ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #27

[perfectingpink]

I have a question about the blunt force trauma Klein believes happened. He seems to be leaning toward the truck being the cause of the trauma, am I reading that right? What I am trying to figure out is how the splatter would have gotten on the truck if Deorr was hit by it. If Deorr was hit by the truck, his injuries wouldn't cause splatter on the truck would it? I have always thought splatter found on an object would be from another object hitting the victim and only after additional blows not the initial one. (The initial blow causes the damage but would not pick up the blood unless what ever was used rested on the wound until it bled.)

 

[Hatfield]

I'm new to all this, and catching up. Here's my theory on the chargers. If Deorr was already deceased, and they knew they would be reporting him missing, then they could have been concerned that they had enough battery life on the cell phones to call the police/sheriff, relatives, etc. to set the ruse? Just a thought.

OR how about this theory on the 3 chargers.......

they bought 3 burner phones and needed to buy 3 chargers for them because they had different connections on the end than any of their normal phones. So they ended up buying 3 burner phones to talk amongst themselves as they had to plan to have one of them drive to dispose of the boy.

If the dad was the one who drove the boy elsewhere to dispose of the boy then he would have wanted to keep in contact with his wife and GGP back at the campground to make sure things were going as planned. If they paid cash for the phones at Walmart or somewhere then there would be no record of the purchase. But maybe they had to use a credit card or something to buy the chargers at another store. Could be why LE may have only found record of the chargers purchase.

They may have used the 3 burner phones as like walkie talkies to keep in contact with each other only and never used those phones for any other reason. They were like the bat phones for them. They may have even called home with one of them to arrange for someone to come up to the campground to bring some other supplies they needed.

 

[Hatfield]

I have a question about the blunt force trauma Klein believes happened. He seems to be leaning toward the truck being the cause of the trauma, am I reading that right? What I am trying to figure out is how the splatter would have gotten on the truck if Deorr was hit by it. If Deorr was hit by the truck, his injuries wouldn't cause splatter on the truck would it? I have always thought splatter found on an object would be from another object hitting the victim and only after additional blows not the initial one. (The initial blow causes the damage but would not pick up the blood unless what ever was used rested on the wound until it bled.)

Sorry a little graphic to answer...

If it was a crushing accident then the blood stain could have been more of a squirting rather than a splatter. Depending on where and how bad the boy was crushed, there could have been blood squirting upwards onto the bumper. Our blood is under high pressure in our bodies and depending on where a vein is cut or certain injuries, then blood can actually squirt or shoot out quite a distance.

 

[Hatfield]

This makes sense...in a sense. But if it were truly an accident, why hide the body? Why not own up to the tragedy? Where are the tears of the grieving parents? An accident involving a vehicle seems to make the most sense but the odd behavior from that point til now on the parts of all 4 campers just throws me.

Simple answer to that.
Alcohol or drugs could have been in the persons system at time of accident. Alcohol or drugs could have been in all of their systems.

 

[perfectingpink]

Sorry a little graphic to answer...

If it was a crushing accident then the blood stain could have been more of a squirting rather than a splatter. Depending on where and how bad the boy was crushed, there could have been blood squirting upwards onto the bumper. Our blood is under high pressure in our bodies and depending on where a vein is cut or certain injuries, then blood can actually squirt or shoot out quite a distance.

I guess it would be good to know if the splatter Klein speaks about could be more consistent with spray then? Klein has never mentioned if there was DNA testing done on any of the bio evidence they found but I guess we can assume they did not because surely it would be back by now.

 

[Russian Blue]

I think you have something there. This would explain a lot of things if they had trailer issue and had to pull over mid trip and everyone got out to help fix trailer and boy may have gotten runned over somehow. Or the trailer was unhitched and fell on him or something.

You are right that when something like that happens there is always a lot of commotion in a situation like that and it could be where the boy was in a spot where
nobody noticed as the trailer was moved or vehicle was moved.

I have been open to many possibilities but one thing I feel pretty sure of is that the boy never was really camping with them that Friday morning. I think whataver happened had to have happened before the fateful Friday morning when the parents started to claim he was missing.

The theory about them having trailer issues makes a lot of things fit.

We need to find the exact spot where they had trailer issues. There could be some clues at the scene.

I wonder if they know where this spot is where they had some type of trailer situation. I hope they take the dogs there. And what about Snake River/ I have posted this before and so have others, Vernal says Snake River twice by mistake in their early on long unedited interview. I think it is a Freudian type slip. Does anyone know if LE or Klien has mentioned searching that area?

 

[Russian Blue]

OR how about this theory on the 3 chargers.......

they bought 3 burner phones and needed to buy 3 chargers for them because they had different connections on the end than any of their normal phones. So they ended up buying 3 burner phones to talk amongst themselves as they had to plan to have one of them drive to dispose of the boy.

If the dad was the one who drove the boy elsewhere to dispose of the boy then he would have wanted to keep in contact with his wife and GGP back at the campground to make sure things were going as planned. If they paid cash for the phones at Walmart or somewhere then there would be no record of the purchase. But maybe they had to use a credit card or something to buy the chargers at another store. Could be why LE may have only found record of the chargers purchase.

They may have used the 3 burner phones as like walkie talkies to keep in contact with each other only and never used those phones for any other reason. They were like the bat phones for them. They may have even called home with one of them to arrange for someone to come up to the campground to bring some other supplies they needed.

You beat me to it. I thought they might have purchased burner phones and maybe found out the chargers were different than what they had and/ or didn't think they would have enough power. They wouldn't have regular power access so they had to get the car charger kind. Do we know for sure they were car chargers?

That would make sense to me. My phones have only come with regular wall chargers. Had to purchase the car ones separately.

 

[Hoosier952]

I had always kind of wondered if there were extra phones available/purchased around the time of the trip. Basic prepaid calling plans are pretty cheap and it wouldn't be hard to buy a cheap burner phone or use a used phone with prepaid service. But at the same time, wouldn't cell phone companies be able to see that there were phone calls/texts being made from that area around the time Deorr "disappeared". I don't know how precise that technology is, but I doubt there were hundreds of people making calls from anywhere near the campground at any point in time.

Also I have a question about evidence.

If Klein was to find any evidence, why couldn't it be used in court? If John Smith finds a gun on the sidewalk, picks it up, takes it to LE, and LE find out it was used in a homicide, it's usually permissible in court. I thought evidence found by private citizens, security guards, bounty hunters, and PIs were permissible in court due to those people not being government agents or working for government agents. I'm sure it varies state to state, but I'm not sure which state laws Klein would be bound by.

 

[OSpyder]

Burner phones are a great thought! But my question is, if they were all in communicado, wouldn't all four of them have their stories straight? Or wouldn't they at least be somewhat consistent?

 

[ReadySet]

Good thinking about the burner phones. I wonder what they said when questioned about why they bought 3 chargers. Was it like, " Oh, I always forget my charger, and they had such good prices on them at that store so I decided to stock up." Did the chargers fit their regular phones? If not, how did they explain that? Or were they even able to produce the chargers? If not, how did they explain where they were? "I don't know, I lose everything." If the chargers were purchased for burners, did they dispose of them with the burners?
Like another poster said, were one or more of them driving some long distances, and they needed to keep in touch, and let them know what was going on? Just speculating.

 

[ReadySet]

I am so on the fence about IR. I just don't know what to think about him. I wonder if he was not totally forthcoming at first.....then revealed more of the truth before January.....then GGP started talking to him and he started to change his story again?

 

[1&2&3]

The above posts are interesting as was the Klein Q & A session.

It seems the truck was involved with DeOrr's demise. For there to be too little DNA for identification purposes, apparently it had been cleaned. This would certainly be a tampering with evidence charge, but with all the lies that have been told, this charge will be huge.

In their hurry to leave on Thursday evening, could this accident with the truck have happened at home? In the first interview the two parents gave, DeOrr Sr.'s mention of Snake River several times leads me to believe that Snake River had a significant importance to him.

Then seeing Jessica's wedding pictures at Snake River, it is just too much!! Of all the places to get married, why Snake River? It gave her a legitimate reason to return where her baby was.

DeOrr will never be found around that campground or mountain. He is in the area of Snake River, if not in the river itself. IMO.

 

[1&2&3]

I am so on the fence about IR. I just don't know what to think about him. I wonder if he was not totally forthcoming at first.....then revealed more of the truth before January.....then GGP started talking to him and he started to change his story again?

I keep going back to his initial interview by the reporter knocking on his door, and his response then "I was told to say" I saw DeOrr. The words in quotations are exact, the last few words are the rest of the sentence but might not be the exact words, same meaning.

 

[Sillybilly]

Sorry it took a while to get back to you on this, but YES you may discuss Klein's FB page
(as if you hadn't already been ).

 

[Russian Blue]

The above posts are interesting as was the Klein Q & A session.

It seems the truck was involved with DeOrr's demise. For there to be too little DNA for identification purposes, apparently it had been cleaned. This would certainly be a tampering with evidence charge, but with all the lies that have been told, this charge will be huge.

In their hurry to leave on Thursday evening, could this accident with the truck have happened at home? In the first interview the two parents gave, DeOrr Sr.'s mention of Snake River several times leads me to believe that Snake River had a significant importance to him.

Then seeing Jessica's wedding pictures at Snake River, it is just too much!! Of all the places to get married, why Snake River? It gave her a legitimate reason to return where her baby was.

DeOrr will never be found around that campground or mountain. He is in the area of Snake River, if not in the river itself. IMO.

I just slogged thru the Klein Q & A. I appreciate that he did that. I did find a question asking if Snake River was searched. He said no. I wonder why they are not interested in it. In Jessica's interview when she mentions the hotel (can't remember at this point) that was looked into.
I think there is something to Snake River. If you can stand to listen to it one more time go back to the long unedited 1st interview they give and just look at both Vernal's face during the two Snake River slip ups. You can see he is mad at himself for saying that. Then rewind and only watch Jessica when it is going on. Something is not right.

 

[Russian Blue]

I keep going back to his initial interview by the reporter knocking on his door, and his response then "I was told to say" I saw DeOrr. The words in quotations are exact, the last few words are the rest of the sentence but might not be the exact words, same meaning.

Ok can you please link to that interview where he says "I was told to say I saw DeOrr". I want to hear that.

 

[seventeenseconds]

Ok can you please link to that interview where he says "I was told to say I saw DeOrr". I want to hear that.

Me too!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[KatieLiz]

I don't believe the parents would cover for each other all this time without cracking, I feel maybe GGP was asked to watch baby D and something untoward happened resulting in panic and disposing of body to protect GGP, hence IR not speaking out as he is a friend.....perhaps

I believe Klein said that the parents have implicated each other many times. The problem is that the cops don't known which story (if any) is true.

They are strange- apparently pointing the finger at eachother to LE, but hiring the same lawyer and supposedly signing documents not to testify against eachother. Strange strange strange.

 

[Lillahazel]

I wonder if they know where this spot is where they had some type of trailer situation. I hope they take the dogs there. And what about Snake River/ I have posted this before and so have others, Vernal says Snake River twice by mistake in their early on long unedited interview. I think it is a Freudian type slip. Does anyone know if LE or Klien has mentioned searching that area?

The Snake river slip up was always weird to me too. The snake river also goes through Washington. In one of the pictures with DK Baby Deorr is wearing a Cougars sweatshirt. The Cougars are Washington State University in Pulman which is fairly close to the Snake river. Do we know if they have any connections that direction?

 

[Deleted member 278]

Ok can you please link to that interview where he says "I was told to say I saw DeOrr". I want to hear that.

at what time in the interview do you hear him say that? I certainly don't hear it.