ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 34

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I feel so many people were coming in and out of that house to party on many occasions that anyone could have slipped in and blended in with the crowd. They would have known the layout of house and most likely entrance and exits! So…for some reason they are mad and in a rage … they go to the house, hangout, visit as normal and say good bye! BUT they go downstairs and don’t leave! They wait until they think everyone is asleep and pounce. The Moscow Police log has neighbors complaining about noise and very loud music back in Sept. So-unfortunately, I feel if someone heard something that lived close by they would think it was another party. I feel LE has a big job on this case due to all the mixed DNA in the house and all the people who were coming and going from the house!
I've been watching a lot of videos about the case and reading tons of threads. This was not only a well-known house when they were living there, but it has been for years! There's people that have claimed that they lived there when attending University of Idaho and it was always a party house. I believe that this is someone that was familiar with the victims, but you can't rule out this person may have been to the house before they even lived there. At the moment, I really believe that the house has to be examined the most, which I have no doubt LE are doing!

Also, if you go through Instagram you can see just how many students are at this house on a weekly basis. It would seem almost every University of Idaho student has been at this house. There's so many pictures of people at the house.
 
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I have been baffled by the absence of the County Sheriff in the investigation. The Sheriff has jurisdiction over the county, although the city of Moscow has local PD.
Anybody have a thought about that?
Its possible the Sheriff's department is covering Moscow a little more to free up city PD for the investigation. JMO
 
Seems like those three kept very close tabs on one another.

Kaylee was breaking away, and probably anticipating a new life in Texas, without the smothering attention of old connections.

JMHO

Whatever the reason for the breakup between Kaylee and JD, it appears that Kaylee was ambivalent about it based on the interview early on with her family. While she was staying with her family before her visit back to Moscow in mid-November, her family describe Kaylee's attempts to reach out to JD in the hopes that he would get together with her. According to her family, she made numerous attempts to engage with JD during that period. There is also the "drunk dialing" calls made to JD during the early morning hours of November 13th.

It may have been JD who was breaking away, for all we know.
 
I’m not personally convinced yet that perp(s) needed any special knowledge of the house, either via online lurking or previous acquaintance, in order to commit this crime. I find it just as plausible that a LACK of knowledge of the house’s layout may have resulted in extra people being killed. If the perp has 1 person in mind to target and opens the wrong door, BOOM, someone inadvertent who stirs in the slightest now has to be killed in order to continue on to the target. I just don’t see why going around taking wrong turns or opening doors to non-occupied rooms would be out of the question in this crime. Even opening a door to a room Murphy was in wouldn’t have changed the outcome since SG said Murphy wasn’t a barker. Just close the door and keep going.

I’m not suggesting the perp DIDN’T have familiarity of the home layout, just saying I don’t think it can be deduced one way or the other.
 
I have been baffled by the absence of the County Sheriff in the investigation. The Sheriff has jurisdiction over the county, although the city of Moscow has local PD.
Anybody have a thought about that?
I would guess that each state might handle it differently.

The task force for the Gainesville murders included being headed by ACSO (sheriff), FDLE (state), and GPD (local) plus ten Behavioral Specialists from FBI. Crime scene technicians and Investigators from both ACSO and GPD. Highway Patrol and FDLE representatives rounded out the task force.

This case has a large amount of FBI involvement which might change the needs for county involvement.


edit: one of the victims was in the Alachua county jurisdiction so that might have been responsible for ASCO involvement.
 
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I’m not personally convinced yet that perp(s) needed any special knowledge of the house, either via online lurking or previous acquaintance, in order to commit this crime. I find it just as plausible that a LACK of knowledge of the house’s layout may have resulted in extra people being killed. If the perp has 1 person in mind to target and opens the wrong door, BOOM, someone inadvertent who stirs in the slightest now has to be killed in order to continue on to the target. I just don’t see why going around taking wrong turns or opening doors to non-occupied rooms would be out of the question in this crime. Even opening a door to a room Murphy was in wouldn’t have changed the outcome since SG said Murphy wasn’t a barker. Just close the door and keep going.

I’m not suggesting the perp DIDN’T have familiarity of the home layout, just saying I don’t think it can be deduced one way or the other.
On the other hand, are you going to take on 10 people inside, all with cell phones?

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Whatever the reason for the breakup between Kaylee and JD, it appears that Kaylee was ambivalent about it based on the interview early on with her family. While she was staying with her family before her visit back to Moscow in mid-November, her family describe Kaylee's attempts to reach out to JD in the hopes that he would get together with her. According to her family, she made numerous attempts to engage with JD during that period. There is also the "drunk dialing" calls made to JD during the early morning hours of November 13th.

It may have been JD who was breaking away, for all we know.
Or mutual. You grow up, mature, want to see more of the world, you get jobs in different places...post-university breakups are fairly common and often part of becoming an adult.
 
I actually think that’s promising. FBI is there to help sift through info AND also to work through the digital evidence since most state level LE are not equipped or trained to do that type of forensics. I believe that the digital evidence will point them to the killer and then DNA will put that individual at the scene.
IMO they need more Field Agents, for some reason. If they’re going outside of the city to search, inquire, or investigate, they will need plenty of fortified back up. Maybe in the town, too. JMO Crazy times.
The digital part is handled in remote locations, I believe.
MOO
 
I’m wondering if the football game has anything to do with anything.
I was wondering this too and I've been going through social media to see if a lot of people went to this game that were from out of state. I've only found one family so far and I think it's pretty obvious that we can rule this husband and wife from California out as suspects. I'm a huge college football fan and I don't think UC Davis has a big "traveling" following like other teams.
 
FBI adds several more FBI agents to case. So very concerning!


MOSCOW, Idaho - The FBI has assigned additional agents to investigate the unsolved, Nov. 13 murders of four University of Idaho students, according to local police.

The Moscow Police Department (MPD), which is leading the investigation into the stabbing deaths of students Ethan Chapin, Xana Kernodle, Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen, said in a Monday press release that 60 FBI agents and two members of the Behavioral Analysis Unit (BAU) have been assigned to the case.

On Dec. 15, the last time police issued a press release, there were 46 FBI agents and two BAU analysts assigned to the case.

Not concerning at all, IMO. With over 10,000 tips and video and tech analysis needed, more agents are brought on board to assist in the case.

[Moscow Chief of Police] Fry added that there are investigators who are trained to look at video evidence and tie certain aspects of video submissions together to help build their case.

Quote edited to add information in parentheses
 
I. Are Details of LE’s Criminal Investigation the "Public's Business"???
II. Does PI Assure Appropriate Attn. to Case???
It amazes me that folks think details of this case is not anyones business. If you are a citizen of the united States and the FBI is involved then it is 100% your business…. At least SG will see to it that this case gets appropriate attention with his PI. Imo
@PrincessIvy snipped for focus. Respectfully, disagreeing w your post, which I read as asserting the public’s right to know details of LE’s criminal investigation now, pre-arrest.

I. Details are "Public's Business"??? Imo details are SOMEONE’S “business” now but not that of the public.
PRE-arrest, details of the crim investigation are the “business” of LE.

AFTER arrest, and DURING Discovery (i.e., pretrial) details are the “business” ---
--- of the prosecutor, on behalf of the state, i.e., the public, to prosecute the case, and
--- the def't & def atty to prep for defense under def’t’s Sixth Amendment Rights,* and
--- judge, thru pretrial motions, briefs,hearings, etc. to issue orders, make rulings, etc.
--- but still not the “business” of public, except for the Information/Complaint or Indictment.

DURING TRIAL, details are the still the” business” of prosecutor, def't & def atty, as parties make opening stmts, examine & cross examine witnesses, offer exhibits, and make closing arguments to persuade the jury, all subject to rules of evidence.

The TRIAL is the stage at which DETAILS (subject to rules of evidence & judge’s rulings) are MADE PUBLIC. Yet even then, imo the details are not the “business” of the public.
Details are the “business” of the JURY (if not a bench trial) to use in deliberating def’t’s fate in reaching a guilty or not guilty verdict.

II. PI Assures Appropriate Attn. to Case???
Moscow PD, multiple ID. State Police & FBI personnel have been and still are all investigating these four deaths for CRIMINAL prosecution. Sheriff Taylor and Deputy Barney Fife are not running this show.
MSM, bloggers, vloggers, podcasters, & all kinds of other soc media have been and are still providing extensive coverage of this case, imo.
Not to be snarky, but short of Devine announcements from the Heavens, what more attention can be brought to this case? Attention to whom? The public? The public does not vote or render a verdict, like in a People’s Choice television program.

Are trials open to the public? Yes, thanks to the Sixth Amendment providing “… the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial…”* 6th A.is a right of the accused, not the public (which may be conferred elsewhere. Anyone?)
imo jmo moo
________________________________________
*U.S. Sixth Amendment. “In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.”
 
Unpopular opinion and probably going to ruffle a few feathers, but it is MY personal opinion that many (not all) people want to know details purely out of curiosity.

I think LE is keeping the info they have close to their chest in order to protect the integrity of it. People say that rumours are rampant because people of filling in the blanks with their imagination and that facts released from LE would help ease this, however I think it would fuel it and open them up to a barrage of useless tips. Doing so could even potentially negatively impact justice for these victims.

I will raise my hand and say I’m curious to know more details, it’s human nature to wonder that’s why we all love a good mystery! But I don’t think LE not releasing details is then not having said details. Those are two very different things. It’s not our right to know.
 
I was thinking. Do you think K and M called J all those times because they could see his home/bedroom light was on from their house?

Nah. K sister said she ‘power dialed’. Sounds typical. My wild guess is that one of the victims said something to the other that really concerned her about an occurrence, the other suggested calling J to ask for his opinion, or say to him that they were worried about something and could he come over.
 
IMO that would be a very different situation.

In an abduction, the fate and current whereabouts of the victim are unknown. Informing the public to be on the lookout adds millions of sets of eyes to possibly locate and hopefully save the victim.

In this case in Moscow, the tragic fate and whereabouts of the victims are known, and the public does not need to be on the lookout. We cannot help.

What we have been informed of in Moscow is the nature of the crime, the location, and the identity of the victims. We need that information to reinforce our own safety measures. We don’t need to know anything else unless we have info that can help the police.

JMO
I say someone capable of that could kill again. Steal a car and do what it takes to get it and escape.

I noted an example, if they do think they have him on Cameras away from the scene, alert the Public so people in those areas will be hyper vigilant and review and Cams or info they may have.
 
On the other hand, are you going to take on 10 people inside, all with cell phones?

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That would be a crazy risk right? I agree 100%. But if K had texted J at 2:54am “Hey come on over” instead of “Hey answer the phone we share a dog” (or whatever it was) and J replies “Ok I’ll be there in 20 minutes”, then we have a wide awake male entering unannounced. Any of the victims or survivors could have placed texts/calls for friends to come over and for all perp knows there actually could have been 10 people with cell phones popping in at any time. IMO the perp(s) took the risk of your scenario regardless if they were casing the place from somewhere or not. I doubt even X and E knew J had been dialed.

I think we can agree that the perp didn’t seem to show a lot of regard for the possibility of getting caught. I’m just not yet convinced that the lack of regard is indication of familiarity/knowledge (meaning he felt relatively “safe” that he wouldn’t be caught), or if the lack of regard towards getting caught speaks more about the inner workings of a murderer.

It’s a chicken and egg thing. Was the crime committed because the murderer felt safe in the specific setting, or was the crime committed because the murderer felt no fear INHERENTLY? I can be convinced either way at this time, so I can’t yet be fully convinced of either.
 
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The press release they have put out almost every day is 6 pages long. <modsnip> Just with the press release we know:

1. They are looking for a 2011-2013 white Hyundai Elantra
2. Xana and Ethan were at Sigma Chi for sure from 8pm - 9pm
3. Xana and Ethan got home around 1:45am
4. The two surviving roommates were out on the town separately
5. The two surviving roommates got home around 1am
6. Kaylee and Maddie were at the Corner Club from 10pm - 1:30am
7. When they left the Corner Club they went to the Grub Truck and ordered food
8. A private property picked them up and took them home
9. Kaylee and Maddie got home at 1:56am
10. Kaylee and Maddie called a male numerous times in the early morning of 11/13
11. The next morning the surviving roommates summoned friends to the house because they believed someone had passed out
12. The person they thought had passed out was a 2nd floor victim
13. 911 was called at 11:58am
14. The call was made from a surviving roommate’s cell phone
15. Multiple people talked to dispatch
16. 2 victims were found on the second floor and 2 victims were found on the third floor
17. The cause of death for all four was stabbing
18. All four were stabbed multiple times
19. All four were likely asleep when attacked
20. Some of the victims had defensive wounds
21. There was no sign of sexual assault
22. Local businesses were contacted about purchases of a fixed blade knife
23. LE has stated several people are not suspected to be involved at this time
24. The weapon has not been recovered
25. A dog was located in the residence unharmed

My thumbs are getting tired from typing.
 
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