Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #136

[bradfordsleuth]

Does anyone one know off hand if the discussed time of the crime being "all over by 3:30" was before or after the PC introducing the new "early sketch" and request for information on a vehicle parked in the CPS lot?

The most recent reference I can find is in this article from Feb 17, 2021. Q&A session with Tobe Leazenby. I included a snippet below as well as a question related to killed where found since we've talked about that recently.

That being said, it doesn't answer when 3:30 was first mentioned (at what press conference). Still searching on that.

County Sheriff answers double homicide questions from readers | Carroll County Comet


Q. It has been stated in a press conference that “it was all over by 3:30 on Feb 13.” This statement was based on what information?

A. Evidence. I do not recall a specific time though but rather a time line.

Q. Has it been determined the girls were killed where they were found?

A. Based on information known, yes.

In the Derrik's Path video by GH from December 2017, (starting at around the 25:50 mark) it is mentioned that Derrick reached the path that leads to the creek at around 3:30 P.M.

I suspect that there is a possiblity that Libby's phone captured audio of him calling their names, and perhaps just prior to that, the audio may have indicated that the girls were no longer alive.

JMO

 

[StarryStarryNight]

This is what I think is going on. They are just trying to make sure nothing causes issues for the current case he's charged with. I don't think it means anything about his (or anyone else's) involvement in the Delphi case.

Still, LE has said pretty much nothing about this case, so by their deciding not to talk about it has very little effect on his current charge. More crazy.

 

[minazoe]

umm..it is in everyone's best interest that Mr. Chadwell is cleared of any involvement in the Delphi case ASAP.

lifting suspicion cancels out any claim he may make regarding his notoriety...the simple fact is,

they cannot clear him. mOO

 

[Yemelyan]

This is what I think is going on. They are just trying to make sure nothing causes issues for the current case he's charged with. I don't think it means anything about his (or anyone else's) involvement in the Delphi case.

I agree. It sounds like going back to the beginning they had a policy that they weren't going to confirm that anybody was on a shortlist of people being looked at, and they weren't going to publicly rule anyone completely out.

Then they found that they had to slightly deviate from this official policy here and there - sometimes to avoid a local family being attacked unnecessarily, sometimes to get the media to leave LE alone ("he's just not someone we are real interested in at this time").

Finally, what LE feared would happen has come to pass - JBC using the media interest in him to possibly get his trial moved. They don't want to see a precedent set that every time a criminal gets linked to the Delphi murders by internet sleuths and the media the trial has a chance of moving out of district. It's not just about JBC in my opinion.

However, they were really in a catch-22 because if they don't at least confirm they are looking into an individual, the tips on that person and criticism that they haven't looked hard enough would never stop.

So I guess a full blackout on any information about ANY person of interest or suspect is the way they felt they had to go to preserve the integrity of this case and other pending ones.

 

[minazoe]

adding...they never blacked out before..why would they do it now when the case is supposedly cold as holy hell? so now what is this declaration of silence?

this case has gone underground because JBC is a serial killer and all of the info is extremely sensitive and so is everything they talk about...mark my words..they have no good reason other than blocking out any further strategizing by JBC's defense.

they are playing games right now and everything is in a holding pattern.

Why don't they ask for tips? do a press conference? release something?

there are more cases..beyond A&L...trust me!

they have a right to question him I wonder if they can ? Can his court appointed attorney, defend him from questioning in another case? or does he have to get a separate lawyer? anyone know?

He's going down..I'll bet the Farm! mOO

 

[buggiegirl]

It just seems strange to me to choose now to basically say "leave us alone". The case has had tons of interest for years and I'm sure they were getting a lot more phone calls about Chadwell after he was captured. And they probably got a ton of phone calls about Nations or any other POIs in the past, but never came out and said something like this. Factored in with what GH said a few days ago, I will remain hopeful.

I thought initially that this was just about JBC's change of venue thing, but the thing that gives me pause is that people in general are relatively dumb and hearing "media black out" and "not answering questions" will make a lot of people think the tip line is no longer a thing. And the last thing the police seemingly want is someone suspecting Uncle Whoever and assuming the tip line's a thing of the past and never calling it in.

 

[buggiegirl]

umm..it is in everyone's best interest that Mr. Chadwell is cleared of any involvement in the Delphi case ASAP.

lifting suspicion cancels out any claim he may make regarding his notoriety...the simple fact is,

they cannot clear him. mOO

Unless they have irrefutable proof it is NOT him, they aren't going to clear anyone. And they have never acted like the evidence they do have is enough to rule people out.

 

[PawneeDew]

Quoted bbm to touch on a couple of your points.

'New' Delphi suspect sketch was drawn days after murders of 2 Indiana girls, artist says

I have been re-reading old articles, and this one about the new sketch and the wording below has my mind buzzing. I realize it is not a direct quote from any of the LE officals on this case, but the info has my attention anyhow.

"But on Monday, officials said the new image came about after some bit of new information that had been "continuously reviewed and examined." Authorities said the image "more accurately" depicted the face of the suspect from video recorded on German's cell phone while she and Abigail were on the High Bridge."

If there was 'new information that had been continuously reviewed and examined', then my mind is thinking that Investigators circled back to some video or maybe still photographs that perhaps had previously been either overlooked as insignificant, or only received in early 2019.

If this 'new information' ended up corroberating the resemblance and information for the second sketch provided by the witness, then it could have been the game-changer for their new investigative strategy.

LE then decided to forge ahead and present the public with the second sketch after keeping it on the back burner once they recognized that there was much more credibility with this suspect/sketch then they had previously given thought to.

All JMO and speculation


JMO

This has peaked my attention as well...I wonder if one of the witnesses who contributed to the sketch could have been the suspect?

 

[PawneeDew]

He's going down..I'll bet the Farm! mOO

Oh, God I Hope so.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

adding...they never blacked out before..why would they do it now when the case is supposedly cold as holy hell? so now what is this declaration of silence?

this case has gone underground because JBC is a serial killer and all of the info is extremely sensitive and so is everything they talk about...mark my words..they have no good reason other than blocking out any further strategizing by JBC's defense.

they are playing games right now and everything is in a holding pattern.

Why don't they ask for tips? do a press conference? release something?

there are more cases..beyond A&L...trust me!

they have a right to question him I wonder if they can ? Can his court appointed attorney, defend him from questioning in another case? or does he have to get a separate lawyer? anyone know?

He's going down..I'll bet the Farm! mOO

He certainly is! I’ll throw in a couple of sheds and a barn full of tools too. This bad deranged dude must be put away. He’s possibly responsible for many deaths we have discussed in this very forum. imo…

 

[Finlay]

Going out of their way to say that they won't be answering questions when they already really haven't been answering questions just almost feels to me that they expect something(s) to happen which may stem many more questions. Perhaps that event is just JBC's trial, but perhaps something else. Would there be specific steps in their investigation into JBC for A&L's murders (or perhaps even another murder somewhere else - possibly nearby) which the public might become aware of that could spur even more curiosity than we already have? (Like filing for warrants or re-questioning family or witnesses in a certain area.)

 

[jg580]

Still, LE has said pretty much nothing about this case, so by their deciding not to talk about it has very little effect on his current charge. More crazy.

True- maybe its like what someone mentioned upthread that they are being inundated with requests to get info on JBC? I feel like had they been even a bit more open (or at least not so darn cryptic) it might actually stop a lot of the craziness/rumors.

 

[jg580]

This has peaked my attention as well...I wonder if one of the witnesses who contributed to the sketch could have been the suspect?

I've wondered this as well. If this is the case, it would make some of the statements made at the 2019 pc make a bit more sense (i.e. they had talked to this person already, you want to know what we know comment, change in direction, etc.). The PC made it seem like they thought the suspect already inserted himself into the investigation somehow.

 

[Yemelyan]

I thought initially that this was just about JBC's change of venue thing, but the thing that gives me pause is that people in general are relatively dumb and hearing "media black out" and "not answering questions" will make a lot of people think the tip line is no longer a thing. And the last thing the police seemingly want is someone suspecting Uncle Whoever and assuming the tip line's a thing of the past and never calling it in.

I agree that they don't want people to assume the tip line's a thing of the past. They also don't want the media to grab hold of the "flavor of the week" suspect (who may not really be one to LE) because each time this happens - it happened with Nations and with Eldredge - a number of people start to tune out and think/hope the case is solved.

I have relatives in a neighboring state to IN and back when the JBC thing was taking off more than one said "did you hear they caught the guy who did the Delphi murders?"

So the last thing LE want is someone who really might have incriminating info but who is on the fence about calling it in to be like "no...sounds like I don't have to put myself out there since they've got this other great suspect who probably did it." MOO.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Maybe it's in regard to the interesting information Gray Hughes claims to have. I wonder if the info came from that guy he had on as a guest a few weeks ago.

 

[PawneeDew]

The PC made it seem like they thought the suspect already inserted himself into the investigation somehow.

Isn't there a fairly high incidence rate in these cases of the perp doing exactly that, tho? Based on my experience there is. I wonder how high the statistics actually are?

 

[minazoe]

YAHOO GRAMMA...Welcome back!

 

[curvilinear]

Quoted bbm to touch on a couple of your points.

I have been re-reading old articles, and this one about the new sketch and the wording below has my mind buzzing. I realize it is not a direct quote from any of the LE officals on this case, but the info has my attention anyhow.

"But on Monday, officials said the new image came about after some bit of new information that had been "continuously reviewed and examined." Authorities said the image "more accurately" depicted the face of the suspect from video recorded on German's cell phone while she and Abigail were on the High Bridge."

If there was 'new information that had been continuously reviewed and examined', then my mind is thinking that Investigators circled back to some video or maybe still photographs that perhaps had previously been either overlooked as insignificant, or only received in early 2019.

If this 'new information' ended up corroberating the resemblance and information for the second sketch provided by the witness, then it could have been the game-changer for their new investigative strategy.

I've been thinking a lot about the transcript you posted of Holeman’s interview on page 47 in this thread (thank you for that, BTW!), and, particularly, this little bit of it: ”'Cuz it was February so there was still people on vacation or winter "snowbirds" they call them, and so there were still some houses that we didn't make contact right away, so... But we have now, I mean we continue to do that and now six months later we're still getting new tips on people, so we're following up on those.”

If Holeman is implying or saying that making contact with a snowbird, who ostensibly was nowhere near Delphi before, during, or for weeks/months after the murders, resulted in new information or tips, then that’s quite interesting, IMO. A scenario that immediately came to my mind was that BG possibly made use of an empty snowbird’s property, either squatting on the property (a barn or a shed?), parking there, or quickly escaping across the property, and was perhaps briefly caught on an exterior camera. (Could explain the escape route?) The snowbird returns home after several weeks or months down south, links the trespasser footage with the murders, calls in the tip and possibly provides a screenshot or couple-second footage. It takes LE time to review the tip and perhaps originally dismiss it, but then “continuously reviewed and examined” that “some bit of new information.” Boom, the old but unused sketch from 2017 is released in 2019.

I just think it's awfully interesting that Holeman specifically referred to snowbirds and, in a roundabout way, empty houses, when talking about having new tips after six months. I mean, it could also be someone came home after a few months of unplugging from Delphi/Lafayette life and thought they recognized the sketch, so. Who knows.

And, of course, this is an interesting development today about the blackout. Hopefully it means LE is inching toward a close, or have closed it but can't jeopardize the Lafayette trial if JBC did it.

(Long, long, long-time reader on WS; first post. I live a couple hours from Delphi and drove HHH around Delphi many times on the way to Purdue games back in the day but would in no way say that I’m familiar with the town. I’ve followed this awful case for years and have read a lot of threads and information, but please forgive and ignore if the snowbird/empty property scenario has been discussed and dismissed before.)

Just my opinions and speculation only.

 

[Rural_PC]

I've been thinking a lot about the transcript you posted of Holeman’s interview on page 47 in this thread (thank you for that, BTW!), and, particularly, this little bit of it: ”'Cuz it was February so there was still people on vacation or winter "snowbirds" they call them, and so there were still some houses that we didn't make contact right away, so... But we have now, I mean we continue to do that and now six months later we're still getting new tips on people, so we're following up on those.”

If Holeman is implying or saying that making contact with a snowbird, who ostensibly was nowhere near Delphi before, during, or for weeks/months after the murders, resulted in new information or tips, then that’s quite interesting, IMO. A scenario that immediately came to my mind was that BG possibly made use of an empty snowbird’s property, either squatting on the property (a barn or a shed?), parking there, or quickly escaping across the property, and was perhaps briefly caught on an exterior camera. (Could explain the escape route?) The snowbird returns home after several weeks or months down south, links the trespasser footage with the murders, calls in the tip and possibly provides a screenshot or couple-second footage. It takes LE time to review the tip and perhaps originally dismiss it, but then “continuously reviewed and examined” that “some bit of new information.” Boom, the old but unused sketch from 2017 is released in 2019.

I just think it's awfully interesting that Holeman specifically referred to snowbirds and, in a roundabout way, empty houses, when talking about having new tips after six months. I mean, it could also be someone came home after a few months of unplugging from Delphi/Lafayette life and thought they recognized the sketch, so. Who knows.

And, of course, this is an interesting development today about the blackout. Hopefully it means LE is inching toward a close, or have closed it but can't jeopardize the Lafayette trial if JBC did it.

(Long, long, long-time reader on WS; first post. I live a couple hours from Delphi and drove HHH around Delphi many times on the way to Purdue games back in the day but would in no way say that I’m familiar with the town. I’ve followed this awful case for years and have read a lot of threads and information, but please forgive and ignore if the snowbird/empty property scenario has been discussed and dismissed before.)

Just my opinions and speculation only.

Welcome. Great post.

 

[OverTheRhine]

Still, LE has said pretty much nothing about this case, so by their deciding not to talk about it has very little effect on his current charge. More crazy.

Yeah, LE hasnt said anything relating Chadwell to Delphi outside of "he's on our radar and were looking into him". Just continuing to not say anything seems like it would be more effective than coming out and saying they won't be discussing anything else. It just seems preemptive to me. Like J&C and other media outlets got wind of something and LE is getting ahead of the curve and letting them know ahead of time not to contact them about it. Look here, Facebook, and reddit. Now were all talking about it making a bigger deal about it than if theyd just said nothing. Basically the Streisand effect.