ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #26

[DexterMorgan]

Well SB also said that Isaac claimed he saw DeOrr on Fri and that he even said he saw him after the parents returned from the store. But it really sounds like DeOrr didn't go in the store (or was even in the truck), so it's all very iffy/murky, isn't it?


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Dang. How sociable is I.R?

He didn't even give Deorr a high five. Or say what's your name little guy. Or how old are you. Or hello Deorr. Or anything?

He just seen the little happy fella but never once tried to wave or interact with the child. At least this is what I imagine since he isn't mentioning much.

Doesn't he fix kids bikes. So wouldn't that make him more kid friendly? Idk.

 

[DexterMorgan]

The whole IR thing seems to come down to timing.

25th/26th January IR does EIN interview.
26th January KIC "review" IR interview and are still skeptical about him and really want to talk.
2nd March Klein interview with CB. Klein now singing the praises of IR whom has now spoken with them and talks about a proffer etc.

Clearly IR was holding back/covering/not wanting to get involved/scared....take your pick. Sometime between 26th January and 2nd March IR has "come clean" going by what Klein has said on March 2nd.

If the above is near the truth and everything IR told KIC is verified then I'd imagine if/when a body is found, arrest(s) will be made at that point.

So are we saying that I.R duped the polygraph or the sheriff that assumed from the beginning that I.R test may be inconclusive but he is trustworthy.

Are we saying that I.R is capable of lying to the feds in order to help cover for people he barely knew besides ggp.

Idk. I just wish the cops have put wire taps in both Deorr and Ggp vehicles before they headed home. This case would have been solved by now even if the wire tap evidence was thrown out of court before trial. Jmo

 

[kammiemc]

Dang. How sociable is I.R?

He didn't even give Deorr a high five. Or say what's your name little guy. Or how old are you. Or hello Deorr. Or anything?

He just seen the little happy fella but never once tried to wave or interact with the child. At least this is what I imagine since he isn't mentioning much.

Doesn't he fix kids bikes. So wouldn't that make him more kid friendly? Idk.

I don't think it's ever publicly been said what interaction IR and DeOrr had. They might have had none or lots. In fact, beyond the parents saying that DeOrr went to the store with them and that they left him by the campfire with ggp, no one has said anything about what DeOrr was doing, how he was acting. Nothing. I can see why some people have wondered if he was ever even at the campsite at all.


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[jennapuppy]

The whole IR thing seems to come down to timing.

25th/26th January IR does EIN interview.
26th January KIC "review" IR interview and are still skeptical about him and really want to talk.
2nd March Klein interview with CB. Klein now singing the praises of IR whom has now spoken with them and talks about a proffer etc.

Clearly IR was holding back/covering/not wanting to get involved/scared....take your pick. Sometime between 26th January and 2nd March IR has "come clean" going by what Klein has said on March 2nd.

If the above is near the truth and everything IR told KIC is verified then I'd imagine if/when a body is found, arrest(s) will be made at that point.

And, if IR is now claiming to LE that he never actually saw DeOrr on Friday, SB may choose to keep that info under wraps for the time being. IMO

 

[kammiemc]

I agree. And, when I asked about the possibility that SB suspects one is responsible for DeOrr's death and the other only in the cover up, but isn't sure which is responsible for which, so he names them both suspects, thinking surely the one who isn't responsible would roll over on the other one, it was pointed out to me that there's no way he would employ that tactic because of the legal ramifications.

But, I'm not so sure. He named them suspects but only said they are lying and they absolutely know what happened to DeOrr.


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I am out of my league on this one. I guess even if it is possible that one caused the death of DeOrr and the other assisted in moving the body, covering, lying to LE, FBI, etc., then they would both be suspects of criminal acts related to the disappearance. Would SB be required to know their exact roles to name them each suspects? Or is it enough to be able to show that they both were involved in lying and covering? I don't know!


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[haven71]

I am out of my league on this one. I guess even if it is possible that one caused the death of DeOrr and the other assisted in moving the body, covering, lying to LE, FBI, etc., then they would both be suspects of criminal acts related to the disappearance. Would SB be required to know their exact roles to name them each suspects? Or is it enough to be able to show that they both were involved in lying and covering? I don't know!


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I did a search but didn't come across much. Just that a person is named a suspect when they are being investigated or charged with a crime. So they're still stuck in that investigative phase.

I wonder what the average length of time is between when a suspect is named and when (and if!) they are actually charged with a crime?

The longer this drags out longer the more nervous I get. I guess charges are pending but not filed yet so that SB "gets it right" IIRC him saying. Let's hope LE hurries up. And I've got my fingers crossed for the big thaw!

 

[Butler]

I wish I could be as confidant as you that IR saw DeOrr alive on Friday. I'm just not there yet based on what has been by SB and IR so far. I agree with you about things sometimes being exactly what they are but I still haven't heard the word alive or even heard from IR what he saw DeOrr doing at the campsite.

I have never questioned if they were properly supplied for camping but I do question if they were properly supplied for a toddler camping.

I'm not sure we'll ever know what IR said he saw outside his publicized statements. SB was clear in that IR said he saw DeOrr on Friday. In my opinion that rules out what may or may not have happened Thursday evening. I feel if he told SB that he never saw DeOrr alive, or never DeOrr in a manner that would leave a reasonable person to believe he was alive, this case would have been resolved. We also have no idea what GGP told SB regarding DeOrr and a timeline. Some may feel it's irrelevant what GGP would say, given the relationship.

I know the lack of information makes this case so difficult to grasp and even more difficult to sleuth but I still believe this is a case of him wandering off. I can't explain SB statement calling them suspects. I give very little credit to Klein, just do not believe him. Polygraphs can have aspects that are inconclusive and less than truthful.

I know there are those who strongly disagree with me and that's ok. Lets just keep thing civil and not make it personal.

 

[MBK]

Dang. How sociable is I.R?

He didn't even give Deorr a high five. Or say what's your name little guy. Or how old are you. Or hello Deorr. Or anything?

He just seen the little happy fella but never once tried to wave or interact with the child. At least this is what I imagine since he isn't mentioning much.

Doesn't he fix kids bikes. So wouldn't that make him more kid friendly? Idk.

It may be that he is not a very social person; after the interview with Nate, I see him as someone who may not "read" people very well. I am not saying he is mentally deficient, I am saying something entirely different than that.

 

[kammiemc]

It may be that he is not a very social person; after the interview with Nate, I see him as someone who may not "read" people very well. I am not saying he is mentally deficient, I am saying something entirely different than that.

I know what you're saying. The poor guy has been under massive public scrutiny in a missing child's case, yet when NE asked him how the last six months had been for him, he misread the meaning and said something like, "Kinda boring. There's not much to do in Idaho Falls." Everyone has their own way of relating. It seems Isaac does too.


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[desert-blue]

If DeOrr just wandered off and got lost, why are the parents not able to tell a straight story about what happened earlier in the day?

In addition, the dogs were not able to track his scent and he was not picked up on the thermal imaging cameras at night.

It seems like DeOrr (or some trace of him) would have been found. JMO.

 

[desert-blue]

I think that IR did not see DeOrr after the store. I feel it would be impossible for something to have happened to DeOrr (and for it to have been covered up to the extent he has not been found) in a period of about 1.25 to 1.5 hours (they supposedly got back from the store about 1:00/1:15 and the 911 calls were all around 2:30). The only scenario that would fit into this time frame is some sort of arranged abduction, but SB is 100% sure DeOrr wasn't abducted.

After 8:00 AM, their stories don't match. Of course, before 8:00 AM, they could have just said they were sleeping (even if they weren't) and that wouldn't be too hard for them to keep straight. I hope that cell phone data and/or witness information and/or highway cams ares helping LE track their movements after they left the SD on Thursday evening up until they dialed 911.

 

[DexterMorgan]

I think that IR did not see DeOrr after the store. I feel it would be impossible for something to have happened to DeOrr (and for it to have been covered up to the extent he has not been found) in a period of about 1.25 to 1.5 hours (they supposedly got back from the store about 1:00/1:15 and the 911 calls were all around 2:30). The only scenario that would fit into this time frame is some sort of arranged abduction, but SB is 100% sure DeOrr wasn't abducted.

After 8:00 AM, their stories don't match. Of course, before 8:00 AM, they could have just said they were sleeping (even if they weren't) and that wouldn't be too hard for them to keep straight. I hope that cell phone data and/or witness information and/or highway cams ares helping LE track their movements after they left the SD on Thursday evening up until they dialed 911.

Didn't they leave Deorr with ggp so I.R could show them the fish spot. So I R should have seen Deorr after the store.

 

[haven71]

If DeOrr just wandered off and got lost, why are the parents not able to tell a straight story about what happened earlier in the day?

In addition, the dogs were not able to track his scent and he was not picked up on the thermal imaging cameras at night.

It seems like DeOrr (or some trace of him) would have been found. JMO.

The only thing I can imagine is they were heavily under the influence. Yet IIRC both SB and Klein dismissed drug use completely.

And it still bugs me that we have NO IDEA how long ago anyone saw Deorr alive, prior to the campout (heck during the campout too), aside from the claims of the 4 adults there.

 

[DexterMorgan]

To all the posters that do not think I.R seen Deorr alive during the trip.

Do you think I.R is that slow?

Come on. The man said Deorr was there. So what's next? Just asking.

 

[DexterMorgan]

Klein hinted at no Friday sightings of Deorr.

But Ggp and I R said they seen him.

So what's next.

 

[kammiemc]

They have to prove that a false statement was made. I don't see how they can possibly do that.

If Klein has a recording of JM saying she knows where DeOrr is in the way that Klein says she did (He is adamant that it was not a misinterpretation or twisting of her words) then it would be hard to prove false that she doesn't know where he is.

That is just one point. But kind of a big one.


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[desert-blue]

Didn't they leave Deorr with ggp so I.R could show them the fish spot. So I R should have seen Deorr after the store.

Klein said that whole scenario was a myth....

 

[desert-blue]

To all the posters that do not think I.R seen Deorr alive during the trip.

Do you think I.R is that slow?

Come on. The man said Deorr was there. So what's next? Just asking.

Klein said he has a witness at 6:00 PM on Thursday, so I do think DeOrr was on the trip (not sure of his condition, though). I just think that IR was off doing his own thing and wasn't into children. Maybe he slept in and by the time he woke up, VDK and JM were getting ready for their trip into town (and IR just assumed DeOrr was in his car seat in the truck waiting for his parents). Or, maybe IR got up early and went off alone or with GGPA to fish... Or, IR could have been told DeOrr was in the camp trailer - who knows. I don't think him not seeing DeOrr on Friday morning indicates anything about his mental capacity. I think VDK and JM are deceptive - they have hidden the truth from LE, the FBI, two PI's and the public for eight months, so it's not a stretch to think they could fool IR (and possibly GGPA) for a few hours. MOO

 

[DexterMorgan]

Klein said that whole scenario was a myth....

And if proved false by his ex clients. Then Klein should be sued.

Similar to Nancy Grace when she says bombshell to something that never happened. Jmo

 

[jennapuppy]

I think that IR did not see DeOrr after the store. I feel it would be impossible for something to have happened to DeOrr (and for it to have been covered up to the extent he has not been found) in a period of about 1.25 to 1.5 hours (they supposedly got back from the store about 1:00/1:15 and the 911 calls were all around 2:30). The only scenario that would fit into this time frame is some sort of arranged abduction, but SB is 100% sure DeOrr wasn't abducted.

After 8:00 AM, their stories don't match. Of course, before 8:00 AM, they could have just said they were sleeping (even if they weren't) and that wouldn't be too hard for them to keep straight. I hope that cell phone data and/or witness information and/or highway cams ares helping LE track their movements after they left the SD on Thursday evening up until they dialed 911.

I just checked the media thread again. On Jan. 28, SB gave the interview in which he said the last time IR saw DeOrr was when they returned to the campground at 1:00. On Feb. 29, Klein gave the interview in which he stated that IR had started cooperating with LE.

Klein:
Now, we want to make it clear that Isaac Reinwand, the fourth person up on that mountain, has changed. He has given us a statement. We are vetting that statement now. It will take us a couple weeks to vet that statement completely out and what he has told us. We want to make it clear that Mr. Reinwand is now cooperating with the police and now cooperating with our team. We’ve had an opportunity to visit with him on multiple occasions, and he has now come forward.

06:16
Klein:
So we are very uh…we’d like to thank, publicly thank Mr. Reinwand for that. We understand his fear, and we want to make sure that the public understands that he has come forward at this point.

If Klein is to be believed, IR has "changed", had exhibited "fear" at one time, but has now "come forward". It is quite possible that he's no longer corroborating the family's timeline. IMO