ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 20

[Sister Golden Hair]

Your opinion is shared by virtually every single attorney IMO.

I agree, too. And take an attorney when you go. but go.

 

[Tillicum]

Most obvious guess: he sent her something. I believe the killer became enchanted online, and I think time was running out, so I believe he may have upped his game. he may have toyed with her (K or M or both -but I think K, and I think around Halloween was the tipping point). As part of the upping, he may have sent her something to her physical address.

So possibly DNA on sealed envelope? Fingerprints? Handwriting analysis? Printer/ink comparisons?

 

[NuttMegg]

Lawrence said something last night in regards to his source on this case and the morning they were found. He said he was told that a surviving roommate and frat guy actually saw one of the victims. SG said he didn’t know anything about that and it was just dropped. Is that correct?

i don't recall the reporter saying that. Re a surviving roommate and frat guy seeing anything.

 

[kittythehare]

I would think that alibi information is confidential, except for legal proceedings in the future, if needed. Why would they share that information with any of the families?

Unless the parents have received specific information about a suspect that LE has already 'cleared'?
Something they believe but that LE won't apparently consider?

Of course LE quite possibly are considering the same person but recognise family is too fragile and vulnerable right now to let them know that. But all the more reason to sit with them and give them time so they at least understand why LE cannot disclose that information?

It's all so human, all so understandable.
Do they actually have a suspect in mind?
Is it the same suspect the family might have?

I honestly have not the faintest idea.

 

[MissNightshade]

very interesting
so it's possible that the front door was changed to solid very recently.

or when you say ' old photo to hand' do you mean that this photo with glass door is in fact a very old photo?
( it's photographed in the fall, the same red vehicle)

Not very old...just maybe from beginning of school year where the landlord would start listing the house. I could see a landlord just keeping a photo on file to use each time they list the home.
Wondering if the plywood was brought in to cover something though. There is a slider door around back. "Rent college pads" has disabled the listing (maybe so the public can't see the rooms?) But apartments. com has this house listed already and updated 2 weeks ago. Gross.

I read there was a dog on-site that was unharmed and taken to a shelter. Pretty certain the dog would have been barking like crazy during the murders. No one mentioned hearing barking though.

 

[Fritosun]

MOO
I owned a home with a sliding glass door going out to the back deck of my home. I would grill out there and every day, even in the winter I would go sit on the deck to relax and enjoy the wildlife. (unless it was below 20 degrees lol).
Well since I used the sliding doors so frequently, the handle that was metal with a wooden handle top, became loose after years of opening and closing. Towards the end, it became harder to push the door all the way closed to ensure the latch would lock. I finally had to have a contractor replace the handle to the door.
So with that said, is it possible that due to the frequent use of that sliding door, the same thing happened to that house and they just said forget about it we do not need to lock it or fix it right now?
I understand that a lock was fixed in either Xana's bedroom or the front door according to this article.

With so many people coming and going, surely some guests knew that the sliding door did not lock (moo).

Also, MOO, there is no way that the killer did not know that there were 3 stories in that home, I find it hard to fathom that anyone would only see the back way with a drop off behind the home and no street that you can go down that leads to the back. (I am horrible with describing what I am thinking sorry but I hope I am making sense).
Even if someone was never in the home before, how could anyone miss the fact that there are 3 stories? I doubt that the killer(s) only ever saw the back of the home only.
My thoughts and my opinions only.

A cheap easy effective security enhancement for sliding doors and windows is a homemade "Charlie Bar" get a piece of wood at home depot or somewhere, of a width that will fit in the channel of the sliding part... and cut it to the length where it fits in and prohibits the door from sliding.

 

[Birmingplumb]

That is information that hasn’t been made public nor should it be.

SG is so determined to solve this his own way, that there is a strong chance he would attempt to make contact with key witnesses.

Pray he does not...go over edge.. Enough tragedy for family.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

So possibly DNA on sealed envelope? Fingerprints? Handwriting analysis? Printer/ink comparisons?

Just speculating here…. maybe the perp was mailing her things & that is why she felt she had a “stalker”? This happened to me (amongst other things) when I was stalked many years ago. Yes, regular USPS mailings!

 

[Ghostwheel]

It is obvious to me LE has spoken with SG and asked him to dial it down. Whatever they said made an impression as he chose his words carefully on the followup interview.

 

[Murphy1950]

very interesting
so it's possible that the front door was changed to solid very recently.

or when you say ' old photo to hand' do you mean that this photo with glass door is in fact a very old photo?
( it's photographed in the fall, the same red vehicle)

Google pics are dated. There was an earlier one from 2007. The door was solid as of 2021.

 

[journey9tails]

Perhaps not a second autopsy but certainly there was a comparison (either formal or informal) of the “means” of death.

P.S. I hope that SG gets some support & communication that he needs

Means of death: accident, suicide, homicide. Autopsy generally proves cause of death. Means of death is determined by the evidence, including the autopsy results.

 

[Sandy007]

very interesting
so it's possible that the front door was changed to solid very recently.

or when you say ' old photo to hand' do you mean that this photo with glass door is in fact a very old photo?
( it's photographed in the fall, the same red vehicle)

On the photographs, there are no windows on the top floor of the house overlooking the parking/front of the house). As we know from recent photographs, both rooms on the top 3rd floor where K and M lived had windows to th front and rear (K room has a slider not a window); the bathroom on the top floor also has a window on the recent photographs, but not on the old one

Without knowing the reg number of the car, is hard to say if it is the same one, besides it may belongs to the estate agent/property manager, so it presents no significance

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

So possibly DNA on sealed envelope? Fingerprints? Handwriting analysis? Printer/ink comparisons?

Bingo - and fingers crossed it's all of the above. but even if none of that is there, if it went through the us mail, postmark on it.

 

[scdiv]

I remember reading the Dan Morse book on the Lululemon murder in Bethesda and for five days (granted it wasn't 3 weeks), the detectives knew EXACTLY who they thought was responsible, but continued to treat the suspect like a victim or witness, kept communications open and friendly, and found "reasons" to keep bringing her back to the police station for questioning. "Oh we need to get your prints to rule you out," etc. The victim's family, coworkers, and the public never had any idea that police suspected the coworker. And in fact, LE did that intentionally to keep the suspect talking, still wanting to be seen as helpful, not lawyering up, and have her making contradictions that would later make it impossible to take the stand in court and have her own words used against her.

This is a good reference article on that tactic.... it doesn't surprise me one bit that LE would say publicly that they don't have a person of interest at this time. They could be carefully observing someone and gathering evidence to make their case. (Also reminds me of the Carolyn Byington case - it was MONTHS before any info was released - but police knew early on it was the coworker.) Of course you aren't going to reveal you think someone is a suspect, you want them to keep talking freely. Or ultimately get them to slip up and confess. (Also in the Chris Watts case - detectives suspected him early on, but then one detective plays good cop and offers an "out" - "we know you're a good guy, this isn't you, she just made you so mad right, and you snapped? Then had to kill the others as well?" Then once the suspect takes a bait, then they can really go to town and start interrogating. "But what about this wound," etc etc

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/jim-drewry-montgomery-detective-in-lululemon-homicide-case-can-uncover-lies-without-saying-a-word/2011/10/21/gIQAR8t74L_story.html

For five days, the detective let Brittany Norwood say whatever she wanted. Whether it was true didn’t really matter.

“There’s a saying,” the 61-year-old investigator explained in court in September. “ ‘Lie to me, please, lie to me.’ Sometimes, a provable lie is just as good as the truth.”

In his 23 years on the homicide squad, he came to view interviews as an attempt to peel back layers of an onion. On the outside were the lies — valuable in and of themselves. Further in, layers of half-truths, also valuable. At the core was the golden ring: a full confession.

Drewry also found that by not changing his expression, and often by not saying anything at all, suspects often felt that they needed to fill in the pregnant pause — by saying more.

 

[Cindizzi]

Not very old...just maybe from beginning of school year where the landlord would start listing the house. I could see a landlord just keeping a photo on file to use each time they list the home.
Wondering if the plywood was brought in to cover something though. There is a slider door around back. "Rent college pads" has disabled the listing (maybe so the public can't see the rooms?) But apartments. com has this house listed already and updated 2 weeks ago. Gross.

I read there was a dog on-site that was unharmed and taken to a shelter. Pretty certain the dog would have been barking like crazy during the murders. No one mentioned hearing barking though.

The family talks about the dog here :

https://twitter.com/x/status/1599097922788167682

 

[Sundog]

There are ways to get that info without involving the university or needing a warrant.

Go to the class, if they call roll then listen for the name Josh and watch who answers.
Ask students leaving if there is a Josh in class.
If they point to someone, ask if they can speak to him.

If Josh suddenly runs when he sees a uniformed officer- that speaks volumes.

If LE has a presence on campus it would not be odd. No one would assume this or that if they are talking to a lot oF students every day.
If LE has no presence on campus and one shows up to a class out of the blue, then it looks very bad.

Stalkers on Campus
I taught at the university level for over 20 years
I had a female student tell me a male student was coming to class and sitting in the back waiting for her and following her to her classes. He was not in my class. I asked a male student who was her friend to walk her to the security phone outside the building. He did. Both of us called PD. The guy was not a university student.
JMO

Faculty are mandated reporters. That means that if a student tells a faculty member that she is being stalked, or harassed in any way, then the faculty member is required by the university to contact the Title IX office. Faculty receive training on this every year as a refresh and the training is also mandatory, usually online and the training videos are very well done. Deans receive a list early in the fall semester indicating which faculty have not yet completed the training, and work with Department Chairs to ensure that it is completed. Universities don't mess around with this. They take it very seriously.

 

[DizzyB]

I think Steve wants LE to pick a leader, the alpha as he said. Is it safe out there? Let the students know if they should be worried. The targeted/not targeted bs. Have a liaison sit with the family every day, go through what is happening -is DNA starting to come in, are they working on digital stuff, conducting interviews. Keep them in the loop so they understand the timing and only share what will not jeopardize the case. Don’t ever let him feel that a day goes by that they aren’t tracking down every single thing they can. He feels so helpless and he has no idea where they are with anything.

 

[Thora_Jay]

A cheap easy effective security enhancement for sliding doors and windows is a homemade "Charlie Bar" get a piece of wood at home depot or somewhere, of a width that will fit in the channel of the sliding part... and cut it to the length where it fits in and prohibits the door from sliding.

Well of course I had a bar to prevent the door from sliding after playing around with attempting to lock it until I could get it fixed. Just saying that maybe the lock on the sliding door of the students home was not locking and it was common knowledge.

 

[shane13]

We can't imagine what Steve G is going thru. Not just the nightmare of losing his beloved daughter. But if she was the target, it might have been very gruesome. Recall what OJ did to Nicole and Ron with his knife.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

Means of death: accident, suicide, homicide. Autopsy generally proves cause of death. Means of death is determined by the evidence, including the autopsy results.

Sincere question: So how does SG know the “means” of death between KG & MM and the difference he alluded to? What is he using for comparison? He did state there was a difference & declined specifying who was targeted in the last two (most recent) interviews. I’d like to hear your take….