parents of the boys in the photo (Johnny being the third), and that they are in fact missing / abducted.

Unless I read it wrong, what in the world is going on??? If they are missing, then who in the heck are they??

So she is placing herself in direct conflict withthe statements of those investigating her sons disappearance? I would say this will come to a head and someone will be proven to have been lying. These statements by both sides are too public to be ignored or washed away by spin by either side. At this point I greatly doubt noreens story.

 

[SouthernBell]

Ok this is totally bizarre. Go to Noreen's website and read her letter of today. In it, she says they have talked to the two parents of the boys in the photo (Johnny being the third), and that they are in fact missing / abducted.

Unless I read it wrong, what in the world is going on??? If they are missing, then who in the heck are they??

Okay, hang with me on this, I am new to posting on the site, so I may not be doing it right....
I am totally baffled by this, too. You would think that if your child has been missing (ie: the other boys in the photo) that no matter how long they had been gone that you would still want all the publicity that you could get. Right? I don't know if Noreen is telling the whole truth or not, but I do know that if my child was missing that my world would come crashing down around me. I would not care what anyone thought of me when it comes to getting them home. If she is telling the truth, I hope with all that is in me, that she can see this to it's end and have her son back, or at least know that he is not still being abused or abusing someone elses child.....

 

[Insguru]

So she is placing herself in direct conflict withthe statements of those investigating her sons disappearance? I would say this will come to a head and someone will be proven to have been lying. These statements by both sides are too public to be ignored or washed away by spin by either side. At this point I greatly doubt noreens story.

I agree totally. This will / needs to come to a head immediately. Either we know who they are and they are not missing...or....we do not know who they are.

She is in total contridiction from the investigators who say they have identified the kids and spoken to one of them (now a 40 year old man).

It can't be both!

 

[cappuccina]

...correct, as they released this information (about the boys-now-men being identified) nationally...

I don't think Noreen Gosch is lying on purpose, however....she wants to believe this is her son and that he is sill alive....She is suffering from delusions, rather than being manipulative... I wish that she never had to suffer the loss of her son; it would be good if she could get some help, however, IMO. Someone who has suffered through the same nightmare and is very resilient is Patty Wetterling. I wish that Patty Wetterling could talk to her...

 

[inquiringmindz]

At my own risk, I'm stating that I still believe Noreen no matter what the investigator in FL says. :twocents:

 

[Roy Harrold]

At my own risk, I'm stating that I still believe Noreen no matter what the investigator in FL says. :twocents:

I don't see much risk in that.

It's the people who dare to publicly question Noreen Gosch's version of reality that end up being accused of being puppets of an international pedophile ring.

Just about everyone I can think of who Ms. Gosch feels has "crossed" her in some way, has been made into a villain in her theories - the West Des Moines police, FBI agents, her husband, etc. etc. Now she is insinuating Zalva & this man in Florida are somehow "involved".

 

[maima]

Okay, hang with me on this, I am new to posting on the site, so I may not be doing it right....
I am totally baffled by this, too. You would think that if your child has been missing (ie: the other boys in the photo) that no matter how long they had been gone that you would still want all the publicity that you could get. Right? I don't know if Noreen is telling the whole truth or not, but I do know that if my child was missing that my world would come crashing down around me. I would not care what anyone thought of me when it comes to getting them home. If she is telling the truth, I hope with all that is in me, that she can see this to it's end and have her son back, or at least know that he is not still being abused or abusing someone elses child.....

I'm confused a little, too. My first thought was that Noreen needs to clarify what she means by "We have verified that the children were missing/abducted and have removed that photo by request of the parents." Are the individuals (who were boys at the time of the photo) still missing? If so, it seems odd that the parents would want the photo removed unless their cases have already been solved. If the boys have been identified, and if the boys-now-adults are still alive and living a regular life, then the request for removal of the photo is understandable.

Another question: Is Noreen certain that the parents who contacted her are really the parents of the boys in the photo?

 

[cappuccina]

...nothing of the type...all of the evidence points to a local pedophile who kidnapped and in all probability murdered Johnny and one other paperboy. Like the local predator who kidnapped and probably Jacob Wetterling, the perpetrator probably still lives in the area if he is still alive...

Occam's Razor applies here...the simplest explanantion has the highest probability of being the closest to the truth...

 

[Insguru]

...nothing of the type...all of the evidence points to a local pedophile who kidnapped and in all probability murdered Johnny and one other paperboy. Like the local predator who kidnapped and probably Jacob Wetterling, the perpetrator probably still lives in the area if he is still alive...

Occam's Razor applies here...the simplest explanantion has the highest probability of being the closest to the truth...

I tend to agree. I'm not convinced that it was a single perp that got him into the car and somehow incapacitated a nearly 13 year old boy. And then also was able to drive off by himself, with this nearly 13 year old kid. But those are semantics and we can work through the scenarios of this.

But my question to you Cappuccina, is what do you think about the pics? Are they of him? Just because they are (if they are and i'm not convinced), doesn't mean your theory is not correct. In other words pictures don't dispell that it was a one or two man job.

 

[mjak]

If Norren located the parents of the two other boys and they identified their sons as missing why would they not be standing up next to Norren demanding an investigation??
Why would they, along with Noreen not be going on every talk show, speaking to investigators and demanding justice for their sons? Are we to believe they would just ask Noreen to please remove their sons picture and go on with their lives content to believe this is what happened to their child? Every male that Norren has contact with who does not validate her becomes a suspect for pedafilia and potentialy one of the ring. My heart breaks for this women. I have read her book and it is in my opnion the ramblings of a mentally Ill women. I hope she gets the help she needs and maybe someday the athorities will really find out what happened to Johnny. A man in florida has come forward to the invistiagator who said he investigated thoes photos in the 70's and claims he is one of the boys in the picture and none of the boys are Johnny Gosch. I believe him.

mjak

 

[2sisters]

If Norren located the parents of the two other boys and they identified their sons as missing why would they not be standing up next to Norren demanding an investigation??
Why would they, along with Noreen not be going on every talk show, speaking to investigators and demanding justice for their sons? Are we to believe they would just ask Noreen to please remove their sons picture and go on with their lives content to believe this is what happened to their child? Every male that Norren has contact with who does not validate her becomes a suspect for pedafilia and potentialy one of the ring. My heart breaks for this women. I have read her book and it is in my opnion the ramblings of a mentally Ill women. I hope she gets the help she needs and maybe someday the athorities will really find out what happened to Johnny. A man in florida has come forward to the invistiagator who said he investigated thoes photos in the 70's and claims he is one of the boys in the picture and none of the boys are Johnny Gosch. I believe him.

mjak

exactly, instead they asked her to remove the pictures. ?????

 

[Roy Harrold]

In response to Noreen Gosch's latest disparaging remarks about police:

www.johnnygosch.com

a little reality check -

# of arrests for sex crimes, resulting from Noreen Gosch's investigations 1983-2004 = 0
# of arrests for sex crimes, resulting from legitimate law enforcement investigations, 1983-2004 = 4,105,000 (rounded by thousands) (US figures)

 

[cappuccina]

...the more delusional types of conspiracy theories is that things that make "total common sense" just don't happen....as you both said...

Insguru...Perhaps there could have been two people working together, but I really don't think so....The reason for that is that the noise and motion of 2 adults would cause too much attention to be paid to what they were doing...My guess is that it was one perp. with a gun who very quietly told Johnny to either come with him on foot and "act natural", or more likely, told him to get in a car, and was probably tied up or restrianed somehow as well.

Remember in the Jacob Wetterling case, there were three boys of a similar age who probably could have "taken" the guy if he didn't have a gun...

I guarantee that there was a gun invovled in kidnapping this child...

Roy - I totally agree with you that the police/detective work in this case was abysmal. However, there is absolutlely no correlation between lousy police work and the existence of some grand conspiracy here. This is very much like the Jacob Wetterling case...a smaller community with an inexperienced (in terms of dealing with serious violent cases) police force...

 

[Roy Harrold]

Cappucino said: "Roy - I totally agree with you that the police/detective work in this case was abysmal"

I believe you've understood my point backward...

 

[docwho3]

Cappucino said: "Roy - I totally agree with you that the police/detective work in this case was abysmal"

I believe you've understood my point backward...

Sounded to me as if your post was meant to show that noreens website was not realistic in its remarks about L.E. doing poorly. In other words, you felt her website was wrong in saying bad things about the police work. You posted stats to back up your point. Is that a correct understanding of what you meant?

 

[Roy Harrold]

Sounded to me as if your post was meant to show that noreens website was not realistic in its remarks about L.E. doing poorly. In other words, you felt her website was wrong in saying bad things about the police work. You posted stats to back up your point. Is that a correct understanding of what you meant?

Yes, thank you!

And that her insinuation that she could do a better job, personally, of investigating crimes against persons is also unsupported by the facts.