ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #1

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Jumping off your post blefuscu,

There is an important distinction between unbiased analysis, speculation and pointing fingers.

"I think a mountain lion ate him" is speculation, however likely it could be - there are zero facts to point towards that.

"What if the gpa's mysterious friend drowned him in the reservoir and then buried the body?" is not only speculation but is pointing fingers. We have evidence that suggests DeOrr could have been carried to the reservoir (dogs hitting on the reservoir and the campsite, but nothing in between, and the likelyhood DeOrr walked himself there being small or not fitting the timeline), so a better question is "DeOrr could have been carried, but by who? Who had the opportunity and was it with intent or not?"

Analysis of the evidence we have in the case, including statements, is part of working through the case, as long as it can be done logically and factually. It is important analysis of the parents statements and behavior be allowed here, because it would point out important inconsistencies with the facts being presented. But it needs to be discussed in a professional way. If that can't be done, I am not sure what the point of this thread is right now. 70+ threads of re-clarifying family relations and rehashing facts several members have listed out clearly or reiterated is not doing DeOrr any good at all.

DeOrr was not kidnapped, he was not eaten by a mountain lion, carried off by Sasquatch, abducted by aliens, or murdered in a creepy religious ritual (although that is more likely than the first 4). He has very likely met an accidental death caused by brief neglect, and it is sad and tragic and not necessarily on purpose or at the hand of a family member. However, it is irresponsible to rule out deception by those at the scene without a body unless both parents have taken a polygraph and passed it (which I doubt, since they haven't left the scene).

I do not believe the parents murdered DeOrr. But I do believe we have reason to doubt their story is 100% accurate. Think about this for a minute - you are a family out in the middle of nowhere and something happens to the 2yr old with you and it is your fault. You are devastated, scared, and don't know what to do. Obviously calling 911 is the first option, but then you start thinking about how you will explain what happened to the police, to your family. You are likely smart enough to know calling LE could mean being charged with manslaughter. My intent here is not to point the fingers at one or both parents or anyone else at the scene, but to point out a possibility that is just as real as any other being put forth. My hope is that regardless of how DeOrr got where he is now, that he is found, and the only way we will be any remote help in that endeavor is if we can respectfully discuss all possible outcomes that fit the facts we have without making it personal.

The thing is, though, there is no evidence of an accident. No evidence of neglect. I think the most likely scenario is an accidental drowning. But that, just like anything else, is a guess.


Look at William Tyrrell. He just vanished from an unlikely place. Somewhere that was considered safe. I think the parents will be being looked at by LE, but they don't owe anyone an explanation at this point in time.
 
I know this has been gone over many times but I am still confused so can someone help answer.

It was stated in 1 article that "Great Grandpa" was at camp with a friend. Then it was also stated in another article that the boy stays with "Grandpa" at his house.

So the question I have is there 2 people here being discussed?
Is there BOTH a Great-Grandpa and a Grandpa ?
Or is there only 1 Grandpa?
 
I know this has been gone over many times but I am still confused so can someone help answer.

It was stated in 1 article that "Great Grandpa" was at camp with a friend. Then it was also stated in another article that the boy stays with "Grandpa" at his house.

So the question I have is there 2 people here being discussed?
Is there BOTH a Great-Grandpa and a Grandpa ?
Or is there only 1 Grandpa?

On the camping trip were:
Mom - Jessica, JM
Dad - DeOrr sr, DK
Maternal Great Grandfather - unknown
Great Grandfather's friend - male, unknown.

Interviewed by the news reports were:
Maternal Grandmother, Jessica's mother - Grandma - was not at the campground
Paternal Grandfather, also named DeOrr, - was not at the campground. He is the one that said little DeOrr lived with him for the last year and a half.
 
My understanding is that little Deorr's (Deorr, Jr) Dad Deorr, Sr and his wife Jessica Mitchell live with Deorr Sr's Dad.........who would be Grandpa to the little boy.

GreatGramps in this case is Mom Jessica Mitchell's Grandfather (so little D's great-grandfather)
Grandpa who has been speaking to the media is the Dad of little boy, his father - who the young family all live with.

I know this has been gone over many times but I am still confused so can someone help answer.

It was stated in 1 article that "Great Grandpa" was at camp with a friend. Then it was also stated in another article that the boy stays with "Grandpa" at his house.

So the question I have is there 2 people here being discussed?
Is there BOTH a Great-Grandpa and a Grandpa ?
Or is there only 1 Grandpa?
 
Reading Vail's post above something just crossed my mind. It appears as if the family has two older children. There has been no mention of these other children in any of the news reports. The news has never said that these children were also camping. Has anyone ever said specifically that there were only 4 adults camping with little DeOrr?

Without accusing anyone and just purely speculation on my part, could the silence, lack of information and unease we are seeing in interviews be due to the fact that LE and the family are protecting these two older children? Maybe those children were the last to see DeOrr alive. Just throwing this out there as food for thought.


Very good question. It would be nice if it was cleared up exactly how many people were camping.

It brings up even more questions for me.
Also how many vehicles were at the campground and did they all follow each other there?

There would have to be more than just the truck there I would think? We already know at least 4 adults and 1 child. Unless they have a 4 door extended cab truck or an SUV then it is not likely they all took the same vehicle.

So I would like to know how many and the exact make and models of the vehicles in addition to how many people and ages were all camping.

And did they all follow each other at the same time to arrive there OR did some arrive later and meet them there at the campsite?

I wonder about the back of the truck where the blanket was. Is the truck have a tailgate or not? If no tailgate and maybe the boy was sleeping in back of the truck and nobody noticed and when nobody could find him at campground as he tore down the road trying to get a cell phone signal, then he may have flown out of the truck. Nobody may have even thought of that yet and maybe the boy could be lying in a ditch way down the road.
 
I'm wondering about the blankie that was in the truck, that DeOrr needed when he napped. And the temperature being 81 degrees. Maybe...a nap in the truck turned bad.
 
On the camping trip were:
Mom - Jessica, JM
Dad - DeOrr sr, DK
Maternal Great Grandfather - unknown
Great Grandfather's friend - male, unknown.


Interviewed by the news reports were:
Maternal Grandmother, Jessica's mother - Grandma - was not at the campground
Paternal Grandfather, also named DeOrr, - was not at the campground. He is the one that said little DeOrr lived with him for the last year and a half.

Thank you. That helps.

That was my understanding too that we know of 5 people for sure with the boy included that were camping.

I suppose the question is was there any more kids or anybody else that was puposely not mentioned by LE to keep them out of it.
Like other kids maybe.

And was there 1 or 2 vehicles and did they all go together or not?
 
I don't have a link, but I thought I read that mom's other children were with their father.
 
Has anybody bothered to look up underneath the vehicles that were on site ?
 
But the grandmother was quoted as saying that GreatGrandpa was watching the boy, looked away, and he vanished went he looked back. So it sounds like he was 'watching him' at that point. If the parents just assumed and walked away, then that is worrisome. JMO

Yes she said that, but all of it is heresay. We still have yet to hear his side of the story. Why wasnt grandma watching him? She was at the camp site too right? I guess I'm a bit cynical since I have a relative with a 2 yr old and if anyone else is around..whether it be shopping, the mall, outside anywhere she assumes YOU are watching her child..and its not just me anyone who is with her is up for the task. You are never asked, it is just assumed,taken for granted, implied what ever you want to say. This is why I am thinking that Great Grandpa may not have even been asked and may not have known he was watching the child. I do think that the child left while the parents were in eyesight and I think GGpa thought the toddler went with the parentals. Whatever gma, the kids or Joe Blow says at this point is purely here say until we here from ggpa himself. Cause even the stories from them are not consistent. She says he vanished, they say he thought the child was with them so who knows.
 
Yes she said that, but all of it is heresay. We still have yet to hear his side of the story. Why wasnt grandma watching him? She was at the camp site too right? I guess I'm a bit cynical since I have a relative with a 2 yr old and if anyone else is around..whether it be shopping, the mall, outside anywhere she assumes YOU are watching her child..and its not just me anyone who is with her is up for the task. You are never asked, it is just assumed,taken for granted, implied what ever you want to say. This is why I am thinking that Great Grandpa may not have even been asked and may not have known he was watching the child. I do think that the child left while the parents were in eyesight and I think GGpa thought the toddler went with the parentals. Whatever gma, the kids or Joe Blow says at this point is purely here say until we here from ggpa himself. Cause even the stories from them are not consistent. She says he vanished, they say he thought the child was with them so who knows.

Grandma was NOT at the site.
As far as I understand, the members of the family who were camping at the site were:
1. Little Deorr
2. Deorr's Father
3. Deorr's Mother
4. Deorr's Great-Grandfather (who is Deorr's mother's grandfather)
5. A friend of Deorr's Great-Grandfather (who someone said is male)
 
Grandma was NOT at the site.
As far as I understand, the members of the family who were camping at the site were:
1. Little Deorr
2. Deorr's Father
3. Deorr's Mother
4. Deorr's Great-Grandfather (who is Deorr's mother's grandfather)
5. A friend of Deorr's Great-Grandfather (who someone said is male)

Well, even more reason that granmda would not know what happened.
And I do believe the timeline is somewhat questionable. I think they were probably gone longer than they think.
 
OR in the trunk of any vehicle there, or possibly one that came later?

I keep having a horrible thought of an open bedded truck with the baby sleeping in back of truck bed and maybe nobody noticed as they took off in truck and the poor boy may have rolled out.

If the truck had a tailgate he may have even woke up and climbed out over the side and fell out while truck moving.

Nobody may be even looking on all the roads the truck could have traveled.

Its too bad there werent pictures of all the vehicles at the campsite and how they looked.
 
I keep having a horrible thought of an open bedded truck with the baby sleeping in back of truck bed and maybe nobody noticed as they took off in truck and the poor boy may have rolled out.

If the truck had a tailgate he may have even woke up and climbed out over the side and fell out while truck moving.

Nobody may be even looking on all the roads the truck could have traveled.

Its too bad there werent pictures of all the vehicles at the campsite and how they looked.

I was thinking more along the lines of one of the vehicles being moved or repositioned after they arrived there, and somehow the little guy got wedged up underneath it or climbed underneath it. There's a lot of nooks and cavities up underneath a pickup truck.

To be honest, I'm just about "idea'd" out.
 
http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/07/deorr-kunz-disappearance-a-timeline-of-events/
At 3.11 in the video, it appears that dad is at the back of this extended cab black pickup. If this is his vehicle, it would have been a cramped ride for 2 1/2 hours from Idaho Falls for 4 adults and a child in booster seat.

Thanks for showing this.

If that is them and their truck then I agree that I dont think all 4 adults took the same vehicle. It would be too cramped.

Possible but not likely.

That is the type of truck I am afraid of for baby in back. Open Bedded truck.
 
If this was a tragic accident then nobody should be afraid of covering that up and then making LE search days and days and days.

In fact that would be the worst thing to do to try to coverup an accident because once LE finds out it wasnt an accident then LE would charge someone with a crime for sure if they purposely hid an accident.
 
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