ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #26

[skinnycat]

I keep thinking about the strong words used about JM, by all the professionals involved. Are they trying to get her to break and spill the beans on VDK, or are they letting VDK and the rest of society know that JM is the one that harmed DeOrr? I flip flop back and forth wondering what the strategy is.

I pray the sun is shining and the snow is melting in Timber Creek campground

 

[Butler]

I keep thinking about the strong words used about JM, by all the professionals involved. Are they trying to get her to break and spill the beans on VDK, or are they letting VDK and the rest of society know that JM is the one that harmed DeOrr? I flip flop back and forth wondering what the strategy is.

I pray the sun is shining and the snow is melting in Timber Creek campground

BBM - https://www.bing.com/search?q=weath...54c1fa86e&pq=weather in leadore idaho&PC=DCTE

I don't think they're going to be so lucky.

 

[Susjay]

Agree 100% with your last sentence. That fact has always left me scratching my head. :thinking:

VDK has SORT OF started to throw GGP under the bus by saying, "...you leave your child with a trusted adult..." but that's it. He never goes any further. He's actually said it at least 3 times that I'm aware of. The first time was in the first interview with Nate, the second time was at the first candlelight vigil where he speaks to the attendees via microphone (I believe EIN aired it), and the third time was in the latest interview he and JM gave with Chelsea from Local 8 news.

Yes unfortunately I think the words might be immaterial- the point is the 3 family members seem to be sticking together on their story.

 

[Butler]

I know it's been talked about, but I never did know the source of the suspicion that TBC was there earlier? Did one of them slip up& say something or was it reported by someone? Thanks!

My understanding is that this was planned as a family camping trip and the reason VDK & JM went up there on Thursday was because GGP wanted to go then and TBC asked them to go with him. More of the family was due to arrive on Friday to spend the weekend. I believe TBC was probably already on her way up there when she heard DeOrr was missing. In those circumstances I don't find it unusual she would know the exact time. As a grandmother I would be watching my phone (which has the time on it) constantly, especially if there were areas of low or no service.

 

[Susjay]

Question. Should the family (at this point) sue Klein if they are truly innocent?

And if they don't sue; Does this means that they are guilty and keeping hush?

Why would they litigate - they seem to have n funds and they would have to have a case....

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Why would they litigate - they seem to have n funds and they would have to have a case....

Agreed. At this point, all they have done is threaten Klein with a lawsuit. They may have done that to scare him from talking more or perhaps to make themselves look "powerful".

 

[Beezneez]

Maybe she sent a text or called someone when she arrived, so she was able to tell the exact time from her phone log. Just a thought... seems like something I would do.

I also wonder if LE started keeping a log of who was in and out of the camp/search area right away? I know they would want to if it were already being considered a crime scene, but a log would also be helpful in making sure that no searchers got lost too. If there is any sort of official record of the time she arrived. I wouldn't take anyone in that families word on anything, personally.

 

[Beezneez]

Agreed. At this point, all they have done is threaten Klein with a lawsuit. They may have done that to scare him from talking more or perhaps to make themselves look "powerful".

I haven't looked through the repository lately, but it does seem like all the hot air threats about suing everyone has disappeared. No surprise here. :judge:I would welcome seeing everyone involved face the music.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I feel like lawsuits have such a bad stigma against them that it is incredibly rare for me to see a lawsuit where the majority of people support the plantiff. It feels like filing a lawsuit is the fastest way to get the public to turn against you. I just don't see any benefit to the Kunz family filing a lawsuit against Klein. If it goes to trial, Klein will have the opportunity to cross-examine them on the stand. I think they are threatening him with a lawsuit to make themselves sound powerful like don't mess with us, we have top-notch lawyers on speed dial! The Kunz family is already not very well-liked---most people think they were involved. A lawsuit will not repair their reputation. They are also not going to waste their time and money in court suing someone who doesn't have millions of dollars.

 

[Beezneez]

Agreed. At this point, all they have done is threaten Klein with a lawsuit. They may have done that to scare him from talking more or perhaps to make themselves look "powerful".

I haven't looked through the repository lately, but it does seem like all the hot air threats about suing everyone has disappeared. No surprise here. :judge:I would welcome seeing everyone involved face the music.

 

[desert-blue]

My understanding is that this was planned as a family camping trip and the reason VDK & JM went up there on Thursday was because GGP wanted to go then and TBC asked them to go with him. More of the family was due to arrive on Friday to spend the weekend. I believe TBC was probably already on her way up there when she heard DeOrr was missing. In those circumstances I don't find it unusual she would know the exact time. As a grandmother I would be watching my phone (which has the time on it) constantly, especially if there were areas of low or no service.

Actually, TBC (or someone using her account) posted that she was originally planning on going up on Sunday morning.

 

[ConcernedCitizenID]

My feeling on all this is that the cover-up was for the most part completed before 911 was called. I can't imagine that they would have risked having someone showing up quickly - for all they knew, a park ranger could have been in the vicinity. I think GGPA was the catalyst for the 911 calls and that perhaps VDK and JM weren't quite ready yet and that's why VDK panicked and had to haul out of the campground (to dispose of some last minute evidence). I assume they left at least one of their cell phones turned on after the 911 calls were made (in case 911 called them back) and that they would not have strayed too far from the campground (for fear of their cell phone pings being tracked and for fear of not being there when help arrived, not to mention IR and GGPA would have noticed all that going on). MOO.

I agree with you about the cover up being done and over with by the time the 911 call was made. I've always thought this because I'm sure JM and VDK knew that when they called 911, there would be a chance Search & Rescue would send a helicopter being that they were in the mountains and a child was missing (near water, no less). 45 minutes by car from Leadore to the campground or just minutes if a helicopter were sent. They certainly couldn't take the risk of having a helicopter show up almost immediately after the call and still have to be finishing up the cover up. I'm positive they took that into consideration. Just like all three 911 calls came in around the same time. Many have said that it just looked way too orchestrated. Very much so.

 

[Beezneez]

A friend sent me link to a podcast, Someone Knows Something about Adrien McNaughton. He went missing about 40 years ago, from a fishing trip. It's a quick 5 episode series discussing how this little boy just vanished into the woods. No dog scent trace, no evidence left behind, nothing found in searches. It has been an interesting listen. The confusion of events, the parents discuss their perspective, there is even an odd friend on the fishing/camping trip.
It makes me sick to think that in 40 years we might all be no further than we are today.

 

[haven71]

Just read about a case that reminded me of one of the theories about what happened to DeOrr (he wandered off and drowned, and they covered it up).

Reena Williams, 3, wandered away from home in Wisconsin. Her father asked a neighbour if they had seen her, and the neighbour told him to call the police but the father said "We don't need no police". After the father left, the neighbour called the police anyway.

After a massive search, Reena's body was found in a canal 25 yards from her home. Police had to go and find her mother to break the news - rather than helping to look for her daughter, she had gone shoe shopping. The death was ruled accidental drowning. It turned out that there was a long history of neglect, and the little girl was often found wandering. The parents were high when their daughter wandered off and died.
This is the kind of situation where I can imagine parents covering up an accidental death of their child.

They were convicted of child neglect, and the mother got one year of probation. The father got 5 months in jail and 3 years of probation.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?181819-WI-Reena-Williams-3-Town-of-Swiss-14-Aug-2012

Seriously??? That's like a slap on the wrist. JM and DVK should've come forward if it were an accident from the beginning because this is a ridiculously light sentence and maybe they'd have gotten "lucky".

Uggghhh.

 

[Purplepixii]

Looks like an opinion by someone who has made up their mind already. That and Klein's comment a couple of weeks ago stating they would not be making public statements about the case and look, a negative link posted by Klein. Just the fact it comes from Klein makes it suspect in my mind.

You clearly have a problem with Klein, which is not surprising as what he thinks is not what your friend Mr Browning thinks. This link has been live since March 14, 2016, (in fact I recall it being discussed in a previous thread or early in this thread). Peter Hyatt is a respected Statement Analyst who trains LE and others, his views happen to match those of Mr Klein (& I wouldn't be surprised if Mr Vilt & Mr Bowerman were in agreement too). The post by KIC is new, the published analysis in question is not, and it makes for interesting reading. MOO

 

[kammiemc]

I haven't looked through the repository lately, but it does seem like all the hot air threats about suing everyone has disappeared. No surprise here. :judge:I would welcome seeing everyone involved face the music.

I think it was just posturing. Browning didn't even understand that VDK is not Klein's client, nor did he pay for Klein before he went shooting his mouth. If what Klein is saying is false then they would also have to prove that what LE and FBI have determined is false. Good luck with that, counsel!


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[haven71]

My feeling on all this is that the cover-up was for the most part completed before 911 was called. I can't imagine that they would have risked having someone showing up quickly - for all they knew, a park ranger could have been in the vicinity. I think GGPA was the catalyst for the 911 calls and that perhaps VDK and JM weren't quite ready yet and that's why VDK panicked and had to haul out of the campground (to dispose of some last minute evidence). I assume they left at least one of their cell phones turned on after the 911 calls were made (in case 911 called them back) and that they would not have strayed too far from the campground (for fear of their cell phone pings being tracked and for fear of not being there when help arrived, not to mention IR and GGPA would have noticed all that going on). MOO.

Desert-blue what you say is usually in line with my own thoughts.

I too think GGP was the catalyst for the call (sure would help if they'd get the 911 call times straightened out. And released for that matter--ha!). Listening to the JM's 911 call yesterday I detected something in her voice that I didn't notice so much early on. She sounded upset and scared.

It makes me wonder if there was disagreement by one or all of the 3 parties that called about who should call and/or when they should call. And that perhaps each were thinking of saving their own tail or at least looking less suspicious by making a call.

JMO.

 

[desert-blue]

Desert-blue what you say is usually in line with my own thoughts.

I too think GGP was the catalyst for the call (sure would help if they'd get the 911 call times straightened out. And released for that matter--ha!). Listening to the JM's 911 call yesterday I detected something in her voice that I didn't notice so much early on. She sounded upset and scared.

It makes me wonder if there was disagreement by one or all of the 3 parties that called about who should call and/or when they should call. And that perhaps each were thinking of saving their own tail or at least looking less suspicious by making a call.

JMO.

This may be way out there, but the thought has crossed my mind a few times that perhaps JM and VDK didn't really plan on calling 911 at all and GGPA put his foot down. I think GGPA's 911 call may provide some very interesting insight... JMO.

 

[Little Ol Me]

NEW POST FROM KLEIN INVESTIGATIONS: https://www.facebook.com/KleinInvestigations/posts/976736929075558?notif_t=notify_me_page

Just further substantiates my opinion of Kline, and the way he conducts business.

 

[kammiemc]

Desert-blue what you say is usually in line with my own thoughts.

I too think GGP was the catalyst for the call (sure would help if they'd get the 911 call times straightened out. And released for that matter--ha!). Listening to the JM's 911 call yesterday I detected something in her voice that I didn't notice so much early on. She sounded upset and scared.

It makes me wonder if there was disagreement by one or all of the 3 parties that called about who should call and/or when they should call. And that perhaps each were thinking of saving their own tail or at least looking less suspicious by making a call.

JMO.

When the 911 operator asked JM to hold, she definitely said to someone she was with, "I made the call." That makes me believe that someone (presumably GGP) might have wanting to make sure that she called.


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