IA IA - Johnny Gosch, 12, West Des Moines, 5 Sept 1982 #4

[Jbrown324320]

the website for Camp Caribou has "Regnum Christi" at the top. That is one of the groups founded by Marcel Maciel. I have been reading up about his other group- Legionaires of Christ. Canadian parents claimed it was a cult type group with a form of mind control.

http://www.rickross.com/reference/loc/loc30.html

shergal- I think Dateline would have more resources (money, researchers, power to influcence opinions) to research this horrible stuff than we do. Someone should be notified.

 

[Jbrown324320]

Legionaires of christ recruit boys between 11 and 12. This is an excerpt from an article from a member of the Legion (he admits the group brainwashes people and it is sort of a cult):

"...The Legion recruits many young people, the younger the better, in their mid teens for the novitiate, even earlier for their Vocation Centers. In these schools boys as young as 11 and 12 are influenced and guided toward a life in the Legion. These schools exist at least in Mexico, Spain and the U.S. (Center Harbor New Hampshire). The idea is to influence the person as early as possible, to “form” that person in the spirit of the Legion so that no other influence can distort or stain his vocation and ‘legionary personality”. He must be removed from any other influence. The youthfulness and immaturity of the candidate make him vulnerable to brainwashing.


Once in the order the person is subjected to the most intensive “formation” program, i.e. brainwashing. The Legion’s for this is ‘formation’. Brainwashing is brought about by a combination of different elements which influence and control the person with great effectiveness: for example, ‘spiritual direction’ and ‘confession’. Canon Law states that seminarians and religious should have complete freedom to choose a confessor and spiritual director. In the Legion that is not the case, there is no freedom at all: all Legionaries have spiritual direction and confession with their Superiors, in the novitiate, through their years of formation and even as priests. This is an aberration because it places the person completely in the control of the superior. It means that that superior who recommends or not a person for promotion to vows or orders or positions of responsibility in the order has access to the internal conscience of the person in question. Confession and spiritual direction are essentially tools in the hands of the Legion to brainwash the individuals to stay in the Legion, to convince them that they have a vocation from God to the Legion, to conform totally with the Legion and the wishes of the superiors, and a way in which the Legion gains total access to the conscience and mind of the person. Legionaries are constantly exhorted to tell the superior/ spiritual director everything , to hold back nothing, to have no secrets. Other tools of ‘brainwashing’ are the continuous series of conferences, talks,retreats,exhortations that the communities constantly receive and which repeat and reinforce the essential message. "

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=00ACOa

 

[concentric]

Some TV news show like Dateline or 20/20 needs to do an expose on this whole mess.

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/03/14/secretive-catholic-order-founded-by-accused-pedophile-under-fire/

 

[Jbrown324320]

sick stuff
what if Jacob and Johnny were "recruited" for the legionaires of christ?

 

[concentric]

In this article: over 20 men said that he sexually molested them when they were teenagers, and, also his two sons.
______________________
When Omar and Jose were boys, they say Maciel took them on trips to Europe and the U.S., where he had sex with them numerous times. In an interview, attorney Jose Bonilla, who represents Estela and her children, told ABC News the alleged molestation stopped when the two boys reached mid-adolescence.

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/legio...father-mexican-men-molested/story?id=10009430

 

[human]

this is so revolting and it continues to be covered up and ignored.

These "people" are not hiding from God. God sees and knows all in case they think they are getting away with anything.

NOT!!!

 

[SheWhoMustNotBeNamed]

AIRING NOW ON NANCY GRACE AMERICA'S MISSING!


Johnny Gosch: Nancy Grace America's Missing

At 12-years-old Johnny Gosch was making his own money. He had a paper route in his neighborhood in West Des Moines, Iowa. On September 5, 1982 Johnny left for his paper route just before dawn taking only the family dog and a wagon with him.

He was seen picking up his newspapers at the paper drop but he was never seen again. It was not until customers along Johnny route called his parents to complain of undelivered papers that they realized anything was wrong. The boy’s father walked around the neighborhood at around 6AM but only found his son’s wagon, still full of newspapers just two blocks away from their home. Gosch’s case would go on to be one of the most publicized missing person’s story, but after 28 years Johnny has yet to come home.

http://nancygrace.blogs.cnn.com/

 

[cluciano63]

I'm having trouble believing the various sightings, the signed dollar bill, and especially, the mom's story about her son as a grown man coming to her doorstep...alleged phone call to the mom.

One expert on the show made a good point, Johnny was only the 2nd child to be on a milk carton, which was a huge deal back then, and caused a multitude of sightings, and could also cause the kind of pranks that people still do with regards to missing persons.

Also Pat Brown had a good point, that for the MOST part, sex trafficking rings have plenty of pools for children just from runaways, kids from broken homes, etc...picking them up in suburban neighborhoods is very, very rare.

It is my opinion this was a regular (excuse the word) sex offender who grabbed Johnny and that he was dead soon afterward...

 

[trigger]

On NG tonight.

Vanishes without a trace while on paper route. His wagon found 2 blocks from his home filled with papers.

Witnesses..possibly a Ford Fairmont blue car or black pulls up and asks for directions from Johnny. At that point the car whips around talks to an adult to finsih off the directions and leaves. Then trail goes cold.

Then moms phone rings from Johnny customers wondering where their newspapers are. His dad goes out and finds his wagon filled with newspapers just 5 blocks away.

There were 2 brothers that saw Johnny talking to this man in the car. 10 minutes later the brothers did not see J but saw the newspapers. A neighbor who was in their bed heard a loud muffler looked out the window and saw a two tone car and saw the man but no J.

 

[concentric]

Every time I read about this story, I weep for Johnny and his mom. I think that I would believe the mom and the detective P.I. over what anyone else says.

 

[trigger]

In March 1997 her son showed up at her door step w/an unknown man. Talked for 2 hours, never saw him again. She wanted to call LE but he said not to call the police because there was possible danger lurking if LE got a hold of this info.
LE cannot verified this happen but cannot discount it didn't happen.

Private Investigator..James Rothstein. He was asked tonight about this story re: her son and said tonight he spoke to a individual in 2005 who told him that he was brought in out of retirement to go to Chicago to meet with people to arraigned and set the rules for J to go home to meet his mother.

PI feels there was a customer who paid anywhere from $2500 who was looking for a boy like Johnny, a newspapaer boy, its a fedius. PI states that is why there were a couple of other newspaper boys that were also involved, one in the area there and another somewhere else. :banghead:

MK feels that it could be the case. that there are over 200,000+ children who are victims in sex trade.

Portland Det.LE..he disagrees with PI and MK. Was a horrible tragedy that this boy was killed right after he was kidnapped.

Pat Brown..This sex trade thing..they do not kidnap alot of people, they don't have to, they use runaways, and children getting into prositution. They are not kidnapping everybody.

 

[concentric]

Here's what I think. Predators target some children and then leave some children surrounding the incidents, as a cover. This is what I think has happened in the Catholic church, for example. These pedophiles are very careful to create a buffer zone of children who are not molested so that if the child or family speaks out against the sexual abuse, they are viewed as crazy. Only a few are taken from one area, IMO.

I don't agree with Pat Brown's statement, btw. Some sicko paying a lot of money for a child would want an "untouched" product, not a runaway child prostitute. Disgusting pigs.

 

[tfrohning]

I watch this case and confused when did Johnny come to mom home and when did she reported this to LE?

This case really different than most cases. Really has me really confused?????

 

[trigger]

I watch this case and confused when did Johnny come to mom home and when did she reported this to LE?

This case really different than most cases. Really has me really confused?????

He came to her home in 1997. He was 27yo at that time.

 

[6angels]

I believe the mom. I believe She did not contact police when he was there in fear he would be killed.
I feel it's either 1 of 3 things.
1. mom is telling the truth.
2. mom is emoctionally unstable because of what happened to her son and believes what she says but its not the truth
3. Parents are involved.

I believe what she is saying. She got them photos somewhere .

 

[katydid23]

I believe the mom. I believe She did not contact police when he was there in fear he would be killed.
I feel it's either 1 of 3 things.
1. mom is telling the truth.
2. mom is emoctionally unstable because of what happened to her son and believes what she says but its not the truth
3. Parents are involved.

I believe what she is saying. She got them photos somewhere .

i don't think the parents were involved. I believe the mom and i believe her son came home briefly. I think it is like the investigator on NG described.
Some of the captured kids would be disposed of, while others, for whatever reasons, would stay and become part of the operation. That is really sad imo. To have to make the choice, as a child, to become evil in order to stay alive.

But he still loved his mom and for some reason had the need and the opportunity to tell her he was alive. wow

 

[6angels]

i don't think the parents were involved. I believe the mom and i believe her son came home briefly. I think it is like the investigator on NG described.
Some of the captured kids would be disposed of, while others, for whatever reasons, would stay and become part of the operation. That is really sad imo. To have to make the choice, as a child, to become evil in order to stay alive.

But he still loved his mom and for some reason had the need and the opportunity to tell her he was alive. wow

I don't believe the parents did either. I was just saying them are the only 3 things I could think. I believe number 1 I posted. I believe the mom.

 

[justaparent]

Johnny Gosch's mother sure isn't a fan of Nancy Grace (and she's right, Nancy is horrible to just about everyone who's on the show; I personally cannot watch it).

http://www.johnnygosch.com/

 

[peeples]

I grew up hearing from my mom anytime I wanted to go somewhere alone... "Remember Johnny Gosch"??

I believe this woman loves her son very much... I do think those photos are probably him....
I do not believe he is still with us

He's a middle aged man now if he were alive... nothing to fear by coming forward.

 

[starburst]

I was just looking at this man that is unidentified in Colorado. Found dead a few months AFTER his mom said he came to visit her. Supposedly she hasnt heard anything from him since..though if I were her, I would keep it secret too until I knew he was not in danger. Anyhow...I saw the unidentified picture first, then the pictures of Johhny and what struck me was the gap between the teeth. See if you think its possible. Would make sense that he was living a transient life if he really thought he was in danger.

Possible Match: Johhny: (PHOTOS FROM JUSTICEFORJOHNNY.COM)

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13972&stc=1&d=1299312276

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13973&stc=1&d=1299312410

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13974&stc=1&d=1299312410

THE UNIDENTIFIED PHOTO

Case File 174UMCO THE DOE NETWORK

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13975&stc=1&d=1299312614


ANY COMMENTS? Sorry I still cant stick the pictures in my post. Computer challenged.