GUILTY IL - Katrina Smith, 30, beaten to death, Machesney Park, 23 Oct 2012 - #2

[Annie1004]

(respectfully snipped)

WS is no longer verifying posters - this was previously addressed in an earlier post on this thread.

WS still verifies insiders who knew the principal(s) in a case prior to the crime being committed/the person(s) disappeared. WS no longer verifies LOCALS, from what I understand.

Because LE is keeping this close-to-the-vest, it is easy to surmise what is going on behind the scenes. I am sure an arrest is imminent and no one will be surprised.

I have seen threads closed for clean-up for pointing fingers, followed by stern Admin warnings, on less accusations than appear in this case. Just sayin'.

 

[cluciano63]

I have not posted much lately; all I will say now is that as generally unshockable as I am these days, I will make an exception and be truly shocked if Katrina's husband is innocent regarding her murder.

 

[Knox]

A new and improved version of "that website" is back up ...

 

[SmoothOperator]

:waitasec: :waitasec:





The news release shown below is a very "publicaly" stated document by LE ...

I have great respect and appreciation for all LE, and I know several personally. These LE have been working around the clock since Katrina disappeared. Any information they have and will be able to share with the public is highly regarded by me. No one can be more disappointed than they are that an arrest has not been possible yet.

:cop: :grouphug: :detective:

I'm sorry it appears as tho you missed what is the subject of my post..which hasn't anything to do with disagreeing that LE made a public statement on 10/24.. Quite obviously LE made a public statement on 10/24.. this is irrelevant to the actual issue to which scadder and I disagree. The subject that was up for debate is the actual meaning of the statement not whether or not a statement was made publicly. Clearly I agree a statement was made otherwise what would be up for debate regarding the meaning of the statement that was disagreed upon over the course of several posts by scadder and I??..:waitasec:

IMO now going back with the actual, correct issue of debate its clearly not an issue of if/when LE made a public statement..for its the meaning of that exact public statement that was the entire subject at hand... :crazy:

 

[SmoothOperator]

IMO not much to say at this point in time.. More of a waiting for the other shoe to drop, so to speak..or not..either way it's a period of waiting for LE next cue to see what direction the case is heading.. IMO my prayer is that its heading for resolve no matter who it is that is responsible for bringing this horrific nightmare to fruition.

 

[Seajay]

I want the RIGHT person caught and I want the RIGHT person prosecuted. I don't care who it is. I don't have a dog in this fight, I want to see the person who brutally murdered Katrina Smith brought to justice. I don't care if it's Todd Smith or if it's Mickey Mouse. And until LE arrests someone and they are prosecuted, everyone is a suspect and no one is a suspect.

 

[LMStyle]

I'm not talking about any quote you made. The implication of your statement is that McDonough's source is incorrect and that because of that false rumors are being spread. With the lack of information being given by the Sheriff to the MSM we really don't have much to go on at all. Because WS doesn't verify locals anymore we can either choose to trust someone who says they have inside sources or not. I just don't get the point of your post saying that it's not necessary to get a Search Warrant to enter a house when another poster of ours who claims to have someone close to the investigation stated that in fact there was a search warrant that day. Not sure the point of contesting that.

Actually if you go back and re-read her post, first she stated the day after Katrina was reported missing police kicked in the garage door to gain access to the house while Todd was at the police station being questioned.

There is no information of this from the LE or from MSM and the only source she had was a post made on FB which has since been deleted. So of course there is no way to verify if the post ever existed, who actually posted it, was it really a neighbor, or was it someone just making crap up, like many of the people posting on there did for awhile at the start until their posts kept getting deleted, and they moved on to the brothers site.

Moving on to the brothers site which she then brought up has been full of so much crap and made up stuff that even the brother who hates TS more than anyone else possibly could even discredited much of the stuff posted there by a few specific posters who proved to have been posting completely false information.

Finally the last statement she made leads people to believe that something TS said during the interview incriminated himself and gave them reason to believe Katrina was possibly still in the home or there was evidence to be found.

It's just like all the frenzy about the search warrant being issued and mentioned in the press release and people automatically assuming that they must have something if they are searching the house.

These things are just standard procedure in missing person/murder cases such as this. They will do an early sweep of the home, they will enter without a warrant based on emergency and exigent circumstances and you can go on record as refusing the search, but they will do it anyhow.

If I seem defensive, then I probably was, but there are plenty of posters here who disagree with me or hold a different stance and I have no issue with their posts or statements or opinion. The only ones I have an issue with are the ones that lead others reading to believe the information is not of that posters own opinion and are from a source in LE or whatever.

Saying a source close to the case told me "blah blah blah" really leads people to believe whatever is said after that MUST be true as it came from someone directly in the heat of all this information. I just think it sets a false pretense for the validity of the information being stated. Similar to saying a neighbor of the home posted on FB but then it was deleted does. Where is the proof it was really a neighbor?

Sorry I am fine with the speculation, I am fine with people believing what they want to believe, having their opinions on who is guilty. I could be wrong about Todd, but they are not just some media story to me. That whole family has been close to me for decades. When this is all said and done many of the people here won't be affected by it at all, they never knew Katrina, they don't know the Smiths, nothing changes for them. How this all plays out changes everything for the family and friends.

 

[Micheline]

I have seen it being mentioned a couple of times now that TS reported his wife missing the next day, even more in the evening of the next day.

I think that is what he officially did, and that that probably is what LE stated, reported missing the next day in the evening.

Since TS last saw Katrina around 8 on the 22th, even if he did call police later that night or in the morning and afternoon, since Katrina was an adult he would have to wait 24 hours to be able to officially report her missing, which apparently is what he did.

 

[southernnana]

:shakehead: :shakehead:

No ... I didn't miss the subject of your post .... it's the last paragraph in your post that got my attention.

In the last paragraph in your post you implied that WS posters and LE were being dishonest by your comment that "Even if LE believed that, there's no way they would have publicly stated such." .... The comment you were referring to and denying having been made, and which has been quoted here on WS as an LE source .... was indeed reported by the Sheriff's Dept in their 10-24-12 press release as follows, "At this point it is unknown if Ms Smith left on her own or if she is the victim of foul play."

There's three things I cannot stand ... Abuse of Children, Abuse of Animals, and Unwarranted Criticism of Law Enforcement Officers.

I honestly do not believe that the statement meant either she left Todd's home alive..or never left from Todd's home alive.. At 24hrs in even if LE believed that there's no way they would have publicly stated such..jmo, tho.

<snipped> and BBM

I'm sorry it appears as tho you missed what is the subject of my post..
<snipped> Quite obviously LE made a public statement on 10/24..

<snipped> and BBM

 

[LMStyle]

I have seen it being mentioned a couple of times now that TS reported his wife missing the next day, even more in the evening of the next day.

I think that is what he officially did, and that that probably is what LE stated, reported missing the next day in the evening.

Since TS last saw Katrina around 8 on the 22th, even if he did call police later that night or in the morning and afternoon, since Katrina was an adult he would have to wait 24 hours to be able to officially report her missing, which apparently is what he did.

I have tried to get information regarding the actual time he made his report but all means have so far turned up nothing. Even Nellie scoured hours and hours of scanner archives looking to see if she could find anything over the scanner that would help give us a better timeline. Thank you again for doing that, I know that had to be rough and extremely time consuming.

Evening is a very relative term, by definition it means any time after noon until night. All we know is the car was reported found at 7:50pm so it had to be before that, but was it 10 minutes before or 5 hours, hopefully at some point we will find out.

 

[LMStyle]

:shakehead: :shakehead:

No ... I didn't miss the subject of your post .... it's the last paragraph in your post that got my attention.

In the last paragraph in your post you implied that WS posters and LE were being dishonest by your comment that "Even if LE believed that, there's no way they would have publicly stated such." .... The comment you were referring to and denying having been made, and which has been quoted here on WS as an LE source .... was indeed reported by the Sheriff's Dept in their 10-24-12 press release as follows, "At this point it is unknown if Ms Smith left on her own or if she is the victim of foul play."

There's three things I cannot stand ... Abuse of Children, Abuse of Animals, and Unwarranted Criticism of Law Enforcement Officers.


<snipped> and BBM

<snipped> and BBM

Wow I did not read that comment in that way at all. Here is how I interpreted it. That LE was unsure at that point if Katrina had gone missing on her own, like to a friend or a relatives, or if she had gone missing as a victim of foul play. Some times when someone goes missing, LE tracks the person down at a friend or relatives and they verify they are in fact ok, but left on their own free will and do not want certain parties to know their whereabouts. This happens with married adults, it happens with adult children leaving their parents, it's strange to me, but some people do, do it.

The point I think she was trying to make was that some posters were interpreting what the police said to be as she quoted just before that "I honestly do not believe that the statement meant either she left Todd's home alive..or never left from Todd's home alive." because some were saying they felt that the police were trying to imply that they felt she left the home alive or possibly dead, which is NOT something they would state at that point in the investigation. The only time they would state that would be later in the investigation if they had proof she was the victim of the husband and they are unsure if she left the home alive and then was killed, or if she was killed and then taken from the home.

She was just trying to clear up some misinformation or misconception about how something was stated.

 

[Micheline]

:shakehead: :shakehead:

No ... I didn't miss the subject of your post .... it's the last paragraph in your post that got my attention.

In the last paragraph in your post you implied that WS posters and LE were being dishonest by your comment that "Even if LE believed that, there's no way they would have publicly stated such." .... The comment you were referring to and denying having been made, and which has been quoted here on WS as an LE source .... was indeed reported by the Sheriff's Dept in their 10-24-12 press release as follows, "At this point it is unknown if Ms Smith left on her own or if she is the victim of foul play."

Originally Posted by SmoothOperator

I honestly do not believe that the statement meant either she left Todd's home alive..or never left from Todd's home alive.. At 24hrs in even if LE believed that there's no way they would have publicly stated such..jmo, tho.

I think two things are mixed up here, on Oct 24 Katrina Smith was missing, LE stated that at that point it being unknown if she left on her own or if was the victim of foul play.

That does not equal LE stating them not knowing if she left Todd's home on her own or being the victim of foul play by Todd, but if she choose to go wherever it is she went at that point unknown, or if she had become the victim of foul play by person(s) unknown.

 

[katydid23]

Actually if you go back and re-read her post, first she stated the day after Katrina was reported missing police kicked in the garage door to gain access to the house while Todd was at the police station being questioned.

There is no information of this from the LE or from MSM and the only source she had was a post made on FB which has since been deleted. So of course there is no way to verify if the post ever existed, who actually posted it, was it really a neighbor, or was it someone just making crap up, like many of the people posting on there did for awhile at the start until their posts kept getting deleted, and they moved on to the brothers site.

Moving on to the brothers site which she then brought up has been full of so much crap and made up stuff that even the brother who hates TS more than anyone else possibly could even discredited much of the stuff posted there by a few specific posters who proved to have been posting completely false information.

Finally the last statement she made leads people to believe that something TS said during the interview incriminated himself and gave them reason to believe Katrina was possibly still in the home or there was evidence to be found.

It's just like all the frenzy about the search warrant being issued and mentioned in the press release and people automatically assuming that they must have something if they are searching the house.

These things are just standard procedure in missing person/murder cases such as this. They will do an early sweep of the home, they will enter without a warrant based on emergency and exigent circumstances and you can go on record as refusing the search, but they will do it anyhow.

If I seem defensive, then I probably was, but there are plenty of posters here who disagree with me or hold a different stance and I have no issue with their posts or statements or opinion. The only ones I have an issue with are the ones that lead others reading to believe the information is not of that posters own opinion and are from a source in LE or whatever.

Saying a source close to the case told me "blah blah blah" really leads people to believe whatever is said after that MUST be true as it came from someone directly in the heat of all this information. I just think it sets a false pretense for the validity of the information being stated. Similar to saying a neighbor of the home posted on FB but then it was deleted does. Where is the proof it was really a neighbor?

Sorry I am fine with the speculation, I am fine with people believing what they want to believe, having their opinions on who is guilty. I could be wrong about Todd, but they are not just some media story to me. That whole family has been close to me for decades. When this is all said and done many of the people here won't be affected by it at all, they never knew Katrina, they don't know the Smiths, nothing changes for them. How this all plays out changes everything for the family and friends.

My heart goes out to you, and I realize it must be really painful for you, having known this family for decades. I am sorry that you have to experience this.

But I do want to say, with all due respect to you, that in my experience, sometimes, it is those closest to the suspect that have the hardest time seeing their potential guilt. I wouldn't expect you to be able to see his potential to kill, because he probably never showed that part of himself around his friends. [ I am not saying he is guilty, btw.]

My uncle, who was sexually abusive when I was a young child, NEVER EVER showed that side of himself to my family. So hen I finally told what he did, decades later, nobody could accept or process it. He never revealed that side of himself to his friends and family.

 

[shefner]

My heart goes out to you, and I realize it must be really painful for you, having known this family for decades. I am sorry that you have to experience this.

But I do want to say, with all due respect to you, that in my experience, sometimes, it is those closest to the suspect that have the hardest time seeing their potential guilt. I wouldn't expect you to be able to see his potential to kill, because he probably never showed that part of himself around his friends. [ I am not saying he is guilty, btw.]

My uncle, who was sexually abusive when I was a young child, NEVER EVER showed that side of himself to my family. So hen I finally told what he did, decades later, nobody could accept or process it. He never revealed that side of himself to his friends and family.

Blessings on you, katydid....(((hugs)))

 

[scadder21]

Actually if you go back and re-read her post, first she stated the day after Katrina was reported missing police kicked in the garage door to gain access to the house while Todd was at the police station being questioned.

There is no information of this from the LE or from MSM and the only source she had was a post made on FB which has since been deleted. So of course there is no way to verify if the post ever existed, who actually posted it, was it really a neighbor, or was it someone just making crap up, like many of the people posting on there did for awhile at the start until their posts kept getting deleted, and they moved on to the brothers site.

Moving on to the brothers site which she then brought up has been full of so much crap and made up stuff that even the brother who hates TS more than anyone else possibly could even discredited much of the stuff posted there by a few specific posters who proved to have been posting completely false information.

Finally the last statement she made leads people to believe that something TS said during the interview incriminated himself and gave them reason to believe Katrina was possibly still in the home or there was evidence to be found.

It's just like all the frenzy about the search warrant being issued and mentioned in the press release and people automatically assuming that they must have something if they are searching the house.

These things are just standard procedure in missing person/murder cases such as this. They will do an early sweep of the home, they will enter without a warrant based on emergency and exigent circumstances and you can go on record as refusing the search, but they will do it anyhow.

If I seem defensive, then I probably was, but there are plenty of posters here who disagree with me or hold a different stance and I have no issue with their posts or statements or opinion. The only ones I have an issue with are the ones that lead others reading to believe the information is not of that posters own opinion and are from a source in LE or whatever.

Saying a source close to the case told me "blah blah blah" really leads people to believe whatever is said after that MUST be true as it came from someone directly in the heat of all this information. I just think it sets a false pretense for the validity of the information being stated. Similar to saying a neighbor of the home posted on FB but then it was deleted does. Where is the proof it was really a neighbor?

Sorry I am fine with the speculation, I am fine with people believing what they want to believe, having their opinions on who is guilty. I could be wrong about Todd, but they are not just some media story to me. That whole family has been close to me for decades. When this is all said and done many of the people here won't be affected by it at all, they never knew Katrina, they don't know the Smiths, nothing changes for them. How this all plays out changes everything for the family and friends.

Just curious when you mention you have known the family for years is that back in the TR days when Todd was younger? Or did you meet them when he was with his first wife or have you known them just since he got together with Katrina?

Honestly, it doesn't matter to me but I'm curious what you mean when you say you have been close to the family. Not specifically sure which aspect of the family that that means.

 

[shefner]

Can NOT believe there has been no arrest in this case. What the heck is going on?

 

[LMStyle]

Just curious when you mention you have known the family for years is that back in the TR days when Todd was younger? Or did you meet them when he was with his first wife or have you known them just since he got together with Katrina?

Honestly, it doesn't matter to me but I'm curious what you mean when you say you have been close to the family. Not specifically sure which aspect of the family that that means.

After the TR days, but before the girls were born, I would say around 1990. Also I would have to check and it would be fairly easy to see, but I believe he did the name change just before the first was born, could have some correlation with the timing, so that they were all Smiths instead of Rapragers. At least if that is the case, it would look more like he did it for that reason, rather than trying to hide from his past which many seem to think the name change was for.

 

[Kikigrown]

Actually if you go back and re-read her post, first she stated the day after Katrina was reported missing police kicked in the garage door to gain access to the house while Todd was at the police station being questioned.

There is no information of this from the LE or from MSM and the only source she had was a post made on FB which has since been deleted. So of course there is no way to verify if the post ever existed, who actually posted it, was it really a neighbor, or was it someone just making crap up, like many of the people posting on there did for awhile at the start until their posts kept getting deleted, and they moved on to the brothers site.

Moving on to the brothers site which she then brought up has been full of so much crap and made up stuff that even the brother who hates TS more than anyone else possibly could even discredited much of the stuff posted there by a few specific posters who proved to have been posting completely false information.

Finally the last statement she made leads people to believe that something TS said during the interview incriminated himself and gave them reason to believe Katrina was possibly still in the home or there was evidence to be found.

It's just like all the frenzy about the search warrant being issued and mentioned in the press release and people automatically assuming that they must have something if they are searching the house.

These things are just standard procedure in missing person/murder cases such as this. They will do an early sweep of the home, they will enter without a warrant based on emergency and exigent circumstances and you can go on record as refusing the search, but they will do it anyhow.

If I seem defensive, then I probably was, but there are plenty of posters here who disagree with me or hold a different stance and I have no issue with their posts or statements or opinion. The only ones I have an issue with are the ones that lead others reading to believe the information is not of that posters own opinion and are from a source in LE or whatever.

Saying a source close to the case told me "blah blah blah" really leads people to believe whatever is said after that MUST be true as it came from someone directly in the heat of all this information. I just think it sets a false pretense for the validity of the information being stated. Similar to saying a neighbor of the home posted on FB but then it was deleted does. Where is the proof it was really a neighbor?

Sorry I am fine with the speculation, I am fine with people believing what they want to believe, having their opinions on who is guilty. I could be wrong about Todd, but they are not just some media story to me. That whole family has been close to me for decades. When this is all said and done many of the people here won't be affected by it at all, they never knew Katrina, they don't know the Smiths, nothing changes for them. How this all plays out changes everything for the family and friends.

Sherlock Holmes said you should never theorize before you have the facts-because then you twist the facts to suit theories rather than twisting theories to suit facts.

 

[cluckcluckcluckcluck]

I know it is splitting hairs, but that is just how I am: LE said she was reported missing the "evening" of 10/23. Can we all agree that that does NOT mean anytime after noon until the 7:50 PM when her vehicle was reported missing? If someone is coming over at 1:00 this afternoon for high tea, I would NEVER say they were coming over this evening. I would say afternoon. Evening means suppertime/twilight until the time he reported her missing. Lets also be clear that the car could have been reported sighted at 7:50PM, and TS may not have reported her missing until 8:30 or 9:00 or 10:00 for all we know. Im not sure that we established that his report (since we have no time clue to establish when that was) lead them to her car. Her car could have been found, they ran the tag, they found her address, they relayed the info, and when there was a break in emergencies, they could have driven to her home. If no one was home and they could not reach Katrina and if TS had not already reported her missing, they would have no way of knowing this was an emergency. Maybe it was only when police called him or a neighbor called him that there were police at his house or he came home and there was a note from PD on his door or something (?), did he then report her missing. I realize this is only a theory, but lets look at all possibilities here. Lets not assume that at 5 PM TS called the Roscoe (?) PD, reported her missing and then they drove to this obtuse corner and found her car. THAT, to me does not seem to be the logical chain of events. My point: By the use of the word EVENING, TS did not report her missing until 5PM-ish or later (before 7:50 and then the car being located or after 7:50 following the car being located) on 10/23. It may make no difference, or it might make a world of difference. JMHO.....

 

[LMStyle]

To be fair I think they knew most likely it wasn't A. Her brand new vehicle was seen abandoned on the road and shortly after they found some of her personal effects near by in the grassy area. Logic says if she's going to disappear herself she will simply take her vehicle and drive somewhere rather than abandon it.

I agree and disagree. Yes, why leave a perfectly good vehicle, when you could use it to get away, at least for the first 24 hours. It makes sense, however if you really did want to get away, you do have to leave the car and the cell phone as they can both be used to find/track you down if you are using them. The cell phone is like a tracking device if being monitored and the car has plates that identify it and could be picked up by LE or plate capture cameras that automatically run them through databases and alert the operator of a "hit" on a vehicle plate.

So if one truly wanted to disappear, it would be wise to ditch the vehicle and the phone somewhere and then be far from it, via public transportation until your picture goes up on the news, or via a very trusted friend or relative.

Obviously this was not the case in this situation, but people have been known to do similar things to get away, or fake their death to start a new life.