GUILTY IL - Katrina Smith, 30, beaten to death, Machesney Park, 23 Oct 2012 - #2

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SmoothOperator said:
Yep..iberico you're correct it does state its believed she was killed in the home and placed in the trunk..

Hmmm.wonder if they've gotten copies of any of the warrants(ie.arrest warrant) due to the fact le hasn't publicly stated such makes me believe media has seen the arrezt warrant to get this info..

Wish they'd link to a pdf of actual warrant as they do for most Cases..

Well I've definitely underestimated this little man's strength.. His tiny self not only transported her body out of the home..but then into the trunk of her car..and then back out of the trunk of her car..and then across a river bank and into the river..

Along with the fact that he disposed of her car, quite likely his own clothes, along with murder weapon, etc, and then went back to the home and cleaned an entire blunt force beating death crime scene...ALL UNDER 24 HOURS!

SORRY BUT I AM SHOCKED!
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SMOOTHE--- I swam and wrestled in high school and guys who weighed around 130 lbs could bench press 250-300lbs and had all kinds of "super stength" No it would'nt surprise me Todd could do this crime by himself..
 
Iberico said:
I thought it was pretty widely believed that with adrenaline in survival fight or flight mode, humans are capable of great strength? It can't really be scientifically tested, because it has to be a high-stress situation. But there have been plenty of documented incidences of super human strength that was temporary.

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/arts/circus-arts/adrenaline-[/B]strength.htm
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IBERICO----Under unsual stress humans can do extroardinary things physically...Ever heard of people lifting a car up by the bumper to save someone trapped underneath..

Or soldiers carrying a person twice their size to safety during combat

Or what about siblings who've never run more than 50 feet in their life all of a sudden will muster the strength of will and run a 26 mile marathon to raise money for their brother's cancer treatments so he can live ...It's true.
 
That type of adrenaline rush is typically followed by physical exhaustion/fatigue ...

Did he have the rush when he was beating her to death? Transferring her body to the vehicle? Throwing her in the river? or rushing around planting evidence to make it look like she was abducted? Cleaning the crime scene? Pretending to look for her and reporting her missing?

I'm surprised he had the energy. Survival mode, I suppose.

imo
 
SmoothOperator said:
Thanks, darling....hmmm..sounds weird but I'm guessing that's because its out of context..in that I'll have to read up to see if it discussed the prior to going shopping part of the night... I was unaware that she had been there at the home doing laundry..then went out shopping..then returned to Todds to finish her laundry..off to go read up..

Thanks again for the info and link..
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I agree with you that this was completely out of context. I do not think LE stated anything regarding where she was attacked/transported.

"Investigators allege Todd killed Katrina Smith, 30, the evening of Oct. 22.

It is believed Katrina was killed in the couple’s Machesney Park home at 8239 Tetterhall Lane.

Her body was reportedly placed in the trunk of her Chevrolet Cruze and transported to the Rock River, where it was discovered nearly three weeks later."

The first part is what the investigators allege, the second and 3rd sentences are purely speculation, but because of the order it is stated it makes it seem as if it is all tied together.

Especially the reported part, if someone, anyone reported that she was placed in the trunk, then either someone saw it, or an accomplice is talking to police, or cadaver dogs got a hit on the trunk.

I did find it interesting that the investigators have 4 different theories on how the crime was committed, so they are charging him for all 4 and then will see which way it goes and then all but 1 of the 4 first degree murder charges will stick. I don't think I have ever heard of anything like this personally.
 
Regarding:
Iberico said:
......
Buyer: Katrina A Nalevac
Seller: .........via: http://rockford.blockshopper.com/sales/cities/machesney_park/2004/Jun?page=2..... http://www.trulia.com/homes/Illinoi...24-8239-Tetterhall-Ln-Machesney-Park-IL-61115
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snipped from 882/BBM

Thank you, Iberico. The 8239 Tetterhall Blockshopper link shows the Purchase Recording Date as 06/11/2004.
We have read in MSM that Todd and Katrina were married for 7 years.

Does anyone know when Katrina and Todd got married? Maybe LMStyle???
 
LMStyle said:
<snipped>

I did find it interesting that the investigators have 4 different theories on how the crime was committed, so they are charging him for all 4 and then will see which way it goes and then all but 1 of the 4 first degree murder charges will stick. I don't think I have ever heard of anything like this personally.
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Really? I missed this. Is it documented somewhere that they have 4 different theories?
 
FBEye said:
Regarding:

snipped from 882/BBM

Thank you, Iberico. The 8239 Tetterhall Blockshopper link shows the Purchase Recording Date as 06/11/2004.
We have read in MSM that Todd and Katrina were married for 7 years.

Does anyone know when Katrina and Todd got married? Maybe LMStyle???
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September 10th, 2005

TexasCharm said:
Really? I missed this. Is it documented somewhere that they have 4 different theories?
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Here at this link TexasCharm:

http://www.wifr.com/news/headlines/Breaking-Down-the-Charges-180905931.html

"As for the reason why there are 4 counts of murder, prosecutors have a count for each theory of their case, but in the end only one can stick. So, if he's convicted, he will only be convicted on one of those counts of murder and the others will fall by the wayside. He's back in court December 21st."
 
LMStyle said:
September 10th, 2005



Here at this link TexasCharm:

http://www.wifr.com/news/headlines/Breaking-Down-the-Charges-180905931.html

"As for the reason why there are 4 counts of murder, prosecutors have a count for each theory of their case, but in the end only one can stick. So, if he's convicted, he will only be convicted on one of those counts of murder and the others will fall by the wayside. He's back in court December 21st."
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Just so we're clear .. (I think) .. this does not mean that they have 4 theories like 1. He killed her with a golf club in the kitchen, 2. He killed her with a bat in the laundry room 3. etc.

The legal definitions of "theories" of first degree murder are more like:

1. willful, deliberate and premeditated murder
2. murder committed during the perpetration of an inherently dangerous felony
3. murder committed in the course of committing and attempting to commit aggravated sexual assault

etc.

It's not much different than offering 1st, 2nd, and manslaughter. Each might carry a different set of sentencing guidelines. A perp can only be convicted of ONE and it's up to the jury to agree which one ... if any.

I don't think it's that unusual.. imo.
 
TexasCharm said:
Just so we're clear .. (I think) .. this does not mean that they have 4 theories like 1. He killed her with a golf club in the kitchen, 2. He killed her with a bat in the laundry room 3. etc.

The legal definitions of "theories" of first degree murder are more like:

1. willful, deliberate and premeditated murder
2. murder committed during the perpetration of an inherently dangerous felony
3. murder committed in the course of committing and attempting to commit aggravated sexual assault

etc.

It's not much different than offering 1st, 2nd, and manslaughter. Each might carry a different set of sentencing guidelines. A perp can only be convicted of ONE and it's up to the jury to agree which one ... if any.

I don't think it's that unusual.. imo.
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While I would agree typically, if you look at the charges, they aren't like that 1st, 2nd, etc. They are just the same statute with 2 of them upgraded to Brutal and Heinous. So it's 2 first degree and 2 first degree Brutal and Heinous. So it appears there are 4 different theories at this point in time, we won't know more until we hear details and evidence though.
 
TexasCharm said:
Just so we're clear .. (I think) .. this does not mean that they have 4 theories like 1. He killed her with a golf club in the kitchen, 2. He killed her with a bat in the laundry room 3. etc.

The legal definitions of "theories" of first degree murder are more like:

1. willful, deliberate and premeditated murder
2. murder committed during the perpetration of an inherently dangerous felony
3. murder committed in the course of committing and attempting to commit aggravated sexual assault

etc.

It's not much different than offering 1st, 2nd, and manslaughter. Each might carry a different set of sentencing guidelines. A perp can only be convicted of ONE and it's up to the jury to agree which one ... if any.

I don't think it's that unusual.. imo.
Click to expand...

I agree, I think this is pretty standard. I have seen multiple charges like this against a defendant and then through the course of the trial, the jury decides specifically the extent of the crimes that were committed. It's fairly straightforward to prove that a murder occurred with physical evidence. But it's up to the jury to weigh the circumstantial evidence and get inside the killer's head, so to speak, and try to determine premeditation, degree of brutality, motive, etc, and that's where the additional charges may or may not be applied.
 
Having done jury duty on several occassions, I believe the DA's office throws several charges at the jury to be considered, and hope that something sticks. I had a case where there was 4 separate charges and one seemed ridiculous and outrageous. We threw that one out but considered the other three and came back with a verdict based on the evidence.
 
LMStyle said:
September 10th, 2005
Here at this link TexasCharm:
http://www.wifr.com/news/headlines/Breaking-Down-the-Charges-180905931.html
"As for the reason why there are 4 counts of murder, prosecutors have a count for each theory of their case, but in the end only one can stick. So, if he's convicted, he will only be convicted on one of those counts of murder and the others will fall by the wayside. He's back in court December 21st."
Click to expand...
BBM

Thank you for the 9-10-2005 KN/TS marriage date, LMStyle
 
LMStyle said:
I did find it interesting that the investigators have 4 different theories on how the crime was committed, so they are charging him for all 4 and then will see which way it goes and then all but 1 of the 4 first degree murder charges will stick. I don't think I have ever heard of anything like this personally.
Click to expand...

Jessica Ridgeway's killer was charged with 17 different counts, 11 relating to Jessica and the rest to a woman he tried to abduct earlier. You can read the charges against him here and it shows the differences between them.
 
Here are some intersting statistics on crimes to women..

Domestic violence in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1% of all women (age > 18) who participated in a UN national study in 1995&#8211;96, who may or may not have been married or partnered, were victims of domestic abuse within the previous 12-month period. Since this population included women who had never been married or partnered, the prevalence of domestic violence may have been greater.[22]

About 2.3 million people are raped or physically assaulted each year by a current or former intimate partner or spouse.[23]

3&#8211;4 million women are beaten each year by their husbands, male lovers, or ex-husbands.[24]

Physically assaulted women receive an average of 6.9 physical assaults by the same partner per year


Women are more likely than men to be murdered by an intimate partner. Of those killed by an intimate partner, about three quarters are female and about a quarter are male. In 1999 in the United States, 1,218 women and 424 men were killed by an intimate partner,[30] and 1,181 females and 329 males were killed by their intimate partners in 2005
 
I wonder if Todd Smith's arraignment and plea is Dec 14 or 21?

http://www.rrstar.com/blogs/jeffkol...y-of-Katrina-Smith-issues-community-thank-you
SNIPPED from above link " Smith is scheduled to appear in court for an arraignment on a bill of indictment Dec. 14"
or
http://www.rrstar.com/news/x1559139220/Todd-Smith-in-court-for-first-time-since-murder-charges
SNIPPED from above link "Smith will be back in court at 9 a.m. Dec. 21 for his formal arraignment and chance to enter a plea"


Winnebago County Inmate Inquiry verifies the Dec 14th date at
http://inmates.winnebagosheriff.com/
as "12/14/2012 11:00"
 
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