ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 70

[WingsOverTX]

I'm back at school myself and haven't had a chance to post or comment, and I've tried keeping up with the threads and posts.

JMO, If guilty, etc.,
I am just interested in anyone else's thoughts on BK committing multiple murders as part of research for his thesis. I have suggested this before and had some feedback regarding BK thinking rationally, but I am looking for hypothetical feedback as if he is not thinking rationally.
As a hypothetical example for my theory, BK wants his thesis to be regarding pre or post-emotions, his survey results are mixed, but he wants to prove a point.
He proves his point...
Whatever that point may be.
JMO

If so, I would say that might be used as a "pre-text" for his thoughts but the surprise-murder of four young, vibrant people at home so up close & personally in the cover of night with a large knife is the action of a person much more complicated & psychologically deranged than someone carrying out a research experiment.

We may never understand the why because the nature of these crimes is outside the realm of any logic except the spiritual. He is evil.

JMO

 

[gizmobtj]

I'm back at school myself and haven't had a chance to post or comment, and I've tried keeping up with the threads and posts.

JMO, If guilty, etc.,
I am just interested in anyone else's thoughts on BK committing multiple murders as part of research for his thesis. I have suggested this before and had some feedback regarding BK thinking rationally, but I am looking for hypothetical feedback as if he is not thinking rationally.
As a hypothetical example for my theory, BK wants his thesis to be regarding pre or post-emotions, his survey results are mixed, but he wants to prove a point.
He proves his point...
Whatever that point may be.
JMO

Sure. All things are possible. We would generally find the murder of four people illogical, so the motive could be as well.

I keep going back to the theory that he lacked emotions and just wanted to feel ... anything

 

[WingsOverTX]

I can't help but wonder what BK's parents are thinking about this COI debate. And what advice they would give to their son about who should defend him. And what effect it would have on him and the decisions he has to make going forward to trial.

I think I have a new respect for how pretrial publicity (MSM & social media) may affect so many different aspects of the decisions made before the trial even begins. And the effects those decisions could have on the outcome of the trial.

I have an opinion that I think he looks pretty darn guilty right now. But my priority is not to have a jury find him guilty. My highest priority is that he have a fair and honest trial. And I don't want my opinion to derail a fair trial. Word are powerful. I must watch my words more carefully.

MOO

Isn't his defense a matter of choice by the state alone? I don't see where he or his parents have any actual influence on the state.

Unless he retains counsel (or acts as his own attorney) instead of relying on the state's limited ability to find an attorney QUALIFIED to represent him, I'm not sure his parent's opinions have any influence.

Mea culpa if my viewpoint does not fit his particular legal circumstances.

 

[WingsOverTX]

IMO, Characterising AT as having "multiple ties to the victim's families" isn't really that accurate, MOO, and could imply personal relationships or anything really, IMO. My understanding is that she has represented three parents of the victims in the past in her role as as a Public Defender, so the" ties" are those of PD-client nature and the number is three. MOO

Three parents of two out of four victims having been represented by her on other matters is pretty multiple in this particular context IMO.

 

[gizmobtj]

Three parents of two out of four victims having been represented by her on other matters is pretty multiple in this particular context IMO.

Are the three confirmed by name? I saw the Newsweek article mentioning CK(N) and two others - but no names. Do we know if any of them were currently represented?

Edited: Found it

Bryan Kohberger Public Defender Represented Father and Stepmother of Murder Victim Madison Mogen

Court records obtained by Inside Edition Digital list Anne Taylor as a member of the defense team on closed criminal cases involving Benjamin Mogen and his wife, Korie Hatrock.

www.insideedition.com

Bryan Kohberger defense attorney represented Maddie Mogen's dad

The lawyer representing the only suspect in the brutal slayings of four University of Idaho students in the town of Moscow in November has multiple ties to the victims' parents.

www.google.com

 

[Nila Aella]

Are the three confirmed by name? I saw the Newsweek article mentioning CK(N) and two others - but no names. Do we know if any of them were currently represented?

Edited: Found it

Bryan Kohberger Public Defender Represented Father and Stepmother of Murder Victim Madison Mogen

Court records obtained by Inside Edition Digital list Anne Taylor as a member of the defense team on closed criminal cases involving Benjamin Mogen and his wife, Korie Hatrock.

www.insideedition.com

Bryan Kohberger defense attorney represented Maddie Mogen's dad

The lawyer representing the only suspect in the brutal slayings of four University of Idaho students in the town of Moscow in November has multiple ties to the victims' parents.

www.google.com

I have noticed a few articles name AT as active attorney on 1 case. Some other aticles name her as inactive attorney on multiple cases. Some articles don't mention whether she was active or inactive attorney on the case. I believe being active or inactive matters and it just isn't clear to me which cases she was actually active on, except CN's case. JMO

 

[jepop]

Are the three confirmed by name? I saw the Newsweek article mentioning CK(N) and two others - but no names. Do we know if any of them were currently represented?

Edited: Found it

Bryan Kohberger Public Defender Represented Father and Stepmother of Murder Victim Madison Mogen

Court records obtained by Inside Edition Digital list Anne Taylor as a member of the defense team on closed criminal cases involving Benjamin Mogen and his wife, Korie Hatrock.

www.insideedition.com

Bryan Kohberger defense attorney represented Maddie Mogen's dad

The lawyer representing the only suspect in the brutal slayings of four University of Idaho students in the town of Moscow in November has multiple ties to the victims' parents.

www.google.com

None of them would be currently represented by AT, as AT is representing BK. That is not the issue with the public COI debate as represented in MSM and sm. MOO
ETA: BBM, spelling
ETA: IMO,the News Week Article and a Yahoo article reporting from the Idaho Statesman story chose not to name the victims' parents (who are also victims of these terrible crimes).

Kohberger attorney represented parent of victim in Moscow homicides before taking his case

“Each lawyer needs to assess the possibility of a conflict with the ethical rule in front of her, and talk with clients,” a veteran legal expert said.

news.yahoo.com

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Isn't his defense a matter of choice by the state alone? I don't see where he or his parents have any actual influence on the state.

Unless he retains counsel (or acts as his own attorney) instead of relying on the state's limited ability to find an attorney QUALIFIED to represent him, I'm not sure his parent's opinions have any influence.

Mea culpa if my viewpoint does not fit his particular legal circumstances.

Yes, WingsOverTX, I agree.
I was thinking he had to sign/agree to formally accept AT as his PD since she had formerly represented the parents? I may well have misunderstood.
But, if that were the case, it occurred to me that based on what his parents have gleaned from so much public comment, they would have formed their own opinion on whether or not she would be the best choice. And I imagine they would share their recommendation with their son and influence his decision.
It made me realize the powerful ripple effect of MSM/social media. If I am wrong about his rights to reject her as his PD then, of course, my entire stream of thought is moot. (Which would not be unusual, lol!!!

 

[Zella]

Yes, WingsOverTX, I agree.
I was thinking he had to sign/agree to formally accept AT as his PD since she had formerly represented the parents? I may well have misunderstood.
But, if that were the case, it occurred to me that based on what his parents have gleaned from so much public comment, they would have formed their own opinion on whether or not she would be the best choice. And I imagine they would share their recommendation with their son and influence his decision.
It made me realize the powerful ripple effect of MSM/social media. If I am wrong about his rights to reject her as his PD then, of course, my entire stream of thought is moot. (Which would not be unusual, lol!!!

My understanding is it's hard to fire your PD. I think a lot of people complain about them and try to get it to happen, but for the judge to move forward, you really need to show that it's a justifiable request.

I actually used to work with a guy who went onto commit a pretty heinous crime. He was appointed public defenders and ended up having a rather public feud with them. (Oh and the judge. He was pretty unhinged, and I never had an inkling of that when I worked with him.) Ultimately, they were not removed from the case, and honestly, I don't think his issues with them had any merit. He ended up doing what they'd suggested all along, which was plead guilty due to the massive amounts of evidence against him and eat his life sentence. MOO

 

[al66pine]

Daily Mail Phrasing: A.T. & Students' Parents.

IMO, Characterising AT as having "multiple ties to the victim's families" isn't really that accurate, MOO, and could imply personal relationships or anything really, IMO. My understanding is that she has represented three parents of the victims in the past in her role as as a Public Defender, so the" ties" are those of PD-client nature and the number is three. MOO

@jepop I noticed it too. Instead of "multiple ties to the victim's families" wouldn't something like this --

AT represented three of the students' parents on criminal charges

--- be more accurate? No relationships other than atty-client AFAIK.

<modsnip>

 

[Sillybilly]

Hey folks,

If you don't like a source, please just scroll and roll without name calling or disrespectful comments. Members are welcome to disagree with the content of an article, but please do so without resorting to ridicule or nasty remarks.

It's not Websleuths style. Please keep it respectful.

Thank you.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Even well laid plans for murdering another fall short if's one's bloodlust takes over, thrill of the kill.

Or, as will happen, fantasy meets reality, in the form of a victim fighting bad, blood, smells, and other difficulties.

 

[Cool Cats]

Hey folks,

If you don't like a source, please just scroll and roll without name calling or disrespectful comments. Members are welcome to disagree with the content of an article, but please do so without resorting to ridicule or nasty remarks.

It's not Websleuths style. Please keep it respectful.

Thank you.

This reminds me of that old saying:

"Don't kill the messenger"

If you don't like the message (article) then give feedback to the person who wrote the message (article) don't take it out on the messenger (poster).

 

[pittsburghgirl]

Doubt BK would admit he had an adequate defense if it meant a do over. He could carry that card for years, playing it at the opportune time.

Don't most people who are convicted file an appeal b

Isn't his defense a matter of choice by the state alone? I don't see where he or his parents have any actual influence on the state.

Unless he retains counsel (or acts as his own attorney) instead of relying on the state's limited ability to find an attorney QUALIFIED to represent him, I'm not sure his parent's opinions have any influence.

Mea culpa if my viewpoint does not fit his particular legal circumstances.

paywalled

I got the article by signing up for their email, same as last time.

 

[Cool Cats]

I have noticed a few articles name AT as active attorney on 1 case. Some other aticles name her as inactive attorney on multiple cases. Some articles don't mention whether she was active or inactive attorney on the case. I believe being active or inactive matters and it just isn't clear to me which cases she was actually active on, except CN's case. JMO

Bryan Kohberger Public Defender Represented Father and Stepmother of Murder Victim Madison Mogen

Court records obtained by Inside Edition Digital list Anne Taylor as a member of the defense team on closed criminal cases involving Benjamin Mogen and his wife, Korie Hatrock.

www.insideedition.com

 

[Scooterbolt]

Or, as will happen, fantasy meets reality, in the form of a victim fighting bad, blood, smells, and other difficulties.

Nicely put.

 

[TeaTime]

Blah, blah, blah. Discovery responses are "here's some of it and we will follow the rules and supplement this response as is required."

Standard.

 

[justwannahelp]

As @Cassady says, the PD seems to acknowledge the existence of a conflict in the Cara Kernodle case by moving to substitute conflicts counsel rather than assigning another deputy. That action resolved appropriately the conflict in that case.

The question whether AT has a conflict that would affect her representation of BK depends on something we don't know and probably won't know - whether Cara told her something in confidence that would be useful to BK's defense, but that she is constrained from disclosing by her attorney client relationship with Cara.

In normal circumstances and in a larger jurisdiction, I would agree with @Cassady that the PD would avoid even the appearance of a conflict by withdrawing in favor of outside counsel - regardless whether an actual conflict exists. The practicalities of such a policy in a small community with few LEGALLY qualified capital defense counsel undoubtedly plays a role in Idaho.

Yes i remember the options for PD being AT and the coroner so AT was chosen….

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Yes i remember the options for PD being AT and the coroner so AT was chosen….

Perhaps you’re misremembering — our coroner wasn’t ever under appointment consideration for BCK. She’s not a capital qualified PD & never has been:
Capital Defending Attorney Qualifications and Roster

MOO.

 

[Nova]

I'm back at school myself and haven't had a chance to post or comment, and I've tried keeping up with the threads and posts.

JMO, If guilty, etc.,
I am just interested in anyone else's thoughts on BK committing multiple murders as part of research for his thesis. I have suggested this before and had some feedback regarding BK thinking rationally, but I am looking for hypothetical feedback as if he is not thinking rationally.
As a hypothetical example for my theory, BK wants his thesis to be regarding pre or post-emotions, his survey results are mixed, but he wants to prove a point.
He proves his point...
Whatever that point may be.
JMO

I can't say your hypothesis is impossible, but the standards in academia for supporting a position with citations to peer-reviewed publications are pretty strict.

Whatever BK might "gain" in experience, it wouldn't necessarily be something he could argue in a dissertation unless he had serious support from preexisting scholarship.

It's not a perfect analogy, but I did a doctoral program in theater without, in most cases, ever seeing the plays and productions I wrote about. I suppose I relied on my professional experience in a very general way, but my own ideas had to be supported by research I could cite.

If BK's motive were scholarly, the risk far outweighed any reward, IMHO.