Deceased/Not Found IL - Yingying Zhang, 26, Urbana, 9 June 2017 #5 *Arrest*

[Millhouse]

Wikipedia page on the Disappearance of Yingying Zhang: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Yingying_Zhang

 

[Vail]

I wonder whether the Delphi suspect (Snap chat pic of man on Monon High Bridge/Delphi/Indiana, murder of 2 girls Abby and Libby) and BC (Champaign/Illinois, kidnapping of Yingying) could be the same man?

Not even a remote chance. These cases don't even share a single similarity.

 

[HoldySi]

I wonder whether the Delphi suspect (Snap chat pic of man on Monon High Bridge/Delphi/Indiana, murder of 2 girls Abby and Libby) and BC (Champaign/Illinois, kidnapping of Yingying) could be the same man? Of course, I see differences between the sketches but after all there are only sketches and each of them might be a little divergent interpretations of the original face. As far as the beard is concerned: there is a time span of ca. 4,5 months between the video originals (Delphi February, Champaign June) and the facial hair could have grown/changed. In comparison the physical stature of "bridge guy" (Delphi) and BC (Champaign, video of vigil march) don't seem to be very suitable, I would admit. But thinking of time span, clothing, inaccurate video still - maybe, it's possible to be the same man?

I would like to hear your opinion.

View attachment 120432

Sorry, but no.

 

[kittythehare]

China asks searchers to step up ahead of protracted trial for accused kidnapper
Fri, 07/21/2017 - 7:30am | Mary Schenk

"We are here to offer comfort and to witness the court hearing," Liu told The News-Gazette. "We wish Yingying could be found as soon as possible, and we wish the FBI, the Illinois State Police and the University of Illinois police to step up efforts in the search."

http://www.news-gazette.com/news/local/2017-07-21/china-asks-searchers-step-ahead-protracted-trial-accused-kidnapper.html

* Obviously, we know the family's priority is to recover YYZ. I post this only to wonder why one or more of these three agencies has not persuaded the family or the Chinese government (to take emotion out of the equation) that such a search would be fruitless or it is already taking place.​

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Lots of posts here today are asking the same question.
It makes no sense.
'believe her to be dead'
Is that the same as saying they know for a fact she is dead?
Or does it mean it is likely she is dead based on stats?

 

[LoremIpsum]

I wonder whether the Delphi suspect (Snap chat pic of man on Monon High Bridge/Delphi/Indiana, murder of 2 girls Abby and Libby) and BC (Champaign/Illinois, kidnapping of Yingying) could be the same man? Of course, I see differences between the sketches but after all there are only sketches and each of them might be a little divergent interpretations of the original face. As far as the beard is concerned: there is a time span of ca. 4,5 months between the video originals (Delphi February, Champaign June) and the facial hair could have grown/changed. In comparison the physical stature of "bridge guy" (Delphi) and BC (Champaign, video of vigil march) don't seem to be very suitable, I would admit. But thinking of time span, clothing, inaccurate video still - maybe, it's possible to be the same man?

I would like to hear your opinion.

View attachment 120432

I've never seen him without a full beard in the past two years for what it's worth.

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[Deleted member 102539]

I've never seen him without a full beard in the past two years for what it's worth.

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Very helpful, thank you!

 

[SteveP]

I do not really believe there was a second active perp involved in YingYing's kidnapping and eventual demise. I do think, and have for several weeks now, that there is definitely at least one, and possibly more than one person who immediately suspected him as soon as they heard of the crime, and has at least some peripheral, after-the-fact knowledge of what happened, and may be cooperating with LE, if for no other reason than to evade having charges filed against them. I don't really have strong feelings that anyone other than BC knows where he ultimately left her, but I also would not rule out that he told another person the means of her demise, if not the exact location of her remains. JMO

 

[Webthrush]

We’re going in circles a bit, but I’ll say again that if LE aren’t engaging the public for help in a search I think it must be that they know (at least in a general way) what BC did with her and it involves areas that are off-limits to the public or simply too dangerous for large-scale public assistance.
(It’s also possible he incinerated or dismembered the body and scattered the remains in multiple places, but I’m doubtful of that, as I think it more likely he panicked and did something relatively quick & easy -- having said that, it just occurs to me that a major research university like U of I probably has large-scale industrial incinerators on campus... could he possibly have access to one???)

 

[SteveP]

We’re going in circles a bit, but I’ll say again that if LE aren’t engaging the public for help in a search I think it must be that they know (at least in a general way) what BC did with her and it involves areas that are off-limits to the public or simply too dangerous for large-scale public assistance.
(It’s also possible he incinerated or dismembered the body and scattered the remains in multiple places, but I’m doubtful of that, as I think it more likely he panicked and did something relatively quick & easy -- having said that, it just occurs to me that a major research university like U of I probably has large-scale industrial incinerators on campus... could he possibly have access to one???)

I don't know anything about that particular campus, but I would be relatively sure that if there is one, and he had access to it, certainly there are cameras all over campus that could have basically tracked him. If that happened, surely LE is well aware of it. JMO

 

[AnemoneBrown]

We’re going in circles a bit, but I’ll say again that if LE aren’t engaging the public for help in a search I think it must be that they know (at least in a general way) what BC did with her and it involves areas that are off-limits to the public or simply too dangerous for large-scale public assistance.
(It’s also possible he incinerated or dismembered the body and scattered the remains in multiple places, but I’m doubtful of that, as I think it more likely he panicked and did something relatively quick & easy -- having said that, it just occurs to me that a major research university like U of I probably has large-scale industrial incinerators on campus... could he possibly have access to one???)

So, why do you think LE has failed to convince the family, Crime Stoppers, and the Chinese government of the information you just stated? Sure, you could say the family is in an irrational state of denial, but are you prepared to say that the local Crime Stoppers organization, which deals with missing persons cases regularly and in coordination with LE, is crazy too? Is the Chinese government also incapable of rational thought during this time? Because these other two bodies are clamoring for a real search. Why can't the police tell them what you just told us and call it a day? This is why we are going in circles because it doesn't make sense to have blind faith in LE and it doesn't make sense to say these other agencies are too emotional too.

 

[Millhouse]

So, why do you think LE has failed to convince the family, Crime Stoppers, and the Chinese government of the information you just stated? Sure, you could say the family is in an irrational state of denial, but are you prepared to say that the local Crime Stoppers organization, which deals with missing persons cases regularly and in coordination with LE, is crazy too? Is the Chinese government also incapable of rational thought during this time? Because these other two bodies are clamoring for a real search. Why can't the police tell them what you just told us and call it a day? This is why we are going in circles because it doesn't make sense to have blind faith in LE and it doesn't make sense to say these other agencies are too emotional too.

I personally think they can't share this information with the family due to a strategy on the part of LE- meaning, they feel sharing the information would jeopardize the case in some way. I say this based on the fact that the family seemed totally in the dark about all the progress that was made in the case leading up to the arrest of BC.

I feel so bad for the family if they are being left in the dark- I cannot imagine their heartbreak and frustration. But, I truly believe we have no reason to distrust the LE in this case. This is the FBI and they do not make statements like they "believe her to be dead" lightly. They either truly mean that, or, it is part of another strategy (meaning, totally hypothetically, if they think she's still out there with someone else involved, maybe this person would ease up and more likely to make a mistake of some sort).

All speculation, of course. In my opinion, FBI is being strategic in some way, whether they are withholding information that leads them to know she is dead or something else. It's hard to even guess what their strategy is when we know NOTHING other than this criminal complaint which was pretty bare bones. Their strategy with dealing with BC resulted in his arrest- let's hope whatever strategy they have in mind is working now.

 

[MadisonS]

When I enlarged that image it appears there are TWO people in the backseat. One directly behind BC sitting upright and a second person behind the passenger seat who is slumped over.

Edit. I realize the photo did not copy into my reply, but I'm referring to the photo that loremipsum posted on (I think) page 34.

 

[AnemoneBrown]

I personally think they can't share this information with the family due to a strategy on the part of LE- meaning, they feel sharing the information would jeopardize the case in some way. I say this based on the fact that the family seemed totally in the dark about all the progress that was made in the case leading up to the arrest of BC.

I feel so bad for the family if they are being left in the dark- I cannot imagine their heartbreak and frustration. But, I truly believe we have no reason to distrust the LE in this case. This is the FBI and they do not make statements like they "believe her to be dead" lightly. They either truly mean that, or, it is part of another strategy (meaning, totally hypothetically, if they think she's still out there with someone else involved, maybe this person would ease up and more likely to make a mistake of some sort).

All speculation, of course. In my opinion, FBI is being strategic in some way, whether they are withholding information that leads them to know she is dead or something else. It's hard to even guess what their strategy is when we know NOTHING other than this criminal complaint which was pretty bare bones. Their strategy with dealing with BC resulted in his arrest- let's hope whatever strategy they have in mind is working now.

I think the scenario you present is quite possible. The issue for me is that if the family is being kept in the dark for good reasons but LE is not able help them understand the reasons because they are too emotional, then Crime Stoppers and the Chinese government should be able to get it as would be the Chinese government. The problem? Both of these groups of people have joined the family in clamoring for a search and tips from the public.

 

[kittythehare]

I think the scenario you present is quite possible. The issue for me is that if the family is being kept in the dark for good reasons but LE is not able help them understand the reasons because they are too emotional, then Crime Stoppers and the Chinese government should be able to get it as would be the Chinese government. The problem? Both of these groups of people have joined the family in clamoring for a search and tips from the public.

SURELY surely surely they are bound to inform the family, even if not the gP of any and all findings immediately regarding the life or death of the victim.
I really cannot accept they did not if they have evidence of death.

 

[Webthrush]

SURELY surely surely they are bound to inform the family, even if not the gP of any and all findings immediately regarding the life or death of the victim.
I really cannot accept they did not if they have evidence of death.

NO! they are certainly NOT obliged to share anything with the family, other than what they choose, especially since anything divulged to family or Chinese Gov’t. is likely to leak to the public, and that is what they want to avoid happening. During the legal disclosure period the police will share everything with the attorneys involved, but the public may not learn of it ’til much later.
I think those of you from outside the country don’t fully understand the minute details of how the American legal system works (heck, most of us Americans don't understand it! , nor the many consequences that follow from the notion of ‘innocent ’til proven guilty’ and a ‘right to a fair and impartial jury’ — it’s much more complicated probably than most nations around the globe.

 

[LoremIpsum]

I think the scenario you present is quite possible. The issue for me is that if the family is being kept in the dark for good reasons but LE is not able help them understand the reasons because they are too emotional, then Crime Stoppers and the Chinese government should be able to get it as would be the Chinese government. The problem? Both of these groups of people have joined the family in clamoring for a search and tips from the public.

Crime Stoppers is a not-for-profit agency that works as a conduit between LE and a victim and/or their family. They would not be privy to any additional information regarding the case than the general public. And their involvement in this case is unique - because YZ's family is the financier of the reward, not Crime Stoppers. So, I believe that Crime Stoppers is continuing to work with YZ's family in order to guarantee their safety from being swindled (thats a lot of money) and integrity of the local anonymous tipster hotline because if they didn't, the family would look elsewhere, and there really isn't another safe alternative to Crime Stoppers. Basically, it'd be bad public relations to for them to say no.

Secondly, when the media has talked about "China" wanting answers and a search, it's not the full might of the Chinese government or anyone of authority in the country of China. It's a guy who works at the Chinese consulate in Chicago. So, he wouldn't be privy to anymore information than the general public either.

And thirdly, I do believe LE has left YZ's family in the dark. Unfortunate but it's the best way to prevent any leaks that could damage their ability to collect evidence and prosecute.



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[thekarmabus]

Crime Stoppers is a not-for-profit agency that works as a conduit between LE and a victim and/or their family. They would not be privy to any additional information regarding the case than the general public. And their involvement in this case is unique - because YZ's family is the financier of the reward, not Crime Stoppers. So, I believe that Crime Stoppers is continuing to work with YZ's family in order to guarantee their safety from being swindled (thats a lot of money) and integrity of the local anonymous tipster hotline because if they didn't, the family would look elsewhere, and there really isn't another safe alternative to Crime Stoppers. Basically, it'd be bad public relations to for them to say no.

Secondly, when the media has talked about "China" wanting answers and a search, it's not the full might of the Chinese government or anyone of authority in the country of China. It's a guy who works at the Chinese consulate in Chicago. So, he wouldn't be privy to anymore information than the general public either.

And thirdly, I do believe LE has left YZ's family in the dark. Unfortunate but it's the best way to prevent any leaks that could damage their ability to collect evidence and prosecute.



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Crime stoppers take the tips that are called in and then relay them to the LE. Each case has a number and they can pull up all tips called in from that case number.They would have more information regarding the case than the general public.


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[LoremIpsum]

Crime stoppers take the tips that are called in and then relay them to the LE. Each case has a number and they can pull up all tips called in from that case number.They would have more information regarding the case than the general public.


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Yes, they do work with LE when information is sought about a crime. LE would contact them and they are given basic information which they then publish to the community. They do not receive any additional information FROM LE than the general public. If they do have additional information, it would be via the tips that are called in.

Especially in a case of this magnitude, I highly doubt they have been told anything beyond what has been released to the public. I mean, it's possible, but LE has just be so tight lipped about this case...

http://champaigncountycrimestoppers.com/index.aspx

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[AnemoneBrown]

Crime stoppers take the tips that are called in and then relay them to the LE. Each case has a number and they can pull up all tips called in from that case number.They would have more information regarding the case than the general public.


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'


In addition, they deal with missing persons cases in their counties all the time. Surely, they know LE (especially their own) conducts investigations and prosecutors put together cases in careful ways.I would think they would also notice if a case is being mishandled more accurately than the average websleuther. Champaign Crime Stoppers has not criticized LE for their investigation of this case but they did agree to up the amount of reward money and organized and conducted a press conference to ask the public for help locating YYZ at a time when she was taken off the FBI's most wanted missing person's list.

 

[thekarmabus]

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In addition, they deal with missing persons cases in their counties all the time. Surely, they know LE (especially their own) conducts investigations and prosecutors put together cases in careful ways.I would think they would also notice if a case is being mishandled more accurately than the average websleuther. Champaign Crime Stoppers has not criticized LE for their investigation of this case but they did agree to up the amount of reward money and organized and conducted a press conference to ask the public for help locating YYZ at a time when she was taken off the FBI's most wanted missing person's list.

Exactly, they work closely with LE. I know homicide headquarters in my area has a dedicated liaison working within the dept from crimestoppers. They are a wonderful organization but they do know more than the general public on cases. I only know this because I am working with them personally on a case.


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