Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #102

[Matic]

What’s the chance that the killer didn’t arrive/depart the murder scene by car? What if he walked from a nearby house or hotel. Is that feasible?

Or rode a moped. This guy looks like the moped riding type. Could have easily laid the moped down just inside any woods line or ditch off the road.

Maybe that's why all the heavy, layered clothing. Would be a bit chilly on a moped.

 

[MassGuy]

Or rode a moped. This guy looks like the moped riding type. Could have easily laid the moped down just inside any woods line or ditch off the road.

Maybe that's why all the heavy, layered clothing. Would be a bit chilly on a moped.

If he did that, I think we’d have witness accounts to that effect.

People don’t necessarily remember cars, but they’ll remember seeing a guy riding a moped.

I know I would.

 

[mtnlites]

If he did that, I think we’d have witness accounts to that effect.

People don’t necessarily remember cars, but they’ll remember seeing a guy riding a moped.

I know I would.

Around Delphi I'd definitely remember someone on a moped. I can't remember the last time I saw one, especially outside of downtown.

 

[~ Amy ~]

OK so I went back to the photo of him on the bridge and now I am starting to think his left hand isn't in his pocket. My eyes are probably playing tricks on me but I think I see his hand up next to his mouth. Those white things I have always wondered about at the top of his coat look like a hand with a glove on it. Almost as if he is holding a microphone ( which I know he isn't , I just did not know how else to explain what I am seeing ) Maybe hes signaling for them to be quiet ?? And it looks like a bag on his left side as well. Kinda like a sea bag .

 

[x_files]

I am surprised that I haven't heard/read from too many people how insignificant they feel the tone of "guys" is within the audio clip.

In my opinion, he sounds like he's trying to come off non-offensive and approachable. It doesn't indicate, IMO, any type of authority or familiarity or distance or anything, really.

It's the same way I'd approach a group of kids I knew or construction workers that were making too much noise or a barista at a coffee shop or a clerk at a store or my own children or a class I substitute taught in or anyone, anywhere really.

I guess my point is that I don't feel the tone or the word, "guys," itself is indicative of who this clown is or what he does or where he's from. I'm in a cranky mood from the lack of progress in this investigation; sorry.

I also recently finished The Killing Season docuseries and am so disheartened to know how many murderers lurk among us and how many people - women especially - are being murdered without justice. I'm mad in that this guy could be anywhere by now, killing who-knows-how-many more people. In this day and age, with a frickin video of the perp, how can it be this easy to get away with murdering two young girls in the middle of the frickin day?!

He may be trying to win there trust. I don't hear anger in his voice either.

 

[Matic]

If he did that, I think we’d have witness accounts to that effect.

People don’t necessarily remember cars, but they’ll remember seeing a guy riding a moped.

I know I would.

True, but that's a pretty rural area. Probably could have gone several miles before even seeing a car. And since now LE wants us to focus on a car, no ones thinking of any other form of transportation.

If he was on a moped after dark, 5 or so miles already away from the crime scene, you would barely even give a 2nd glance if you passed by him let alone be able to give any kind of description.

 

[MassGuy]

True, but that's a pretty rural area. Probably could have gone several miles before even seeing a car. And since now LE wants us to focus on a car, no ones thinking of any other form of transportation.

If he was on a moped after dark, 5 or so miles already away from the crime scene, you would barely even give a 2nd glance if you passed by him let alone be able to give any kind of description.

Yeah, but I think they are focused on this parking lot, and the vehicle parked in it, for a reason.

I don’t think they are guessing it’s connected, I think they know it is.

 

[Snoop Sister]

You could be right...I just don't know. I had thought that that conversation happened up on the bridge where several family members were. ??

What I read was that the searcher asked Libby’s sister what kind of shoes she was wearing. And then said he found them and the sister was not allowed to go down where the bodies were. I think Libby’s sister said this in an interview ...iirc. Link was posted in earlier threads.

 

[Cutiekitty]

For the techies:
If Libby left her phone on audio record in her pocket, how long
would it continue to record?
Is it possible LE has an audio of complete crime as it happened?

I think it’s going to depend on what she was using to make the recording. If it was a video using the phone’s camera I imagine it could go until the battery ran out or it just got too big for the phone. If it was Snapchat I don’t think it’ll do it as long and the videos are segmented. Not a techie though.

 

[Matic]

Yeah, but I think they are focused on this parking lot, and the vehicle parked in it, for a reason.

I don’t think they are guessing it’s connected, I think they know it is.

And they were all focused on OBG for over 2 years, as were we all.
Turned out to be absolutely nothing.

I'm just not holding out that this new "vehicle" info carries any weight.
Just kinda popped in out of nowhere after all this time.

 

[Jabarn]

Well one thing is for sure, once this guy is caught, the way that law enforcement has played this will all make more sense.

It’s pretty clear that he shares a bit of frustration that they are being criticized for certain moves, but he is powerless to explain himself right now.

It’s too important to the investigation.

For sure. Certain factors have to be held close to rule out false confessions (wonder if they have had any?) or to substantiate facts only the killer would know. It would simply hold up better in court.

We are two years past the early days when Douglas thinks the new information would’ve been most useful.

I know plenty of us asked for the full video of the suspect walking early on, thinking of the benefit the video provided in the Carlie Brucia abduction.

Maybe it would have made a difference early on for Abby and Libby, and maybe it wouldn’t have. But looking at the video now, I don’t see how it would’ve hurt.

All the same, there is a reason for the new turn we aren’t privy.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Imho a description of someone can vary from people for many reasons. Some will see them as older and some as younger. Other details stick out to different people. I may notice someone's eyes whereas you may pay more attention to their mouth and someone else may notice their hair. That is why people need to keep in mind this is a composite drawing of different peoples description not a for sure look alike.

I think the age of the witness plays a part too. Not because of bad eyes (well maybe). Think back to when you were 16 - didn’t a 20 year old look much older. If you are 30 or 40 a 20 year old probably looks really young. Does that make sense? I know when I look at a 20 year old they look like babies. Might be why I think the 2nd sketch looks really young like high school aged.

 

[MassGuy]

And they were all focused on OBG for over 2 years, as were we all.
Turned out to be absolutely nothing.

I'm just not holding out that this new "vehicle" info carries any weight.
Just kinda popped in out of nowhere after all this time.

It coincides with this newly released sketch, and I don’t think it’s a stretch to believe that they are linked.

If it was simply mention of the car alone, I’d share your skepticism.

Together though, I think they’re on to something real.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Starting to think maybe the FBI should takeover as far as any press or speaking to the public.

I also can’t believe that after listening to the latest PC, people think they know who BG is.

The April 22 PC?

 

[sunshineray]

If he did that, I think we’d have witness accounts to that effect.

People don’t necessarily remember cars, but they’ll remember seeing a guy riding a moped.

I know I would.

Do you know, is it very rural in all directions? I know the highway is right there but doesn't look like any highway in my neck of the woods, very lonely looking. Could he have left the scene, even walking, cutting across fields or through woods to get home, returning later with someone who wanted to help search, picking up "the car" and leaving the one he just arrived in? Just wondering how rural it is? Most people would be at work and not home from 3-5:30 pm or commuting back home.

 

[Cutiekitty]

Been trying to brainstorm reasons why OGBG sketch is no longer as relevant and why NewBG sketch is the one to look at now.

What if a witness who was never in the park that day saw NewBG at his vehicle in the old CPS parking lot that day? They stopped and spoke to him for whatever reason and then went on their merry way. They gave this info to LE early on and provided details for the sketch, but because they couldn't actually place that guy on the bridge or in the park, and his description didn't fit what other people who were IN the park that day saw, LE put that info on the back burner and didn't follow up. Now,for whatever reason, they realize that the guy really was the "real" BG, but it's been so long that the original witness can't remember anything else about the vehicle?

I really do think that human error is responsible for the new/old sketch, but I'm having trouble deciding on what I think that error may be.

I like it. When they talked to this witness they probably asked for a description of the car so they probably got the best info they were going to get right then.

 

[MizStery]

perhaps he was interviewed early on. He claimed to investigators to have initially joined the search on the 13th after the families plea for help was announced on social media.
<snip>Perhaps his alibi is shaky during the window of opportunity?

Thanks to Massguy,bodester414,tmar and MistyWaters for reading and answering my question back in post 596.. You have really helped. I’m back to staying up all night trying to get my head around what could have happened.

That's kind of what I've thought since they released the info about the car parked at the abandoned building. What if it was someone who helped with the search, but wasn't called until after 5pm and someone saw their car parked at the building way before they should have been anywhere near the trail.

Yes, the time period, being there well before the search needs explaining.
"If you came to assist in the search, why was your car parked nearby, from 12 MD?"
MOO.

A clarification was issued, the car was apparently parked there from noon to 5pm on Feb 13th, the day of the murders. Not on the 14th although Carter initially stated this during the PC.

 

[Cutiekitty]

How Much Video Can You Record on an iPhone?

It's complicated but appears to depend on the amount of storage available.

And battery life.

 

[sunshineray]

Been trying to brainstorm reasons why OGBG sketch is no longer as relevant and why NewBG sketch is the one to look at now.

What if a witness who was never in the park that day saw NewBG at his vehicle in the old CPS parking lot that day? They stopped and spoke to him for whatever reason and then went on their merry way. They gave this info to LE early on and provided details for the sketch, but because they couldn't actually place that guy on the bridge or in the park, and his description didn't fit what other people who were IN the park that day saw, LE put that info on the back burner and didn't follow up. Now,for whatever reason, they realize that the guy really was the "real" BG, but it's been so long that the original witness can't remember anything else about the vehicle?

I really do think that human error is responsible for the new/old sketch, but I'm having trouble deciding on what I think that error may be.

I know this quote can encompass many things but I feel it has a lot to do with that original sketch that was just released.

"I really believe that over time we're gonna have an idea that we were onto to something early on."

ISP superintendent provides update on Delphi double murder investigation

 

[Charlot123]

It would, for sure. But why would you park in a highly visible location if you planned to commit a violent crime? Not only could your vehicle be seen (and maybe recognized), but you, yourself, could also be seen getting out of and into the vehicle, even if you're wet, muddy, and blood-covered.

It makes me question two things:
1) Is the vehicle even related to this crime?
2) If it was BG's vehicle, had he planned to commit a crime?

The vehicle may not be related to the crime. Nor could the owner/s be related to BG. But if I had the car parked somewhere close to the place of a crime, this would turn me into a potential witness. I would definitely call, and not anonymously, and ask if the fact of my car being there was pertinent, and if there was any way I could help, or if there were any questions the LE wanted to ask me.

The fact that they are trying to find out who drove the car, what car it was, means only one thing - that the owners have not come forward. And if they are not involved, why not ask this simple question, since our vehicle was parked nearby, can we help, in any way?

(I admit, that might have been the situation when the vehicle was parked there because someone was visiting the person whose name he/she does not want to disclose. However, this is why anonymous line exists).

As to the second question, let us assume the person accidentally murders one teenager. But two? And even two... even if accidental, still a crime, no?