IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #170

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Who are defense_diaries and @SleuthieGoosie and why are they involved with helping on a SC case?
These are social media accounts that appear (in their feeds) to support the rights of Defense in this case, and have commentary on many other cases as well (true crime stuff).

defense_diaries is attny Bob Motta - a defense attny out of Ill, with a specialized family firm of Criminal Defense Attorneys. (Motta & his attny sister Ali are also podcasters, have seen Bob appear as expert commentator on Court TV). MOO

SleuthieGoosie is a podcaster that (apparently) knows how to FOIL and grab harder-to-find documents. also MOO

Wieneke x-twitter acct mentioned Motta (attny) was helpful to the submission in providing long background on the case.
 
BBM

Wouldn't an in-camera recording have audio as well?

The rule isn't specific to in-camera hearings or in-chambers meetings that I see. It does speak to all hearings though. Looks like JG is taking the position that this refers only to hearings in open court. It'll be interesting to see what the court decides.

jmo
 
Am I alone in wondering if it even exists?

Well we know from BR's praecipe that some record exists. What is less clear is whether they are seeking audio and transcription or only an initial recording (by court stenographer device (short hand)) that is later transcribed into an official transcript.

jmo
 
Pretty sure that the Odinist stuff appears w/in the previous writ motion's exhibits?
Her X-feed regularly supports her tweets w/ links to various articles for further reference. MOO
This part in red is beyond my payscale of understanding but it's in the 240 pg Record of Proceedings:
 
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*Chef's Kiss*
(2nd last paragraph in the 2nd brief to SCION)
mirrors the "Hoosier public interest" push in the 1st brief.
(Boom! yummy and moo)
For many Hoosiers this case marks the first time they have followed the workings of an Indiana court. Yet for all rulings going forward, the public will question the judge’s impartiality. To restore the public’s trust in the integrity of the judicial process in this high-profile case, a new special judge should be appointed.
 
Now if this new filing is accepted (by Leeman and Wieneke; 23S-OR-00311) the court will decide if BR and AB should be reinstated. This is different from the first filing that was accepted seeking a writ to compel JG to clean up the record (23S-OR-00302).

This filing asks for a writ of mandamus to:
1. Reinstate Attorneys Baldwin and Rozzi as court-appointed counsel
2. Set a trial date within 70 days from the issuance of the writ, and
3. To remove Judge Gull and appoint a new judge

 
Pretty sure that the Odinist stuff appears w/in the previous writ motion's exhibits?
Her X-feed regularly supports her tweets w/ links to various articles for further reference. MOO

Now that the second case has been filed there is no risk. I hadn't read the second case at that time. Now I see they filed a second case requesting attorneys be reinstated and Gull be removed.

jmo
 
Now that the second case has been filed there is no risk. I hadn't read the second case at that time. Now I see they filed a second case requesting attorneys be reinstated and Gull be removed.

jmo
enjoy the read. :)
 
Noting that Wieneke needed to leave the state of IN to provide much of the quoted case law.
Wow.

SCOIN just doesn't seem to have needed to rule on this issue.

Is it for lack of such situations?

Or is it just that removed defense attorneys don't bother fighting back and reaching for higher court review? Moo
 
This part in red is beyond my payscale of understanding but it's in the 240 pg Record of Proceedings:

I believe @Emma Peel is referring to the initial writ filed on 10/30. It makes reference to BR and AB's "MEMORANDUM IN SUPPORT OF THE ACCUSED’S MOTION FOR FRANKS HEARING" which discusses Odinism. This is not the same as her taking a position on it though, so the Tweet concerned me that her doing this could impact the case that was accepted. But now a new case has been filed seeking to have them reinstated. I suppose it could be considered reasonable, as part and parcel of this second writ, for them to make the point that the judge should not have taken it upon herself to remove them in part due to disagreeing with defense counsel's theory of the case.

jmo
 
Bits I found interesting/clarifying:
Brief








Motion for Transcript
They skipped over some stuff in regarding the leak.
Early October “F” tree photos from crime scene leaked. MS had seen but unable to verify validity, chose not to share.
10/5 - early morning hours MS received graphic crime scene photos from source M.
10/5- as soon as sun comes up MS informs LE and defense of leak.
MS some point thereafter receives Facebook messaging screenshots that show conversations between M, RF and MW. From investigating on they determine MW to be former employee of AB.
Also MS makes note that RF states he had been involved with collaborating with defense “at their invitation” for a length of time. Messages also indicated MW was still meeting with defense and shares in FB messages another POI and strategies considers by defense.
10/6 4:13pm -BR sends email to JG stating that they just became informed in the last hour ( does not coincide with MS timeline) that a leak of crime scene photos has occurred. That they were told by a staff member by an uninvolved 3rd party. That they are “not the source” of the leak. BR says he called to inform NMc and that they already knew for at least 24 hours. ( which coincides with MS timeline).
10/8 11:05 am JG sends email to AB, BR and NMc encouraging a thorough investigation occur and that leak be stopped and photos seized. She emphasizes how they should be only involving staff that are trustworthy. She points out previous breaches by defense.
10/9 MS has formal interview with LE and turns over all documentation including messages and screenshots implicating all parties all signs lead to defense leak.
10/10 ISP detective sent to get a statement from RF to determine a) gather photos and delete from his phone b) find out who he got them from and who he distributed to. RF refuses to answer questions, states he wants an attorney.
10/10 AFTER RF refuses to answer questions-AB informs NMc that that MW accessed crime scene photos from conference room some time in August and “leaked” to RF and then RF leaked to other individuals.
10/11 RF makes statement to his wife that he needs to “ come clean” about where he got the photos. 10:00pm RF commits suicide.
10/12 4:07am NMc informs JG,AB and BR of the suicide and briefs them of their interactions. This email also informs JG that leak originated with defense.
10/12 JG orders defense to cease work on case. I wonder why.
Now when you align these timelines it becomes very obvious which party was skirting the truth (ie:lying) and trying to CYA.

AB/BR were trying to distance from the leakers because they know it’s gross negligence.
But evidence may show that in actuality the leakers were not snookering but invited to the table and evidence shared against court order.

I am sure this investigation is still ongoing and time will tell just how gross the negligence was.

My heart hurts for the families of these two bright and beautiful girls. They endured enough already it’s absolutely heart breaking these girls were exploited in death.
 
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It should have never been off track.
If the ex-defense team had behaved professionally from the get-go, we wouldn’t be here.
OR ...
See the SCION writ motion #2 as to Relator RA and Defendant Gull.
The attorney-client relationship, once established, is inviolate, and should not be15severed or subject to “unwarranted interference.” Latta v. State, 743 N.E.2d 1121(Ind. 2001). The attorney-client relationship is afforded the same venerable protections whether the lawyer is a public defender, acting pro bono, or privately retained. Smith, 440 P.2d at 74; Lane v. State, 80 So. 3d 280, 297 (Ala. Crim. App.2010).Indiana recognizes only two narrowly circumscribed situations where a trialcourt may sever the attorney-client relationship against the client’s wishes: (1) thelawyer is not a member of the state bar, Wheat v. United States, 486 U.S. 153, 159(1988); or (2) the lawyer has an actual conflict of interest that will obstruct his ability to provide effective representation. See T.C.H., 714 N.E.2d 1162 (Ind. Ct.App. 1999).

Gull will get her hearing and due process, as to denying hearing(s) and due process to RA and RA's preferred counsel, delaying RA's trial by another year, and keeping him in prison (protected/solitary) for 2 years. JHMO
 
These are social media accounts that appear (in their feeds) to support the rights of Defense in this case, and have commentary on many other cases as well (true crime stuff).

defense_diaries is attny Bob Motta - a defense attny out of Ill, with a specialized family firm of Criminal Defense Attorneys. (Motta & his attny sister Ali are also podcasters, have seen Bob appear as expert commentator on Court TV). MOO

Clarification: Alison Motta is Bob Motta's wife, and they are both criminal defense attorneys in Chicago.

Background fact: Bob Motta's father, Robert Motta Sr, was one of John Wayne Gacy's two main defense lawyers. The reason Bob Jr started his podcast is because his father gave him (with co-counsel's permission) the many many audiotapes of interviews during defense preparation between Robert Sr. and Gacy --gave them to him many years after Gacy's death. After Bob listened to them, he decided to do a podcast to discuss them. In the process of doing so, he believes he found proof that a major piece of evidence linking Gacy to one of the victims (a photo developing receipt) that police had claimed they had found outside in the trash was actually found by them inside Gacy's open trash can in the house (he had invited the police in to chat informally) and taken without a warrant. They then used the falsely claimed discovery of the receipt in the outside trash to get the 2nd search warrant that led to them finally finding the bodies buried in the crawlspace.
 
They skipped over some stuff in regarding the leak.
Early October “F” tree photos from crime scene leaked. MS had seen but unable to verify validity, chose not to share.
10/5 - early morning hours MS received graphic crime scene photos from source M.
10/5- as soon as sun comes up MS informs LE and defense of leak.
MS some point thereafter receives Facebook messaging screenshots that show conversations between M, RF and MW. From investigating on they determine MW to be former employee of AB.
Also MS makes note that RF states he had been involved with collaborating with defense “at their invitation” for a length of time. Messages also indicated MW was still meeting with defense and shares in FB messages another POI and strategies considers by defense.
10/6 4:13pm -BR sends email to JG stating that they just became informed in the last hour ( does not coincide with MS timeline) that a leak of crime scene photos has occurred. That they were told my a staff member by an uninvolved 3rd party. That they are “not the source”. BR says he called to inform LE and that they already knew for at least 24 hours. ( which coincides with MS timeline).
10/8 11:05 am JG sends email to AB, BR and NMc encouraging a thorough investigation occur and that leak be stopped and photos seized. She emphasizes how they should be only involving staff that are trustworthy. She points out previous breaches by defense.
10/9 MS has formal interview with LE and turns over all documentation including messages and screenshots implicating all parties all signs lead to defense leak.
10/10 ISP detective sent to get a statement from RF to determine a) gather photos and delete from his phone b) find out who he got them from and who he distributed to. RF refuses to answer questions, states he wants an attorney.
10/10 afternoon AB informs NMc that that MW accessed crime scene photos from conference room some time in August and “leaked” to RF and then RF leaked to other individuals.
10/11 RF makes statement to his wife that he needs to “ come clean” about where he got the photos. 10:00pm RF commits suicide.
10/12 4:07am NMc informs JG,AB and BR of the suicide and briefs them of their interactions. This email also informs JG that leak originated with defense.
10/12 JG orders defense to cease work on defense. I wonder why.
Now when you align these timelines it becomes very obvious which party was skirting the truth (ie:lying) and trying to CYA.

AB/BR were trying to distance from the leakers because they know it’s gross negligence.
But evidence may show that in actuality the leakers were not snookering but invited to the table and evidence shared against court order.

I am sure this investigation is still ongoing and time will tell just how gross the negligence was.
From Exhibit K- During the week of October 2nd, the Defense became aware of a gentleman in Texas who had claimed that crime scene photos had been leaked and that Andy was the party who leaked the photos. Naturally, this called for some immediate disclosure.

I notice the former D does not commit to a firm date on when the former D became aware (just saying during the week of October 2nd). They sent the e-mail to JG "disclosing" on October 6...which appears to be after Rick Snay had posted on social media that he had photos of the crime scene. Doesn't exactly scream immediate disclosure to me...

JMO
 
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