Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Tammy Daybell, 49, Sept & Oct 2019 *Arrests* #59

[Inthedetails]

I expect that when the trial actually happens, most of the religious stuff won't matter. The prosecution will have forensic and circumstantial evidence of who did what then, and it will be clear and convincing, and mostly about financial motivations.

I agree there will be plenty of evidence and I'm expecting convictions, but I think the financial motivations were actually religious - they were "preparing" and needed the finances, they felt justified. I don't think the greed was the same greed that we are familiar with.

I'm at risk with TOS to state more so I'll back off, but, in general, I think it's a mistake to discount the role of their beliefs in understanding this case.

(I understand Lori's past greed and manipulations, but think over time she really fell into Chad's cult, willingly and wholeheartedly, until everything was filtered through those beliefs....to the point of incompetency.)

jmo

 

[carolann0308]

I would just love a good Shrink to find the right medication and talk therapy to WAKE UP her evil little brain.
Just long enough for her to assist in her defense, and to help her clearly remember every day for the rest of her life the path of destruction and death she orchestrated.

 

[Niner]

A reminder: Chad Daybell is back in court June 9, 10:30 MST/12:30 EST.

Is that from the court site - I have it starting at 9am MT.

 

[TheLoadedGoat]

Is the jury really all LDS. That is fantastic. They may be the only people qualified to sort this out. I trust them as wholesome, law abiding, people as a whole and think they’d do the best job. Amazing that they are all LDS. LV and CD are giving the Mormon church a bad name. Nothing they have done would be acceptable to LDS members so I truly doubt they will find sympathy there.

We are far from picking a jury. But the assumption is that it will be made up mostly of LDS because of the demographics of the area.

 

[watergirl62]

Is that from the court site - I have it starting at 9am MT.

Chad's hearing is at 1030am local time.

 

[Niner]

Chad's hearing is at 1030am local time.

View attachment 299959

Thanks!

 

[wenwe4]

We are far from picking a jury. But the assumption is that it will be made up mostly of LDS because of the demographics of the area.

I would agree! In addition, even if one of the jurors is not the most "LDS friendly" person (ie: didn't believe their doctrine) that would not make that juror pro-child killer. If anything, I think they would be just as willing to call out the defendant's with "Do not try and hide behind your religion to justify your acts!" MOO

 

[wenwe4]

I would just love a good Shrink to find the right medication and talk therapy to WAKE UP her evil little brain.
Just long enough for her to assist in her defense, and to help her clearly remember every day for the rest of her life the path of destruction and death she orchestrated.

Both would be best practice for her, however if her issues are more Personality disordered - she may continue with her same behaviors we saw previously in court (nose in the air, strutting, skittles red lips, coiffed). My suspicious mind suspects she has an extremely fragile ego & covers up with the "perfect appearance" as it has gotten her favors/forgiveness/enabling from others. Maybe the only way she could "rise above" this most recent "disgrace" (incompetency) is to become the very vision she & CD created for her. A legend in her own mind.

 

[acutename]

Both would be best practice for her, however if her issues are more Personality disordered - she may continue with her same behaviors we saw previously in court (nose in the air, strutting, skittles red lips, coiffed). My suspicious mind suspects she has an extremely fragile ego & covers up with the "perfect appearance" as it has gotten her favors/forgiveness/enabling from others. Maybe the only way she could "rise above" this most recent "disgrace" (incompetency) is to become the very vision she & CD created for her. A legend in her own mind.

If LVD is incompetent, I do not believe that 90days of anything will change her, IMO.
That provision would make sense to me if you had someone with a substance abuse problem and you could detox them, or someone who was off Rx meds and you could re-dose them, or really someone with any number of acute medical conditions that could be treated to a remission, but we do not have any information to align with a condition like that.

 

[Boxer]

If LVD is incompetent, I do not believe that 90days of anything will change her, IMO.
That provision would make sense to me if you had someone with a substance abuse problem and you could detox them, or someone who was off Rx meds and you could re-dose them, or really someone with any number of acute medical conditions that could be treated to a remission, but we do not have any information to align with a condition like that.

Agree.
Her only mission is to be incompetent until CDs trial is over.
Manipulation is her entire game plan at all times.

 

[Nosurprise]

I’ve had it. While I’m convinced Lori has just been spouting her “beliefs” to con people, Woods agrees Lori is crazy. Apparently if you pretend that you are chosen and killed people because you believed it was the right thing to do and just stick to your story you can avoid criminal culpability.

Meanwhile Chad’s defense can say even the prosecution agrees Lori is clearly off her rocker. And because she’s off her rocker she and Alex killed everyone without Chad’s involvement. Poor Chad’s is no more than a victim of Lori’s psychosis and must be set free. He may not get off scott free but the sentence if any will be a lot lighter be ause of Lori’s ploy.

If Lori can convince professionals she’s crazy she’ll also be able to convince them restorative treatment isn’t working. Until the dust settles, when she’ll be equally successful convincing whomever she needs to that she’s cured. And she’ll be released. Where she can rejoin Chad or Means or her shrink or whomever her sights are set on at the time.

Of course, a mental hospital is no picnic, if she recovers she’ll go to prison and blah, blah, blah. But I don’t like the odds that at the end of the day these monsters are going to get away with a few years in a facility, a slap on the wrist, sullied reputations and probably millions of $s in book and movie rights, podcast revenue, etc.. I envy the certainty of those comforted by the thought she’ll never see the light of day. I understand that logic but unfortunately I have more confidence in her ability to beat the system than I do in the system itself.

Karma’s a crock. Rightly or wrongly I’m convinced the prosecution is an unsuspecting (or cowardly) stooge who just handed Chad his get out of jail free card. Fearing there will never be justice for Tylee and JJ makes me feel sick. Not to mention the precedence this sets.

I know there are plenty of people who think poor Lori may really be crazy, but I don’t buy it. I’ll never buy it. If I continue to follow this case with my current mindset I’m just going to annoy myself and a bunch of other people too.

So unless and until I have a change of heart, or I’m wrong and Lori is someday actually brought to trial I’m afraid I’m done following this case. It’s not good for my disposition or the people who have to live with me.

MOO

I agree with you 100% . I have seen too many cases go the wrong way and not get justice for the victims..

 

[Boxer]

How did Alex get Tylee from Rexberg to CDs house?
She was a big girl.

 

[fuzzybutter]

Lori is a master manipulator and I believe Prior and Means are working in tandem to get separated trials. Means can convince Lori her best bet is to go to a State psychiatric facility until Chads trial is over. She plays it well. Could be there a year or more to be “restored”.

Prior can get a trial blaming everything on Alex and Lori. Maybe get a reduced sentence for Chad, if he can somehow convince the jury that Tammy died of natural causes.

Then Lori comes back and pleads her case that she has a psychosis because of Chads books. Chad cannot be tried twice so she too gets a reduced sentence because she was “crazy” at that time. In fact, she may never be “restored” for years.

In my opinion, the entire justice system is becoming soft on criminals and always giving them an out due to their past. Always the fault of “someone else”. The criminal becomes the victim.

This is not how any of this works! Prior and Means are working attorneys. Defending people is their job. They are not friends with their clients. They probably don’t even like them. If either of them tried the behavior you mentioned they would be disbarred. Wilmot and Nurmi loathed Jodi Arias.

Another thing: Lori has little or no control over what happens to her. She and Means did not decide that she would act incompetent. Mental health professionals are very aware that people will try to fake incompetency. Give them credit to see through that ruse. Personally, I think Lori has been mentally off for years, but she was able to hide at times. The attorneys, court staff and mental health practitioners are all trained professionals and they are doing their jobs. This is not their first rodeo. LV and CD are not the brightest bulbs on the porch, plus they have some off the wall beliefs. They will each go through the justice system and pay the consequences for what they have done. There will be no reduced sentences. Even if Lori remains incompetent for years, state hospitals for criminals are not pleasant places. They are not places where you or I would go for inpatient treatment.

 

[MTW2011]

This is not how any of this works! Prior and Means are working attorneys. Defending people is their job. They are not friends with their clients. They probably don’t even like them. If either of them tried the behavior you mentioned they would be disbarred. Wilmot and Nurmi loathed Jodi Arias.

Another thing: Lori has little or no control over what happens to her. She and Means did not decide that she would act incompetent. Mental health professionals are very aware that people will try to fake incompetency. Give them credit to see through that ruse. Personally, I think Lori has been mentally off for years, she was able to hide at times. The attorneys, court staff and mental health practitioners are all trained professionals and they are doing their jobs. This is not their first rodeo. LV and CD are not the brightest bulbs on the porch, plus they have some off the wall beliefs. They will each go through the justice system and pay the consequences for what they have done. There will be no reduced sentences. Even if Lori remains incompetent for years, state hospitals for criminals are not pleasant places. They are not places where you or I would go for inpatient treatment.

thank you for mentioning this, I’ve personally been a bit disappointed in the sheer number of people (mostly on social media and elsewhere but some here too) who’ve thought Lori was able to fake all of this, it’s part of her master plan, and think that she knows better how to fake competency and fool a professional who’s trained in this and determining one’s competency. It’s possible she could fake this, I don’t think that’s likely though, especially since she’s the one who wanted their cases to be kept together - doing this would totally undermine the chance of that still happening, it pushes pause on her case but not on Chad’s. So if she’s smart enough to fake incompetency, then she’s not THAT smart in order to realize how that would make it even less likely that their cases remain joined together. It just seems more likely IMHO that she has had some mental decline - enough to be deemed incompetent- than her faking incompetence. Plus, none of this drops her charges and gets her out of jail, or any future consequences of her actions, so I just don’t see much of a benefit if she chose to fake this.

 

[fuzzybutter]

She sure wasn’t crazy ordering, wearing & dancing in wedding attire , getting a tan, highlighting her hair, buying & wearing little skirts & yoga wear, pulling her luggage whilst flipping her hair & purchasing travel. Renting a place in Hawaii (stating I have NO children in the agreement). She didn’t look bat- bananas crazy when found in HI.
And that’s the most recent “picture” pre arrest.
Not crazy. Defiant , self absorbed & enjoying herself.

She can’t have it both ways!
She knew they were going to be dead.
She knew they were in fact dead.
She rented & hid their belongings in a storage locker.
Planned, with many opportunities to abort the plan.
She had the aforethought to tell Mel to lie that the kids were there, with Mel.

It’s not like she snapped and drown them in the bath tub.
She wanted them out of her new life with CD.
She wanted and did keep using the children’s SS death benefits.
Crazy like a fox.


MOO

I don’t understand why she couldn’t be mentally ill and do all of the superficial activities you mentioned. If anything, it seems to me that any mom that could kill her kids and then dance on a beach in Hawaii a couple weeks later probably has a few screws loose. My friends with kids talk about feeling like a momma bear once their kids were born and confidently knowing that they would do anything to protect the kid. Lori used some made up nonsense (that has nothing to do with LDS beliefs) to justify their murder. That is evidence of some severely disordered thoughts

 

[fuzzybutter]

thank you for mentioning this, I’ve personally been a bit disappointed in the sheer number of people (mostly on social media and elsewhere but some here too) who’ve thought Lori was able to fake all of this, it’s part of her master plan, and think that she knows better how to fake competency and fool a professional who’s trained in this and determining one’s competency. It’s possible she could fake this, I don’t think that’s likely though, especially since she’s the one who wanted their cases to be kept together - doing this would totally undermine the chance of that still happening, it pushes pause on her case but not on Chad’s. So if she’s smart enough to fake incompetency, then she’s not THAT smart in order to realize how that would make it even less likely that their cases remain joined together. It just seems more likely IMHO that she has had some mental decline - enough to be deemed incompetent- than her faking incompetence. Plus, none of this drops her charges and gets her out of jail, or any future consequences of her actions, so I just don’t see much of a benefit if she chose to fake this.

Totally agree with you. Lori is not very smart, ignorant and has a tendency to flee if anyone asks her to many questions. She is certainly is not controlling this situation

 

[wenwe4]

To be fair, Charles pleaded w/LEO and mental health professionals to have her assessed way back when. She may have truly lost all touch with her reality since she has been behind bars, isolated even more due to Covid, and not interacting with many people except her Atty & her letters to CD. Does anyone think she has been receiving letters or communication from CD since they have been incarcerated? I think all of this will force the cases to be separated (due to CD's moving forward and LVD's being stalled).

 

[MTW2011]

Totally agree with you. Lori is not very smart, ignorant and has a tendency to flee if anyone asks her to many questions. She is certainly is not controlling this situation

And going even further with this line of thinking….
I think we know Lori liked to try and control her image and how others perceived her. I am not even sure if she’d want people to think she could be “incompetent” or “crazy” (since many conflate these two) and that she’s had any sort of mental crisis or breakdown or something like that. I’m not sure but IMO I don’t think she’d want that. She may like the ‘fame’ and notoriety but I don’t think she’d want that to happen by way of the world finding she’s been deemed incompetent for some reason.

 

[LinasK]

This is not how any of this works! Prior and Means are working attorneys. Defending people is their job. They are not friends with their clients. They probably don’t even like them. If either of them tried the behavior you mentioned they would be disbarred. Wilmot and Nurmi loathed Jodi Arias.

Another thing: Lori has little or no control over what happens to her. She and Means did not decide that she would act incompetent. Mental health professionals are very aware that people will try to fake incompetency. Give them credit to see through that ruse. Personally, I think Lori has been mentally off for years, but she was able to hide at times. The attorneys, court staff and mental health practitioners are all trained professionals and they are doing their jobs. This is not their first rodeo. LV and CD are not the brightest bulbs on the porch, plus they have some off the wall beliefs. They will each go through the justice system and pay the consequences for what they have done. There will be no reduced sentences. Even if Lori remains incompetent for years, state hospitals for criminals are not pleasant places. They are not places where you or I would go for inpatient treatment.

Thank you for such a common sense post.

 

[dcfi224]

If LVD is incompetent, I do not believe that 90days of anything will change her, IMO.
That provision would make sense to me if you had someone with a substance abuse problem and you could detox them, or someone who was off Rx meds and you could re-dose them, or really someone with any number of acute medical conditions that could be treated to a remission, but we do not have any information to align with a condition like that.

Agreed, unfortunately. I really do find the timing of the concern about competency interesting. If it was a truly organic condition, why now? I know CV had questioned her MH, as he should have, but even that wasn’t enough. I don’t think she was in the right frame of mind when any of these crimes were committed, but I believe she knew what she was doing (and has been a master manipulator for a very long time; though I am not saying she is manipulating the professionals evaluating her by any means).

So why wasn’t competency questioned sooner?
Her previous court appearances had all been on hold for a while, right? Please correct me if I’m wrong! Do we know the exact reason why?

I sincerely hope she gets the intensive therapy she needs, so that she can be tried appropriately. Medication can only do so much, and it’s a mystery to me what they might be treating.