Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #102

[ilovechili]

I read somewhere that the police withheld the COD and MOD to deny the killer satisfaction of hearing about it in media.
Really glad they did that.

Getting rid of a false description is huge.

Somehow, I reallu think they will this solved now.

I am still pages behind so this may fall in the midst of whatever the topic is currently.

I just want to say on catching up and seeing this post that I can see doing this for that reason. I can see doing it for investigative reasons as well, but also to deny him the notoriety of his detailed brutality, or shocking COD would be against what certain types of killers would want.

It is one reason I wish the media etc. would not adopt names like BTK because he, for instance, loved that name and notoriety. He so badly in that case wanted the notoriety and attention and to play he was smarter than LE that he contacted media to taunt. He may have used that name but once he was put away I sure do not have to refer to him that way any longer nor does media. I have my own name for him...

I am not saying we have that type of personality here with this child murderer as we do not know enough to be sure, but it is quite possible we do and he wanted the "shock" value and to "hear" about it and be "famous" in his "sick" way.

And LE is denying him that. I am all for that.

jmo.

 

[MsBetsy]

If the girls truly were captured on audio as saying something about some guy behind them, than in my mind that wipes out all theories that he was friend, family, or otherwise known to them. JMO

Yes, to me it it's pretty clear that they did not recognize him. Even if he was wearing layers or a hat, if they were aware of him while he was following them, I think they would have known who he was. Imo

 

[sunshineray]

Yes, but how did he find out they'd be there in the first place?

In my mind, that opens up a lot of locals considering how SM just pinpoints people now but there's also many others, person to person, even grapevine ways. Especially for someone as Wells has described, that he thinks was planning and waiting for his chance and LE has said is a local that likes to be in control. JMO

 

[cody22]

I have enough suspects on this case to nearly field a small Junior College football team with one Cheerleader....LOL !....moo

 

[sunshineray]

It's probably been said before but does anyone know if the girl's social media was set for public viewing? TIA

 

[ab01]

I have enough suspects on this case to nearly field a small Junior College football team with one Cheerleader....LOL !....moo

thinking hmmmm Does Delphi have a local junior college football team? and do they have a roster online?

incoming ...bahahaha

 

[Rocky1]

In my mind, that opens up a lot of locals considering how SM just pinpoints people now but there's also many others, person to person, even grapevine ways. Especially for someone as Wells has described, that he thinks was planning and waiting for his chance and LE has said is a local that likes to be in control. JMO

True, but the girls didn't even know they were going until a half hour or less before they left.

 

[TL4S]

Sorry for the unprofessional mapping here, but am I correct with where BG was likely parked and walked from the DCS lot, and where the girls were dropped off?

BG had a lot of ground to cover to catch up with and then follow the girls. Unless he was already on the trail when they got there, of course. But look how far he had to go back to get to his car again, even if he didn't follow the trail.

Note: I've only drawn lines to the point where they met at the end of the bridge. I know the bodies were found between there and the cemetery on the other side of the creek.

 

[HockeyMom330]

Yes, to me it it's pretty clear that they did not recognize him. Even if he was wearing layers or a hat, if they were aware of him while he was following them, I think they would have known who he was. Imo

I lean towards this being random and opportunistic, and I agree with you that the girls did not recognize him, but I'm willing to consider the possibility that BG recognized one or both of the girls (aka Jayme Closs style). He may have encountered them through his ties to Delphi...maybe he watched them play softball, or saw them at a community function, church event, or school. The girls may never noticed him watching.

 

[nearsouth]

I have enough suspects on this case to nearly field a small Junior College football team with one Cheerleader....LOL !....moo

Indeed... I've tried to stay away from going down a lot of SM rabbit holes, but I keep doing it for some reason. I wonder if our female is the same (very outside chance to me though)?

One real kicker for me is still the hair color being reddish/brown. I wonder if that is 100% or not...

 

[cody22]

thinking hmmmm Does Delphi have a local junior college football team? and do they have a roster online?

incoming ...bahahaha

Oh sure, that is just what I need, more possible suspects, in the Delphi, Indiana area.....moo

 

[sunshineray]

The way I understand it, and I may be wrong, is, they told the Grandmother they wanted to go, she said ask your Dad to make sure they had a ride home and then her sister gave them a ride there.
Libby didn't wait to ask her dad til they were on their way there, which makes me think that they left very soon after deciding to go?
It was about a ten minute ride, if I am not mistaken. Not much time for the perp to get there, if by some chance he knew they were going. JMO.

Maybe Libby's sister posted SM about it, taking them there? It amazes me how open with everything, every little detail kids put onto social media and there's so many platforms to do so.

 

[pepper 34]

The temperature of the water in the river had to extremely cold in Feb, close to freezing. That’s what I can’t make sense of, why a murderer would intentionally choose to cross an ice cold river not just once but twice. Had he taken them the other direction, it was equally treed with no houses in sight, no rivers to cross. Unless he brought along a change of clothing, a man walking drenched up the waste back across the bridge, though the trails would most certainly attract attention.

The footprints in my theory are behind the CS... going up the hill towards the cemetery and then away and out of the park.

So, he wouldn't have to cross the creek again. I share your confusion about his choosing the CS itself for a place to carry out his plan. He had a personal reason for choosing that spot in the woods, or... the girls broke free and tried to escape him by going across the creek and he followed, imo. But, I don't believe in the sand bar area the water would have been waist deep on BG. I thought comments 3 or 4 threads ago were discussing "inches deep." East and west of the sandbar... the water was deeper but naturally, he'd cross at the shallowest point (and the sandbar lines up the CS, too.)

 

[ab01]

Maybe Libby's sister posted SM about it, taking them there? It amazes me how open with everything, every little detail kids put onto social media and there's so many platforms to do so.

I believe if said post infact existed it would have been seen by many individuals and it would have been public knowledge that it existed very early on in this case.

We have heard of no such post to this point and it leads me to strongly believe no such post ever existed

JMO

 

[BigTexas]

I have a message for the killer.
You can run on for a long time...
Run on for a long time
Run on for a long time
Sooner or later God'll cut you down
Sooner or later God'll cut you down
Well, you may throw your rock and hide your hand
Workin' in the dark against your fellow man
But as sure as God made black and white
What's done in the dark will be brought to the light
You can run on for a long time
Run on for a long time
Run on for a long time
Sooner or later God'll cut you down
Sooner or later God'll cut you down

 

[tresir2012]

Nice post Wells.

Snipped:
He found out where she was going to be that day, he had been planning something like this for a while, he hightailed it to the CPS parking lot, made his way to the trail and waited. I think initially someone saw his vehicle but it was common enough that it wasn't paid much attention to.

My question is this...
If the girls didn't know that they were going to the bridge until a half hour or so before they went, then how did the perp know they'd be there?

Was it random? Did he know them? Did the girls, or one of them know him? Would it have been clear on the audio if they were unknown to each other? If random, how did he know they would be there? Now with the knowledge he works/worked or lives/lived in the area do we still think he is unknown to them and the community? Why does no-one seem to recognise him?

 

[MistyWaters]

It’s my understanding only specific people can view your snap story. Even if it’s set to public said viewer would have to have had Libby in their friends list

LE has this information without a doubt

From what others have said here it certainly does appear a registered SC user must add other registered users who are able to view photos shared by SC - it wouldn’t have been viewable publicly.

But as with all apps, only a user name and p/w is required so anyone having access to that information is able to sign on whether or not they’re the person who set up the app. Because I wonder how careful teenagers are about secure and hard-to-guess passwords and how common is it for them to share access to apps?

I also have no doubt LE has or is dwelling deeply into a possible internet connection which may’ve proved extremely complex. It was reported Libby was also a user of FB. I’m curious by what means did she ask her dad for a ride home? Phonecall, text, FB messaging? Or did she mention their plans to FB friends in advance of sending the SC photo? An imaginary scenario - “Abby and I are going to take photos at the bridge this afternoon”. A friend replies “oh send me some pics!”

My point - was there a reason Libby shared the pic via SC as soon (or almost as soon) as it was taken that day? Rather than intending to later post it on FB or Instagram?

In the days of home computers I think it must’ve been easier to track down stalkers to a specific physical address by setting up surveillance of all people entering and exiting the residence. However now with public wifi and mobile devices, particularly burner cellphones, it’s far more difficult to determine who’s actually at the other end of an internet connection.

 

[HockeyMom330]

Oh sure, that is just what I need, more possible suspects, in the Delphi, Indiana area.....moo

I think you can eliminate the dead male from your 'roster' as Carter was very confident that BG was 'close by' and paying attention to the April 22nd presser. He is also very adament that this case will eventually go to trial (not just be solved). Dead suspects don't get arrested and go before a judge/jury. JMO

 

[tresir2012]

My thinking is more along the lines of the one witness, probably older, male etc having seen a person, perhaps OBG and another witness, perhaps young, or in other ways an unreliable sort having seen something else entirely.

And that they then discounted the actual and accurate and important testimony.

For example, if it’s true as I’ve read, that there are sometimes drug users under that bridge and one of them - perhaps high at the time, actually saw the victims being frogmarched down the hill and said what s/he saw - that could have been dismissed.

In this theory there are two men, OBG and NBG, but because OBG was seen by an upstanding citizen and NBG by a marginalised member of society, the investigation pivoted. In the wrong direction.

Very good theory.

 

[sunshineray]

The footprints in my theory are behind the CS... going up the hill towards the cemetery and then away and out of the park.

So, he wouldn't have to cross the creek again. I share your confusion about his choosing the CS itself for a place to carry out his plan. He had a personal reason for choosing that spot in the woods, or... the girls broke free and tried to escape him by going across the creek and he followed, imo. But, I don't believe in the sand bar area the water would have been waist deep on BG. I thought comments 3 or 4 threads ago were discussing "inches deep." East and west of the sandbar... the water was deeper but naturally, he'd cross at the shallowest point (and the sandbar lines up the CS, too.)

It makes sense to me that BG would order them in the direction of the creek, "Down the hill" Gets them off the trail and from what posters have said into an area that not very noticeable from the bridge itself. He might have had cleaning up in mind and maybe was planning on putting their bodies in the creek also but got spooked by something and fled.