Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #45

[Redvines86]

I'll go out on a limb, even though I may hate myself for it later.

I do not know CD, nor have I read any of his books or listened to his podcasts. I am not the originator of the observation that this "cult" had hypothetically recruited 7 people out of their goal of 144,000.

And 4 out of this 7 from what we can tell, were totally in the dark about the necessity of physically killing zombies.

Cutting to the chase without adding too much to the argument, I do not believe that these killings are "cult related", though I am not sure how many it really takes to make a cult.

From listening to people who were close to Chad, apparently none of them seen him as a person in the position of authority or leadership, regardless of whether they thought of themselves as a cult or not.

Good points I think, I certainly think this cult was mostly for Chad and Lori to get sex, money, Hawaii, and fame as podcasters. I think the religious aspect was pretty secondary to all that. MOO

 

[887sMtreme]

I imagine many of CD's traits and actions can be found here. Cult leader courtesy of Joe Navarro,
<Respectfully snipped for plain old brevity>

The question of why and how people fall for that, to the point of literally drinking the Kool-Aid (or whatever Jones served), is the question of our age. I would love to know, before the next one comes along so we can spot the signs right out of the gate and prepare those most vulnerable to protect themselves.

 

[wenwe4]

I am wondering how long Tammy suspected CD of having an affair. I know I have no link or proof but I swear there is just no way CD could have kept his walks around BYU w/LVD on the down low for very long without someone who knows TD who would feel compelled to tell their friend. CD & TD had spent enough time in their home/ward/community to establish long lasting relationships. CD put himself out there w/podcasts & books and conferences so that people would recognize him even if they didn't have a close relationship. I know MG & JR mentioned how uncomfortable they were with how close CD & LVD appeared while TD was still alive.
JMO

 

[Sachi]

"Scott Mitchell discusses his relationship about Chad Daybell as the two grew up together and also wrote a book about Mitchell's life from Springville to the University of Utah, the NFL and his appearance on The Biggest Loser. Then one day Daybell just up and left during promoting the book."

Interesting , from someone who knew Chad and he was angry about Chad abandoning the promotion and since both Tammy and Chad were in Mitchell’s house for four months, they appeared well invested and Chad’s sudden departure seems rash and impulsive Yet perhaps “ visions” are reasonable answers to uproot family suddenly in the middle of a book promotion? So moving there in 2015 was for some reason and it seems suspicious, perhaps something happened in Springville Utah -something he wanted to escape or leave behind ? Springville is located 7 miles from Provo. Hmm, LE is already on this for sure.

Scott Mitchell's relationship with Chad Daybell - KSL Unrivaled - Omny.fm

Im having some ptsd w every one of these points being my ex of 20 yrs. But i was his only follower..Sad but true. And i can see this in CD.

Ptsd kicking in with how spot on this is. Even though i was the only follower in my own hell with this kind of human. Seems like CD could fit this as well as LV following for her own advantages. Imoo[/

I’m so so sorry.

 

[Redvines86]

This is an interesting listen. Thanks for posting. Once again, Chad is perceived as the "nicest guy in the world".

Chad was a master mask wearer. MOO

 

[gumchew]

RSBM

From listening to people who were close to Chad, apparently none of them seen him as a person in the position of authority or leadership, regardless of whether they thought of themselves as a cult or not.

Hehe, this reminds me of a scene in Monty Python and the Holy Grail, where Arthur is explaining to a group of peasants that they are all Britons, and he is their king.

Woman peasant: I didn't know we 'ad a king. I thought we were an 'autonomous collective'.​

I wonder what HE (Chad) thinks about it, though. Does he/did he fancy himself the leader?

 

[Redvines86]

RSBM



Hehe, this reminds me of a scene in Monty Python and the Holy Grail, where Arthur is explaining to a group of peasants that they are all Britons, and he is their king.

Woman peasant: I didn't know we 'ad a king. I thought we were an 'autonomous collective'.​

I wonder what HE (Chad) thinks about it, though. Does he/did he fancy himself the leader?

My question. What part of this was for Lori's benefit, and what part of this was seeing himself as this leader of a large congregation? Hawaii doesn't make sense as the place for setting up his cult. Nobody went with them. I don't know. Then, supposedly, they were going to Mexico, which really doesn't make sense. MOO

 

[gumchew]

Good points I think, I certainly think this cult was mostly for Chad and Lori to get sex, money, Hawaii, and fame as podcasters. I think the religious aspect was pretty secondary to all that. MOO

I agree with that. Self-interest above all other motivations. Anything that even ran a close second would have to serve that first priority. The more I talk this out with all of you, the more it feels like we're putting a lot more thought into the whole 'cult' thing than they were. I really can't wait to hear what they (through their defense teams or otherwise) have to say for themselves. And the treasure trove of communications that I am almost certain that LE must have now.

IMO, Lori wasn't thinking about the logistical problems of building, managing, communicating, leading and ministering to a group of 144,000 people. Per MG, she seemed to be focused on really important things, like having sex with CD three times a day. eyeroll

 

[gumchew]

My question. What part of this was for Lori's benefit, and what part of this was seeing himself as this leader of a large congregation? Hawaii doesn't make sense as the place for setting up his cult. Nobody went with them. I don't know. Then, supposedly, they were going to Mexico, which really doesn't make sense. MOO

@Redvines86 You'd know more about this than me, but isn't there a significance to Mexico in LDS history? I read some stuff about archaeological dig sites. I didn't delve into it.

 

[FLmom777]

I remember seeing a crime show on tv once (don't we all?) that matched the ends of the tape from the crime scene to the roll of duct tape they found at the perp's. Literally lined up like puzzle piece. Doubt we would get that lucky but prints are highly likely and even the type of tape was a significant factor in the Anthony case.

They were able to match the duct tape in the Caylee Anthony case as well.

 

[RickshawFan]

I am wondering how long Tammy suspected CD of having an affair. I know I have no link or proof but I swear there is just no way CD could have kept his walks around BYU w/LVD on the down low for very long without someone who knows TD who would feel compelled to tell their friend. CD & TD had spent enough time in their home/ward/community to establish long lasting relationships. CD put himself out there w/podcasts & books and conferences so that people would recognize him even if they didn't have a close relationship. I know MG & JR mentioned how uncomfortable they were with how close CD & LVD appeared while TD was still alive.
JMO

I find this whole idea of "taking walks around a track to keep your affair secret" bizarre. Who DOES that? Was there something special about the BYU track? If BYU was an it place, why not a tête à tête in the library? The student union?
Here are 100 walks/hikes within 100 miles of Rexburg: 100 Hikes within 100 Miles of Rexburg - Explore Rexburg
There's a nature park in town....
Or....genius thought... they could have spent their valuable time scouting locations for their heavenly tents for the 144k camping couples minus LVD, CD, and pals, since they weren't into camping, tents, or all that icky stuff. Come to think of it, maybe they were scouting the arena...

 

[FLmom777]

Right -- and I think this supports my point that Nate made himself the source of the "dismembered/dismemberment" reference. He has not attributed this characterization to any official source and a reasonable reading of the APC makes dismemberment, at best, something he himself inferred. MOO. I can find no other MSM reference to this until his own reference made national news on 6/23. (I'm not including YouTube since I can't do a detailed word search of video content)

I'm not hating on Nate here -- I love Nate just like everyone else! But it would be really interesting to understand whether him introducing this grisly word was based on something he was told, or based on him adding his interpretation. It gives us perspective on the fine line between being a reporter and becoming the source.

ETA minor word ordering edits to add a little finesse.

In the video he cited the affidavit as the source for dismemberment. The affidavit itself does say this.

 

[wenwe4]

Well the strategy of keeping quiet and not answering any questions about JJ & Tylee worked for a short while for them. Time is no longer on CD & LVD's side as all of the data, the forensics, the links in each puzzle are coming together now with 65 + cell phones data, GPS (on everyone of those phones I would imagine) and bank purchases, etc. come to light.
Seriously any bets on when they begin to "see the light" that they will never walk free in society again?
Option 1) The gravity of the situation hit when the children's remains were uncovered.
Option 2) The "holy crap" moment hit when the charges were read against CD in court.
Option 3) July 23, 2020
Option 4) Upon conclusion of trial(s)
Option 5) . . . .

 

[gumchew]

In the video he cited the affidavit as the source for dismemberment. The affidavit itself does say this.

I'm sorry for challenging your assertion, but having read this affidavit about 30 times now, I have never seen any form of the word dismember or even any of its synonyms in the affidavit. Would you mind giving me a paragraph # as reference?

 

[wenwe4]

I find this whole idea of "taking walks around a track to keep your affair secret" bizarre. Who DOES that? Was there something special about the BYU track? If BYU was an it place, why not a tête à tête in the library? The student union?
Here are 100 walks/hikes within 100 miles of Rexburg: 100 Hikes within 100 Miles of Rexburg - Explore Rexburg
There's a nature park in town....
Or....genius thought... they could have spent their valuable time scouting locations for their heavenly tents for the 144k camping couples minus LVD, CD, and pals, since they weren't into camping, tents, or all that icky stuff. Come to think of it, maybe they were scouting the arena...

I get the feeling that LVD was very much into working out and might enjoy running around the track. I am just not feeling the love for that being a frequent activity for CD, and I see him using the campus as an "escape" whether to inspire his writing or a place to meet up with others.
Seriously, I can't get past the whole end of the world, Armageddon scenario that includes earthquakes & wounded souls but CD & LVD are exempt from damage? What do they do while all the destruction is happening on earth? Levitate? Defy gravity? Float away on a spiritual cloud until everything settles down? How do they skip through that part since "they don't like camping in tents"? Who says they would even survive (in this life)?
Honestly, I don't get it.

 

[Kimmer]

Good points I think, I certainly think this cult was mostly for Chad and Lori to get sex, money, Hawaii, and fame as podcasters. I think the religious aspect was pretty secondary to all that. MOO

Be careful with going out in a limb we know what CD does with them.

 

[wenwe4]

Be careful with going out in a limb we know what CD does with them.

To be fair - I think CD was the only one who mentioned "limbs" IIRC
(ha - couldn't pass this up)

 

[Redvines86]

Fascinating as it is, I think we may be getting way off topic with our Mormon History lesson.

 

[gumchew]

I get the feeling that LVD was very much into working out and might enjoy running around the track. I am just not feeling the love for that being a frequent activity for CD, and I see him using the campus as an "escape" whether to inspire his writing or a place to meet up with others.
Seriously, I can't get past the whole end of the world, Armageddon scenario that includes earthquakes & wounded souls but CD & LVD are exempt from damage? What do they do while all the destruction is happening on earth? Levitate? Defy gravity? Float away on a spiritual cloud until everything settles down? How do they skip through that part since "they don't like camping in tents"? Who says they would even survive (in this life)?
Honestly, I don't get it.

Tread carefully. You're digging into some end-times doctrine that spans a wide cross-section of Christianity, and differs only in some specifics in CD/LVD's version.

 

[wenwe4]

Tread carefully. You're digging into some end-times doctrine that spans a wide cross-section of Christianity, and differs only in details in CD/LVD's version.

I only took that from the "Prepper Pride" comment from MG. My point is more about how CD & LVD are exempt from sleeping in tents and presumably injury to self or soul but the rest of the 144K are all subject to the horrors of the end of times.