ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 67

[r3d-ros3]

Yeah I think the idea he had an office at the university makes it sound a lot nicer than in all likelihood it was. I still remember my fellow TAs and I being shown our offices for the first time. We were super excited until we saw them and were like, "It's just a random room with several desks and chairs?" It looked like a utility closet. LOL

Even if his was nicer, I bet he was sharing it with multiple other students and wasn't there for more than a couple of hours a week anyway. We were required to maintain about 3 office hours a week, though people stayed longer, mainly to socialize with other TAs. I don't know what WSU's policy is for their TAs on how long they're required to be on campus in an office.

Had the same experience, lol.

The warrant actually gives the full names of the two other WSU students he shared the office with, which I thought was... interesting. (interesting as in, probably their names should have been redacted)

 

[Crashman]

you guys, they found a glove and a bloody pillow

Police find 'blood' on items in apartment of suspected Idaho killer

Unsealed court documents reveal that police investigating the murder of four University of Idaho students discovered several 'blood stains' in suspected killer Bryan Kohberger 's apartment.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I am surprised they did not seize the drain trap from his shower.

 

[Nova]

Oh, I understand all the possible scenarios. I was responding to a comment that agreed with LE in that all 4 were the target.

Sorry if I seemed to be "man-splaining". I was responding in general and not just to you.

I think we should remember to consider simpler scenarios and that BK is not a master criminal from a Marvel Comics movie. I'm sure you'll agree. LOL.

 

[layer]

I don't think the PCA was the clearest about it, per se, but my interpretation was it was there more to support D's account of someone walking toward her room around 4:20 am. So, it's not a vital piece of evidence but does provide some mild substantiation for her claim and for their surmise that follows--he left shortly after the murders without lingering in the house, which the outside surveillance footage also confirms. MOO

I guess, but because of the weird intersection in front of DM's door the killer had to pass through there three times, no matter what.

 

[sripey]

In the items seized, LE individually lists 3 x potential hair and 1 x potential hair strand.

What differentiates hair from a hair strand? Also, was that the totality of all hair found in the house, or are they specifically seizing hair that would be distinct from BK's hair? Anyone here have any expertise on this?

 

[NoSpoonFeeding]

Fair enough, try this one. And this one.

Thanks
Re dog hair/dog dna
The first one is a cat, the 2nd one is a dog hair with a root. Both are a good read and not off-topic as there may be animal hair involved, per the search warrant.

THE CAT'S HAIR TOLD THE STORY: MURDER, SCIENTIST SAID DNA EVIDENCE WAS FIRST OF ITS KIND ADMITTED

Proved Guilty by a Hair

* Prosecutors are using animal DNA to win murder and assault convictions. Though still rare, the practice could become a valuable forensic tool.

www.latimes.com

 

[sleuth.sloth]

On a simpler note, what so up with all these Bryans/Brians? Laundrie, Kohburger, Walsh, it is crazy.

Never trust a Brian (unless, of course, it’s Brian Entin.)

 

[esayer]

IMO the knife is somewhere off road on the Geness ID route he took back to Pullman after the murders.

He realized the sheath was missing went back to the King Road house at 9:12am and checked where he parked. Went back home and continued clean up. At 12:45 he is down in Clarkton returning the clothing items he had laundered to Walmart (and Marshalls??). Later that day he turns phone back off and travels same route he took after murders to see if he could find where he tossed knife to check (hoping upon hope) it was lost at that spot.

he clearly would use gloves during the murder but he easily could have not being using gloves when he first took the knife out of the sheath at an earlier time...fully confident he could wipe it and ditch with the knife later. He didn't count on a victim tearing it off or a cheap Dickies belt loop not holding or clip not holding.

Yes I agree with most except laundering clothes sounds iffy to me. IMO in my mind I see him with a messy place and office just like every prof I ever had. I see him buying a special murder outfit he would wear just once then discard. And as someone who wears Dickies work clothes depending on the item, yeah the loops aren't going to hold up to much pressure and would be too flimsy for that knife.

My question is: was he actually stupid enough to buy that knife at Walmart, keep the receipt, and...was he planning on returning it? LOL. Do they sell those at Walmart? There are too many moving parts to process this as a sleuth IMO. Can't imagine BK could have actually buttoned up every single detail especially if he has a 'professor' type personality. He gave it the ole college try though.

 

[Nila Aella]

I’m just visualizing the defense asking the guy how closely he’s studied the hair of golden doodles? How many different ones has he compared? “Remember, you’re speaking under oath! You gave a percentage chance of these hairs both being from the same dog. Is that based on science, or is it based on the fact that the prosecution is paying you?”

“Objection, your honor!”

(Note that I’m lousy at thinking up cross-examination questions.)

But I wondered if DNA comparison might be less controversial—since experts do it more often.

Laughing - love the questions!
IMO With morphology I don't even think they can even say a percentage. Just that the structure and color are consistent. So it doesn't match a dachshund, or doberman, or shih tzu....but is consistent with a doodle in structure and the color matches Murphy. Better than nothing. DNA is absolutely best. JMO
The hair will probably come back as cat hair! lol

 

[Kdot112]

I'm still having a hard time trying to figure out why not the other 2 then? If it was planned, then surely he knew 2 others occupied the house too. Why were they left untouched? In the beginning we (most of us, anyway) thought it could have been because their bedroom doors were locked. Now we know that wasn't the case. It appears BK made absolutely zero effort to go after either and both of them. MOO

I don’t think his goal was ever to eradicate the house. I think he was only itching to kill and couldn’t resist after pulling up to the rarely docile house that he’d been monitoring for months.

I also think he thought the cops had surely been called by the time he passed dm.

 

[Vegasgrl]

IMO, he didn't need to "wash up" anywhere because he was wearing an overall type of suit, gloves, booties and a mask that covered most of his body (except his eyes and forehead -- upper face or whole head if he didn't cover his hair) that he disrobed from and got rid of along with the knife and other items somewhere after the murders, and before he returned to his apartment.

And he could have had plenty of wet wipes in a pocket or sleeve or container in his car to clean off his face/hands/extremities & parts of his car that he had touched after leaving and disrobing/disposing of things after the crimes with before going home. And there has been discussion here on WS from OP (around Thread 49 IIRC) that he could have gone to a campground shower to clean off further when his cell was pinged several hours away that morning.

Everything may seem to be a stretch in this case to alot of people who don't think BK would have "gone outside the norm" to pull off these murders, which could be the case, or he could surprise everyone. JMOO

But, he left his eyebrows exposed (per live witness). Bushy eyebrows. I really hope they find more DNA from the scene as they continue with labs.

 

[XtremeScorpio]

I think that got debunked

Wait, what? That wasn't true?

I'm sorry, I am so far behind in these threads.

 

[Curious Me]

Did he leave red herrings around his apt. to play with investigators heads? I can't help but wonder. Pretty sure that, no matter what, there was something damning found in his apt. ​

A glove, 'reddish' pillow and receipts seized from Idaho murder suspect's home

A newly-released search warrant alleges that Idaho student murders suspect Bryan Kohberger planned the fatal stabbings.

www.usatoday.com

"A black glove, a stained pillow and receipts from Walmart and Marshalls were among items seized from the apartment of a criminology major accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students, according to court documents released Tuesday."

"Among the items investigators took from the Pullman, Washington, apartment of Bryan Kohberger were possible hair strands, a pillow with a "reddish/brown stain," a computer tower, a "nitrite type" black glove, receipts, mattress covers and an Amazon Fire TV stick, a search warrant unsealed by the Whitman County Superior Court says."​

 

[ArmChairDet]

Yes I agree with most except laundering clothes sounds iffy to me. IMO in my mind I see him with a messy place and office just like every prof I ever had. I see him buying a special murder outfit he would wear just once then discard. And as someone who wears Dickies work clothes depending on the item, yeah the loops aren't going to hold up to much pressure and would be too flimsy for that knife.

My question is: was he actually stupid enough to buy that knife at Walmart, keep the receipt, and...was he planning on returning it? LOL. Do they sell those at Walmart? There are too many moving parts to process this as a sleuth IMO. Can't imagine BK could have actually buttoned up every single detail especially if he has a 'professor' type personality. He gave it the ole college try though.

I can imagine the knife being the one item he covered well. Probably had time to plan and if he had any criminology knowledge that he applied this was it.

IMO there is a high probably it came from the military surplus store that appears to be in Pullman and was purchased with cash.

 

[layer]

I really hope they find more DNA from the scene as they continue with labs.

I'm more leaning the other way. I hope they find the victims' DNA on BK's belongings, in his car. Murphy's hair will also do.

 

[Twistinginthewind]

I must admit my mind has been running wild with ideas as to why this and why that in this case because it is so unusual in that there is seemingly no clear reason why these four young people at the prime of their lives were just brutally murdered "in their sleep".

Not that a reason would change the outcome, but I believe it would help people make sense of this tragedy and hopefully pave the way for healing & working towards positive change in eliminating the reason(s)/"doing something about it" if there were something specific that could be addressed If At All Possible. ETA: and Get Justice for The Victims

I also want to say I think every member posting here on WS on this case & all of the amazing Moderators have been just incredible/their 'best selves' have shone through and all have been very admirable in expressing their empathy for the victims & their loved ones & giving insights & trying to aid in the sleuthing that could help to solve this terrible crime.

MOO, and thanks to you all in this community of volunteer helpers aka websleuthers, you're the best! twisting....

 

[XtremeScorpio]

Did I somehow lose the right to edit my own post?

10ofRods clarified his/her use of terms in a later post and I wanted to delete my post as shown above. The system is giving me no "edit" option, unfortunately, though it is allowing me to reply to myself.

Sorry, 10. This thread is on fire and I was catching up...

(ETA I can edit THIS post, so that previous one must have been a glitch in the Matrix.)

That's happened with me before. I think you lose the ability to edit after a certain amount of time. I know it doesn't make sense but that's how its happened. IDK

 

[Copper107]

In the items seized, LE individually lists 3 x potential hair and 1 x potential hair strand.

What differentiates hair from a hair strand? Also, was that the totality of all hair found in the house, or are they specifically seizing hair that would be distinct from BK's hair? Anyone here have any expertise on this?

Some "hair" is minus the root. The resulting analysis would be myocardia DNA. Just opinion on this topic.

 

[WildWest]

He realized the sheath was missing went back to the King Road house at 9:12am and checked where he parked. Went back home and continued clean up. At 12:45 he is down in Clarkton returning the clothing items he had laundered to Walmart (and Marshalls??). Later that day he turns phone back off and travels same route he took after murders to see if he could find where he tossed knife to check (hoping upon hope) it was lost at that spot.

I didn't know retailers would take back laundered clothes? I tried to returns a pair of denim jeans that shrank terribly and and was turned away at my Walmart.

 

[Cindizzi]

Oh no...not a single black glove again!! Im having OJ flashbacks

I respectively and highly disagree...MOO what we "know" so far and what was on the PCA is all circumstantial. Any good defense attorney (and BCK has one) can certainly poke holes all in it and show reasonable doubt, many defense attorneys have resonated this in SM and even on WS.
For him to be buried in a conviction LE better have a lot more before the trial begins, I think they will.

[…]


“How many of us have seen in movies or TV, ‘Oh, it’s just a circumstantial evidence case’?” said Norman M. Garland, a professor at Southwestern College of Law in Los Angeles and author of several books on the rules of evidence. “That’s just a misnomer, a misconception.”
Dismissive judgments of evidence as “simply circumstantial” reflect a “lack of true consideration of what’s involved,” Garland, who has been both a prosecutor and a defense attorney, said in an interview. Not only can circumstantial evidence be extraordinarily persuasive, but it can often be stronger than direct evidence — stronger than eyewitness testimony or even, sometimes, a confession.

[…]

And that is where the public gets its misconception about circumstantial evidence. The fact that a case is circumstantial does not mean that it is weak. It simply means that jurors must weigh the evidence and take the second step of reaching an independent conclusion.

“I am always astonished by the view that abounds in our society that circumstantial evidence is somehow not good enough,” Garland said. “... Circumstantial evidence is nothing more than what we live by on a daily basis as a matter of common sense.”

‘Circumstantial’ — the Scarlet C?

Forget everything you saw on “Perry Mason” — most convictions are won on circumstantial evidence, which the law says carries the same weight as direct eyewitness testimony.

www.nbcnews.com