ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 36

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FlamingoLady said:
But why would you want to jeopardize the case just because you have the right to speak and assemble? I don't get it.
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Because you believe it will aid the case and that authorities/experts are worthless/incompetent/too slow/not alpha/cowards/overpaid/uneducated/corrupt etc.

People have different views on things. A lot of people don't know how the investigation/justice system works and are accustomed to trying to solve crimes in their own towns, through all the usual means (watchfulness, gossip, security footage, talking over the fence, etc).

<modsnip - quoted post and response to it were removed>
 
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drmrgrl said:
IMO- locksmith? Home renovator? Construction?property manager?property owner?
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Agree with above that killer most likely not another student and LE have touch dna and prints but if killer has no prior crimes they wont find a match when they run thru codis. So they can run reverse dna thru the familial dna match site and try that method or when suspect are interviewed obtain dna and prints for comparison. Killer at this point has not turned themselves in or or killed themselves out or remorse so most likely a psycho path and is relishing in the attention and excited about not getting caught.
 

<modsnip> ... it's made me rethink the calling <modsnip>. I did originally say that this is normal behavior - and under some circumstances, I still think --IMO & JMO-- it would be normal-ish (although the number in that short time is a lot under any circumstances imo), but it would really depend on the circumstances and state of the relationship.

IMO & JMO
--if I wanted someone with whom I'd broken up to call me and they did, then I'd have answered first time or two
--if I didn't want that person to call me, I'd put my phone on dnd and good luck to them
--if I wanted to call someone with whom I'd broken up, I'd probably just call once and leave a soppily embarrassing VM (and silent prayer: please never let me do this again lol, never)

in college, different time, different place, but I probably still wouldn't have done it that way. Still, I'd have to know the circumstances and state of the relationship.

However, my initial opinion about this has changed.

What I think now -- and again, IMO & JMO -- is that the potential flurry of calls may have been to do damage control on whatever M had told A and K wanted to call J to fix it and that's why M called, too, since M was the one who told A everything. Now this is just a hunch/guess based on what we know (not much) filtered through my own lens and IME. IMO I think it is a potential explanation.

I am certain that if my siblings or friends were to call me repeatedly like that at that time of night, I would have discouraged it (<<massive understatement lol).
 
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Sister Golden Hair said:
@10ofRods I was hoping you were going to elaborate on your opinion on what the calls meant, but looks like I'm waiting in vain for that to happen ;)

IME you are totally right about the dog/relationship potentials. If there are already cracks in a relationship, a dog can really blow it up IME. Just my opinion & experience. edited to clarify the the cracks were in the relationship, not the dog.
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My opinion on the calls have expanded <modsnip>

Initially I thought it impractical that the girls would call him if they were frightened. Now I think they may call him before the police considering their lifestyle and his proximity to them. Depending on the nature of the threat as they perceived it. Moo
 
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Brett Payne as Lead Investigator on Case.
Nila Aella said:
Here are some links: write up on the investigative team, 82nd airborne (BP previous job), and the chief's statement regarding his team in one of the updates from MPD.
en.wikipedia.org

82nd Airborne Division - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
www.dailymail.co.uk

Lead Idaho investigator is US Army vet with two years of experience

Brett Payne is the officer now leading the investigation into the quadruple murder. Until two years ago, he had no police experience and was serving in the military.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
edit: After reading the Idaho Statesman write up on the investigative team...the head of the investigative team is JL who handles most of the major crimes and who has been there since 1997 according to the article....that differs from the Daily mail article identifying the lead as BP.
Edit2: changed lead invesigator previous job to BP previous job
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@Nila Aella
Thank you very much for providing links. As my earlier post said, I did not know about the lead's background, edu., experience, etc, so I'm glad to learn more.
Now I better understand posts questioning his appt. to serve as "lead investigator" in the case.

Briefly, in light of this ---"At full capacity,... 36 sworn officer positions,... force had five vacant positions"* (sbm), Chief had limited choices but selecting one who had served in the 82nd Airborn Div. may have been the best of candidates available in MPD. Ppl are not in the elite 82nd by accident, not that that qualifies them for everything.

imo jmo moo Thanks again for your post.
@MountainDad
__________________________________
*https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article269498497.html#storylink=cpy
 
<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

Midterm week for many (about to begin). It was 10 days of class until Thanksgiving, but I'm guessing that the week of Nov 14-18th had a lot of lab midterms, midterms in general, and paper projects due. Profs like to grade over the 4 day weekend so that students can see how they are doing and how to improve before finals (second week of December, usually).

The academic push was on, for sure. That may be why there was no part at the house, the sororities were giving "formals" and the frats were having midterm parties.
 
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annpats said:
Not necessarily. They could still go into work later that morning. Commit killing at 03.00hrs - 04.00hrs, then church doesn't start until 08.00hrs or later.
That's enough time to get cleaned up and pretend like nothing happened. They'd be a bit tired, but could still get through the day.

MOO.
Click to expand...

Agree.

The assailant could be young, healthy, and possibly athletic. That was the victims' scene. At that age, one can run on pure adrenaline for a couple of days w/o sleep.
 

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed> ... a lot of us have had break-ups. However, when looking at the study of crime, we look at statistical factors associated with violent crime. And some of us have had break-ups go down really badly, as most women have had.

If "break-up" is not a direct motive, why is that one of the most dangerous times in a woman's life? Trying to break up is probably the number one risk factor for being murdered, as a woman. Second is, sadly, being pregnant (many places). Holidays seem to trigger both sexes to kill. Statistically speaking. Alcohol makes everything worse, of course (and there are many other correlations on this overall pattern).

www.google.com

Introduction to Criminology

Introduction to Criminology, Tenth Edition, is a comprehensive introduction to the study of criminology, focusing on the vital core areas of the field—theory, method, and criminal behavior. With more attention to crime typologies than most introductory texts, authors Frank E. Hagan and Leah...
www.google.com

(no particular page number on that citation - many relevant pages).

The victims are more likely to have been in denial about safety (unless, of course, this really is some form of newly formed mass murderer, who was not at all connected to the victims).
 
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Sister Golden Hair said:
<modsnip> ... it's made me rethink the calling <modsnip>. I still think --IMO & JMO-- it would be normal-ish (although the number in that short time is a lot under any circumstances imo), but it would really depend on the circumstances and state of the relationship.

IMO & JMO
--if I wanted someone with whom I'd broken up to call me and they did, then I'd have answered first time or two
--if I didn't want that person to call me, I'd put my phone on dnd and good luck to them
--if I wanted to call someone with whom I'd broken up, I'd probably just call once and leave a soppily embarrassing VM (and silent prayer: please never let me do this again lol, never)

in college, different time, different place, pre-voicemail (thank goodness!) but I probably still wouldn't have done it that way. Still, I'd have to know the circumstances and state of the relationship.

However, my initial opinion about this has changed.

What I think now -- and again, IMO & JMO -- is that the potential flurry of calls may have been to do damage control on whatever M had told A and K wanted to call J to fix it and that's why M called, too, since M was the one who told A everything. Now this is just a hunch/guess based on what we know (not much) filtered through my own lens and IME. IMO I think it is a potential explanation.

I am certain that if my siblings or friends were to call me repeatedly like that at that time of night, I would have discouraged it (<<massive understatement lol).
Click to expand...
I also wondered if those early morning calls were connected to the back and forth between K & M in that video. It kinda makes sense, especially since both K & M tried to get a hold of him. Like you said, damage control.
 
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drmrgrl said:
IMO Could KG have told JD one thing, but meant something altogether different. IOW, JD thought that they were indeed “taking a break” but he found out something different from somebody else that night and was extremely upset?
Click to expand...

anything is possible, of course, and although letting someone down easy seems like the best solution short term, it's the worst one when the truth hits, so idk. jmo.
 
fridaybaker said:
I don’t understand why he would think, per the article, that they would get married. She broke up with him and was moving to Texas.
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My reading of the article is that K's mother and aunt think they would probably have gotten married. K's mother said this earlier. The aunt is speaking for what she thinks JdC is thinking, but I haven't seen anywhere that he has spoken for himself about anything, much less this break-up.

edit: grammar
 
Brett Payne as Lead Investigator on Case.
MountainDad said:
www.google.com

Lead Idaho investigator is US Army vet with two years of experience

Brett Payne is the officer now leading the investigation into the quadruple murder. Until two years ago, he had no police experience and was serving in the military.
www.google.com www.google.com
How is this logical? Why?
Click to expand...
@MountainDad
Directing you to a partial response in my post @Nila Aella to a few min [edit 20 min] ago and, and ack'ing Payne may not have been the ideal choice in a perfect world.

But still questioning whether a permanent fed task force to handle homicides nationwide is the best or even feasible approach.
How would it be logical for FBI to automatically assume
control of homicide investigations in NYC, Dallas, LA, St. Louis, Chicago, Detroit, NOLA, San Francisco, Philadelphia, Indianapolis, Baltimore, Kansas City, Houston, etc. IDK.

But I'm glad the MPD has FBI's assistance in many facets of this investigation. And hoping for an arrest soon.
 
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