ID - Doomsday Cult Victims - Joshua Vallow - Tylee Ryan - Tammy Daybell - Charles Vallow - *Arrests* #67

[indicolite22]

I've considered that the intention of wrapping JJ in plastic was to make it easier to move his body at some point.
Rexburg is in a valley adjacent to the millions of acres of easily accessed Caribou-Targhee National Forest. That's a lot of space to get rid of a small body.

Lori and Chad (I mentally refer to them as LorCh) got consumed by Loin Fire and didn't bother to think things through.

One wonders whose idea it was to bury the children in Chad's backyard and what was the reasoning behind it, when they had easier and less risky options. Burying the bodies in broad daylight on his property they could have been seen by neighbors or passers by. Maybe they were afraid that wild animals could have unearthed the remains if they were buried elsewhere and someone could have stumbled upon them. Perhaps their original plan was to destroy both bodies before burial and that could have been done in Chad's yard under a pretense. Chad even googled wind direction a day before Tylee's murder, so there's no way that wasn't planned at least days in advance, likely controlled by him. I wonder how Chad wasn't constantly worried that his property would be searched, especially after the January search of the house. They were probably naive and unaware of some of the investigative methods available. They started using burner phones late and Alex only left his phone at home for his failed attack on Tammy, but not for the children's murders.

 

[Howl]

They were having an affair at first. Why not just, well, divorce for starters? Or, if those consequences were so objectionable to them, why not just continue with their affair?

Simple: The murders of the adults were for financial gain. Chad was not a good provider, Lori didn't work and was used to a nice house/apt and liked the nice things she had that Charles provided. They reeeeeeealllly needed money, neither of them was about to go out and get a regular job, so what to do, what to do? As I recall, one of the things Lori did while Charles was still alive was to drain some bank accounts, including Charles' business payroll account.

First, and this is, of course my opinion. I think Alex Cox murdered Joe Ryan, Tylee's bio dad. Joe was in an advanced state of decomp when finally found, and the coroner ruled it a natural death. However, Alex was living in the area at the time, he hated Joe Ryan, and Tylee received some type of insurance or payout (Tylee was a minor so that went to Lori as Tylee's parent) on Joe's death and Tylee could then receive Social Security benefits as a child with a deceased parent.

Then, Charles Vallow. Lori thought there would be the $million dollar$ insurance payout, but drat and dagnabbit, Charles had up and changed the beneficiary to his sister Kay.

Next up on the chopping block was Tammy and her life insurance policy, that did pay out and that financed the Loin Locked Lovers new life in Hawaii. I strongly doubt that Chad shared any of that life insurance payout with his kids, which should give them a clue about what Chad was all about.

At the Federal/state level (can't remember the details), Lori is facing charges of continuing to collect various public benefits for the kids after they were dead.

 

[iamshadow21]

Simple: The murders of the adults were for financial gain. Chad was not a good provider, Lori didn't work and was used to a nice house/apt and liked the nice things she had the Charles provided. They reeeeeeealllly needed money, so what to do, what to do? As I recall, one of the things Lori did while Charles was still alive was to drain some bank accounts, including Charles' business payroll account.

First, and this is, of course my opinion. I think Alex Cox murdered Joe Ryan, Tylee's bio dad. Joe was in an advanced state of decomp when finally found, and the coroner ruled it a natural death. However, Alex was living in the area at the time, he hated Joe Ryan, and Tylee received some type of insurance or payout (Tylee was a minor so that went to Lori as Tylee's parent) on Joe's death and Tylee could then receive Social Security benefits as a child with a deceased parent.

Then, Charles Vallow. Lori thought there would be the $million dollar$ insurance payout, but drat and dagnabbit, Charles had up and changed the beneficiary to his sister Kay.

Next up on the chopping block was Tammy and her life insurance policy, that did pay out and that financed the Loin Locked Lovers new life in Hawaii. I strongly doubt that Chad shared any of that life insurance payout with his kids, which should give them a clue about what Chad was all about.

At the Federal/state level (can't remember the details), Lori is facing charges of continuing to collect various public benefits for the kids after they were dead.

Follow the money. Simple as that.

So many dead for such petty greed.

 

[indicolite22]

This is completely MOO, but I think it's simply because they decided the rules of society didn't apply to them and that they wanted to kill people.

All the weird cult stuff around it is just window dressing.

Murder was their chosen solution for both marital and financial issues. They wanted freedom and money to spend. Both the children and the spouses were in the way.

 

[indicolite22]

How could they have thought that they could ever get away with the children's murders? If Lori believed in Chad's visions of earthquakes taking attention off of them and if Chad knew all along that his doctrine was a con, how did he rationalize it to himself? Just because he made Lori and Alex carry out the murders (IMO), he wasn't accountable?

 

[indicolite22]

Imagine there were no zombie proclamations involved. How were Chad and Lori going to convince Alex to murder for C&L's financial gain? By paying him? Would he be willing to kill his niece and nephew for money? How about Lori? Would she still agree to the children's murders if she received Charles' life insurance payment?

 

[SteveS]

How could they have thought that they could ever get away with the children's murders? If Lori believed in Chad's visions of earthquakes taking attention off of them and if Chad knew all along that his doctrine was a con, how did he rationalize it to himself? Just because he made Lori and Alex carry out the murders (IMO), he wasn't accountable?

Great questions.

The evidence that they did this is fairly obvious, and it's hard to see a plausible story to explain how these murders happened without their knowledge and involvement. That's the crux of the defense's task, isn't it, to create a story that is believable? But when you have missing kids, and parents collecting money off their deaths while they play in Hawaii with no apparent concern, it's hard to see how they can come up with anything that doesn't have giant holes in it.

 

[Love Never Fails]

They were having an affair at first. Why not just, well, divorce for starters? Or, if those consequences were so objectionable to them, why not just continue with their affair?

Money was their motivator, not sex and not love

 

[Ruminations]

This is completely MOO, but I think it's simply because they decided the rules of society didn't apply to them and that they wanted to kill people.

All the weird cult stuff around it is just window dressing.

Agreed. Affairs, divorce...that was simply too this-worldly for our special translated being suspects.

They were some kind of exponentially expanded version of grandiose, and enabled by a cadre of followers who were too enamored themselves with basking in some of that same glow to take the most basic steps towards preventing or investigating horrific crimes.

That is the reason most of the witnesses are almost impossible to stomach. They are the people who didn't run like hell from "castings" and testimony about contact with BOM all-stars. Anyone who didn't block the numbers of these "special" murderers immediately after talk like that already has a serious problem with empathy and right and wrong.

The ones who disengaged from the accused would not be valuable witnesses.

The ones who stuck around long enough to know something would be like the witnesses we know: worried about how they "look," worried about staying out of trouble, worried about losing business, worried about the superficial reputation of a faith. Worried about anything but murder and it's cover-up.

MOO

Edited to add: I guess I'm saying I think the cult stuff was essential, not just window dressing. I think that being able to steal cheat murder and call for murder was what they wanted. Not just sex and money, which you can get by dating and working, ffs. They wanted things ordinary people can't have. The murders did not put them financially ahead. It was not about money. It was about special money that can only be "earned" by gods and goddesses.

 

[indicolite22]

Agreed. Affairs, divorce...that was simply too this-worldly for our special translated being suspects.

They were some kind of exponentially expanded version of grandiose, and enabled by a cadre of followers who were too enamored themselves with basking in some of that same glow to take the most basic steps towards preventing or investigating horrific crimes.

That is the reason most of the witnesses are almost impossible to stomach. They are the people who didn't run like hell from "castings" and testimony about contact with BOM all-stars. Anyone who didn't block the numbers of these "special" murderers immediately after talk like that already has a serious problem with empathy and right and wrong.

The ones who disengaged from the accused would not be valuable witnesses.

The ones who stuck around long enough to know something would be like the witnesses we know: worried about how they "look," worried about staying out of trouble, worried about losing business, worried about the superficial reputation of a faith. Worried about anything but murder and it's cover-up.

MOO

Edited to add: I guess I'm saying I think the cult stuff was essential, not just window dressing. I think that being able to steal cheat murder and call for murder was what they wanted. Not just sex and money, which you can get by dating and working, ffs. They wanted things ordinary people can't have. The murders did not put them financially ahead. It was not about money. It was about special money that can only be "earned" by gods and goddesses.

To you or me Chad's doctrine might seem nonsensical, but to his followers it was real. I don't think they necessarily associated zombie's deaths with murder (Charles' was sold as self-defense and Tammy's as natural) but the children's deaths were different. One can suspect that ZP knew that Tylee would be killed, judging by her text to Alex a week before, "You'll know what to do when time comes." OTOH, Lori tried to conceal the fact that JJ was dead from MG, so maybe there was no understanding of Lori and Chad's actions there.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

They were having an affair at first. Why not just, well, divorce for starters? Or, if those consequences were so objectionable to them, why not just continue with their affair?

$$$$$$ IMO, the Goddess was easy, not cheap.

 

[887sMtreme]

They were some kind of exponentially expanded version of grandiose, and enabled by a cadre of followers who were too enamored themselves with basking in some of that same glow to take the most basic steps towards preventing or investigating horrific crimes.


<snipped respectfully>

Whether via money or the prestige of that special spiritual glow, it was all about power. There’s no “loin fire” like it.

 

[Niner]

quote snipped by me...

At the Federal/state level (can't remember the details), Lori is facing charges of continuing to collect various public benefits for the kids after they were dead.

She is charged with this along with the murder charges - per my notes:

Count 7: Lori only: Grand theft (related to social security survivor benefits allocated for the care of minors Tylee & JJ).

 

[Howl]

Dark spirit ratings and zombie designations were a way of defining their victims as less then fully human, making it OK to kill them.

Then you had AC as executioner. I keep wondering if AC agreed, or even offered, to kill because he enjoyed it. I always thought that Charles' murder was not his first rodeo.

 

[indicolite22]

Dark spirit ratings and zombie designations were a way of defining their victims as less then fully human, making it OK to kill them.

Then you had AC as executioner. I keep wondering if AC agreed, or even offered, to kill because he enjoyed it. I always thought that Charles' murder was not his first rodeo.

Alex allegedly told ZP a day after Charles' murder that he had no problem killing him because he killed a zombie.

 

[Howl]

One person I forgot to mention in my financial gain post -- AC's attempted assassination of Brandon Boudreaux. BB was the father of four kids, a successful businessman/sales rep providing his family of stay at home wife and four kids with a comfortable living.

A a sole breadwinner, he would likely have had one or more significant life insurance policies that would have paid out to Melani, who was enough of a Lori alcolyte that she walked away from a great marriage. Had AC been successful, there was a house, cars, life insurance, other substantial assets, really quite the bonanza for Melani.

I still can't believe that Melani skated on all this. I'm sure investigators worked hard to tie her to the attempted murder of her husband BY HER UNCLE, AC, during an acrimonious divorce.

Side note: I was googling for some background info on Brandon and Melani and came across this article on thelorivallowstory.com about BB's successful defamation lawsuit: Who paid Brandon Boudreaux $12,000,000

CV was a decent man and a good husband. BB also. LCD is in jail, Melani has lost contact with her children with BB. They walked away from great lives with good and caring husbands for a cult that believed in zombies, because they believed they'd become exalted as part of the 144,000.

​

 

[Kemug]

A couple of thoughts - I truly think that Kay may have become their next victim. Not because of any financial advantage, but out of pure hate and revenge from Lori.

 

[Ruminations]

One person I forgot to mention in my financial gain post -- AC's attempted assassination of Brandon Boudreaux. BB was the father of four kids, a successful businessman/sales rep providing his family of stay at home wife and four kids with a comfortable living.

A a sole breadwinner, he would likely have had one or more significant life insurance policies that would have paid out to Melani, who was enough of a Lori alcolyte that she walked away from a great marriage. Had AC been successful, there was a house, cars, life insurance, other substantial assets, really quite the bonanza for Melani.

I still can't believe that Melani skated on all this. I'm sure investigators worked hard to tie her to the attempted murder of her husband BY HER UNCLE, AC, during an acrimonious divorce.

Side note: I was googling for some background info on Brandon and Melani and came across this article on thelorivallowstory.com about BB's successful defamation lawsuit: Who paid Brandon Boudreaux $12,000,000

CV was a decent man and a good husband. BB also. LCD is in jail, Melani has lost contact with her children with BB. They walked away from great lives with good and caring husbands for a cult that believed in zombies, because they believed they'd become exalted as part of the 144,000.

​

Interesting- I'm not "buying" the money motive, pun intended. But I respect and fully enjoy posts that posit this.

I am not rich but lucky enough- I had a decent paying job as did my ex when we divorced. We worked out an agreement together with a shared attorney who had insisted we each get term life insurance policies with the other as a beneficiary as part of the agreement, because she felt if one of us passsd, possibly after a financial difficulty such as illness that tapped out assets, the other would not be able to afford to raise the children and work keeping the children at a similar place economically. I promise you I am actually telling the truth when I say I don't have a murderous heart- but I did the math. If my ex kicked it in the first 8-10 years of divorce I would have come out behind unless he also left his assets indirectly to me (to our minor children) and then I would have probably did all I could to save that for their adulthoods, short of moving house to save money or starving. And, of course, the lawyer's point was that death can be expensive. For example, if his death were an accident where he also caused damage to others such as in a car. In short, it wasn't until the kiddos started aging out of cs that I would have come out ahead. It looks like a lot of money, but....

Most if Brandon's earnings woukd go to support his kids, right? And if Melani had a real job, he'd have to pay more than half the daycare, most likely.

MOO

 

[Jolynna]

Interesting- I'm not "buying" the money motive, pun intended. But I respect and fully enjoy posts that posit this.

I am not rich but lucky enough- I had a decent paying job as did my ex when we divorced. We worked out an agreement together with a shared attorney who had insisted we each get term life insurance policies with the other as a beneficiary as part of the agreement, because she felt if one of us passsd, possibly after a financial difficulty such as illness that tapped out assets, the other would not be able to afford to raise the children and work keeping the children at a similar place economically. I promise you I am actually telling the truth when I say I don't have a murderous heart- but I did the math. If my ex kicked it in the first 8-10 years of divorce I would have come out behind unless he also left his assets indirectly to me (to our minor children) and then I would have probably did all I could to save that for their adulthoods, short of moving house to save money or starving. And, of course, the lawyer's point was that death can be expensive. For example, if his death were an accident where he also caused damage to others such as in a car. In short, it wasn't until the kiddos started aging out of cs that I would have come out ahead. It looks like a lot of money, but....

Most if Brandon's earnings woukd go to support his kids, right? And if Melani had a real job, he'd have to pay more than half the daycare, most likely.

MOO

LVD was her niece's role model and mentor. And, quite frankly, LVD seems to have been a whole lot more into quick gratification than she was into long-range, profitable planning.

I don't think Melani was the type to put a pen to paper to compare options.

For sure, Melani's advisors, LVD and CD, weren't considering how to best provide and care for Melani's children. The two of them, CD and LVD, would have found plenty of ways to have spent a million dollars in easy-to-dupe Melani's hands.

Totally my opinion.

 

[Howl]

And if Melani had a real job...

That's the point. Nobody had a job, didn't consider getting one and they had a high burn rate.

Lori, Melani, Alex - three grown adults with no visible means of support living in nice apartments. Chad was essentially being supported by his wife's income as a librarian in an elementary school.

After her divorce was finalized, Melani remarried "some guy" right away and then got pregnant right away. Apparently marrying a stranger and having his baby is preferable to supporting oneself.

I can't think of any reason Tammy was murdered other than for the insurance payout to support Lori's dream of returning to Hawaii and hanging out on the beach. Hawaii is not a cheap place to live.

These yahoos were obviously not long term planners,but no problemo because their beliefs centered around an imminent end times scenario when the 144,000 would gather under white tents and Lori and Chad would be exalted elites and lead the 144,000. So -- win win.

This is from documents filed by Charles Vallow's attorney in Feb. 2020:

Mother [LV] believes that she is receiving spiritual revelations and visions to help her gather and prepare those chosen to live in the New Jerusalem after the Great War as prophesied in the book of Revelations.

On January 29, 2019, during a phone conversation between the parties and after their physical separation, Mother [LV] informed Father [CV] that she was a God assigned to carry out the work of the 144,000 at Christ’s second coming in July 2020 and that if Father got in her way of her mission, she would murder him.

This is from an East Idaho News article that takes a deep dive into these beliefs. Published on Feb 23, 2020, and worth a read as a refresher: A look at the religious circle surrounding Chad and Lori Daybell.