Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #138

[Ozoner]

Maybe he thought the only chance of getting any kind of break on sentencing would be to admit his guilt.

I don't see him getting much of a break, but we'll see. A sentence of less than 30 years would surprise me.

 

[FromGermany1]

I’d really like to know who that specific person is in your opinion. I’ve been following since 2019 and think I know all the names mentioned in all the various places where people discuss this case online. I’ve had several POIs, from miscreants to local leaders and educators to friendly sportsmen. I have a couple people I think have been very wrongly named. But I don’t have one answer right in front of me staring me in the face. Sure wish I did. Sure hope the detectives do too.

Perhaps it makes sense to think about, which name never came up (except in verrry rare and verrry brief comments on YT) and why it might be like that. "Hiding in plain sight" , indirectly. - I may be wrong, you know.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Some posts have been removed.

Please don't be making public insinuations or accusations against random people just because they appear in a video paying tribute to the girls.

Members can discuss many things in private that are not allowed on the public discussion thread but please don't bring that information onto the thread.

Thank you.

 

[heartgoesout]

I’d really like to know who that specific person is in your opinion. I’ve been following since 2019 and think I know all the names mentioned in all the various places where people discuss this case online. I’ve had several POIs, from miscreants to local leaders and educators to friendly sportsmen. I have a couple people I think have been very wrongly named. But I don’t have one answer right in front of me staring me in the face. Sure wish I did. Sure hope the detectives do too.

I missed the conversation with posts deleted so not sure what was said.
Edit to say I'm not naming anyone in particular this is hypothetical theory and just me thinking out loud.
For me, all IMO, what makes the most sense is BG isn't some invisible phantom who went completely and shockingly undetected that day even though there were people there, but rather a person who was known to be there.
Hypothetical theory...BG had to admittedly put himself there and come forward (which takes away looking guilty) because BG knew he was seen and heard... and realized LE wasn't connecting the dots, treating him like a witness not the killer and BG was able to skew the narrative (because BG's a nice local guy from a family of LE). He almost could be a hero for providing info to catch the killer! Problem is LE caught on.
For 4 years everyone (including me) is trying to place random POI's at the trails trying to fit them as the killer, but IMO we have someone who WAS AT THE TRAIL right in front of us, who by default IMO inserted themselves into the investigation, changed their story, fits the timeline, the description and so on.
Ever wonder why the events of that day are so confusing? Why none of it makes sense? Because IMO someone was able to skewed the narrative.
If you take the time to remove all the noise and really study the timeline, things start to stick out. I think LE was able to do this and knows exactly who BG is. When I revisit LE media releases this makes sense to me.
IMO it's possible someone may be providing a false alibi that LE can't break.
It is also tough when someone admittedly says yep I was there. If you think about it, he could have said he saw them and gave each one a big hug since he knew them. Gives a good performance on how upset he is.
LE still needs to place the weapon in his hand.

But for me, IMO if I'm using reasonable deduction and my choices are a) some genius phantom who in a very rural town swept in and killed two children completely undetected or b) someone who fits the bill, was at the crime scene, changed their story, looks like BG, fits the profile, etc...
that my friends is staring us right in the face.
All MOO.

 

[heartgoesout]

Perhaps it makes sense to think about, which name never came up (except in verrry rare and verrry brief comments on YT) and why it might be like that. "Hiding in plain sight" , indirectly. - I may be wrong, you know.

IMO Yep, everyone thought he was a witness. IMO

 

[paraphrase]

I missed the conversation with posts deleted so not sure what was said.
Edit to say I'm not naming anyone in particular this is hypothetical theory and just me thinking out loud.
For me, all IMO, what makes the most sense is BG isn't some invisible phantom who went completely and shockingly undetected that day even though there were people there, but rather a person who was known to be there.
Hypothetical theory...BG had to admittedly put himself there and come forward (which takes away looking guilty) because BG knew he was seen and heard... and realized LE wasn't connecting the dots, treating him like a witness not the killer and BG was able to skew the narrative (because BG's a nice local guy from a family of LE). He almost could be a hero for providing info to catch the killer! Problem is LE caught on.
For 4 years everyone (including me) is trying to place random POI's at the trails trying to fit them as the killer, but IMO we have someone who WAS AT THE TRAIL right in front of us, who by default IMO inserted themselves into the investigation, changed their story, fits the timeline, the description and so on.
Ever wonder why the events of that day are so confusing? Why none of it makes sense? Because IMO someone was able to skewed the narrative.
If you take the time to remove all the noise and really study the timeline, things start to stick out. I think LE was able to do this and knows exactly who BG is. When I revisit LE media releases this makes sense to me.
IMO it's possible someone may be providing a false alibi that LE can't break.
It is also tough when someone admittedly says yep I was there. If you think about it, he could have said he saw them and gave each one a big hug since he knew them. Gives a good performance on how upset he is.
LE still needs to place the weapon in his hand.

But for me, IMO if I'm using reasonable deduction and my choices are a) some genius phantom who in a very rural town swept in and killed two children completely undetected or b) someone who fits the bill, was at the crime scene, changed their story, looks like BG, fits the profile, etc...
that my friends is staring us right in the face.
All MOO.

Although somewhat tedious, I just started re-reading this case from page one.

On page 30 of the first thread, a Websleuther commented, "What's going to really stink is if they find this guy and it turns out he was there with his wife, their kids, and the family dog........................back to square one."

And here we are, 4 years later. I've got lots more reading to do.....

 

[AC4RD]

Although somewhat tedious, I just started re-reading this case from page one... ... And here we are, 4 years later. I've got lots more reading to do.....

Interesting coincidence. I spent an hour or two this morning reading the "Timeline" thread for A&L. I went there with a specific question (How many searchers were there between "missing" and "bodies found?" Answer: around 300 who logged in at the fire department, and another couple of hundred who went unrecorded.)

Anyway, I decided this morning that going through the "Timeline" material might help me get a clearer picture of what happened to whom, when. As you say, there's a lot of reading to do but maybe we will hear of an arrest before long. (Fingers crossed.)

 

[heartgoesout]

Look at who was there at the time of the crime and where exactly they were.

 

[paraphrase]

Interesting coincidence. I spent an hour or two this morning reading the "Timeline" thread for A&L. I went there with a specific question (How many searchers were there between "missing" and "bodies found?" Answer: around 300 who logged in at the fire department, and another couple of hundred who went unrecorded.)

Anyway, I decided this morning that going through the "Timeline" material might help me get a clearer picture of what happened to whom, when. As you say, there's a lot of reading to do but maybe we will hear of an arrest before long. (Fingers crossed.)

Agree, I feel confident it will be soon, and LE will have solid evidence. I'm also hoping discussion and attention continues to flow on this case.

I would assume every person was asked to list every person who they observed searching, picking up, standing around, brief stop, etc. in an attempt to name those 200+ unrecorded persons (friends and family, first responders). I can't even imagine the amount of LE manpower, and time, that has gone into this investigation. Moo

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

Look at who was there at the time of the crime and where exactly they were.

Where can I read this info?

 

[sunshineray]

Look at who was there at the time of the crime and where exactly they were.

Where is that sort of info written down to read?

 

[Ravenmoon]

Look at who was there at the time of the crime and where exactly they were.

From the beginning I have strongly suspected someone that few have ever heard of.
BUT- there are 2 others that ,for me, are looking to be way up on the POI list .
One is the person that Minazoe is thinking of, the other is the person that HGO is talking about.
That person is honestly the one that would be closest to the crime scene , the crime, the timing, etc.
I firmly believe that one of these will be arrested for the crime within a year . (Hopefully less)


AMOO MOO JMO

 

[Charlot123]

I missed the conversation with posts deleted so not sure what was said.
Edit to say I'm not naming anyone in particular this is hypothetical theory and just me thinking out loud.
For me, all IMO, what makes the most sense is BG isn't some invisible phantom who went completely and shockingly undetected that day even though there were people there, but rather a person who was known to be there.
Hypothetical theory...BG had to admittedly put himself there and come forward (which takes away looking guilty) because BG knew he was seen and heard... and realized LE wasn't connecting the dots, treating him like a witness not the killer and BG was able to skew the narrative (because BG's a nice local guy from a family of LE). He almost could be a hero for providing info to catch the killer! Problem is LE caught on.
For 4 years everyone (including me) is trying to place random POI's at the trails trying to fit them as the killer, but IMO we have someone who WAS AT THE TRAIL right in front of us, who by default IMO inserted themselves into the investigation, changed their story, fits the timeline, the description and so on.
Ever wonder why the events of that day are so confusing? Why none of it makes sense? Because IMO someone was able to skewed the narrative.
If you take the time to remove all the noise and really study the timeline, things start to stick out. I think LE was able to do this and knows exactly who BG is. When I revisit LE media releases this makes sense to me.
IMO it's possible someone may be providing a false alibi that LE can't break.
It is also tough when someone admittedly says yep I was there. If you think about it, he could have said he saw them and gave each one a big hug since he knew them. Gives a good performance on how upset he is.
LE still needs to place the weapon in his hand.

But for me, IMO if I'm using reasonable deduction and my choices are a) some genius phantom who in a very rural town swept in and killed two children completely undetected or b) someone who fits the bill, was at the crime scene, changed their story, looks like BG, fits the profile, etc...
that my friends is staring us right in the face.
All MOO.

In all honesty, “looks like BG” means nothing at the moment. I would drop that video. Between “pixelated shot taken from afar” to “walks strangely, but no, it is OK, just the planks” to “a white middle-aged male” to “maybe a silicone mask” , it stopped making any sense.

Perhaps he was a local, or, I wonder, if is it difficult to drive two miles and walk two miles from Flora? Or, drive six miles and walk four miles from Cutler? Drive eight miles and walk four miles from Monticello? In short, I think he parked somewhere in the woods (he knew the area!) and just walked by foot a mile or two.

He might have been undetected, or maybe, there were two of them, after all, with a very good history to provide if they were seen.

If LE allowed anyone, except for direct supervisors, to interject himself into the investigation, to skew the narrative, this just cries LE’s unprofessionalism, and I doubt DC would publicly admit it. I think this story, of the “evil” that has come to Delphi and now controls the investigation, is just a plausible explanation of why the case has not been moving forward. Yeah, someone came in, lied, messed up the narrative… haven’t we all heard it before?

I would not be surprised if in real life, ISP has made some mistakes, and now some evidence is inadmissible. I have heard of such cases.

The only thing that makes sense to me is TL’s phrase that he heard the voice before. Now, I am not sure that he really.did.hear.that.very.voice, but to me, his phrase merely makes the accent very local. Whether the person lives nearby, or lived in the area as a child and can “flip back to old accent”, I don’t know, but there is a certain indication of the “local” factor.

Maybe the killer is someone known to the Delphians and they are afraid, or, more likely, they are scared and try not to intervene (two teenagers killed, scary). They probably don’t quite trust their police, either.

All JMO.

 

[Charlot123]

It would depend on the reason, BG had chosen for a credible explanation, why he was there (should he ever be asked). IMO
Parking at the hidden cemetery would have needed another explanation than parking in the parking lot of the abandoned building, I think.
OR --- there were two people (BG plus "compagnon") with two cars, which were parking at different places. IMO

BG plus “compagnon” sounds very plausible.

I just read about one serial killer (not from the US) with 46 victims. Apparently, the first one was his best friend. They planned serial killings together. And when they were close to starting for real, the SK-to-be suddenly thought that doing it together is the easiest way to be found later. So his “compagnon-to-be” became his first victim.

After that, he was quiet for years, he had killed his closest friend, his alter ego. And then it burst out.

BTW, parking at the cemetery provides so many plausible explanations.

In short, I think that if there was a second person involved, he (or she) is not alive anymore. Accident, cleaning the gun, OD, or suicide. (Not Covid).

 

[Ozoner]

From the beginning I have strongly suspected someone that few have ever heard of.
BUT- there are 2 others that ,for me, are looking to be way up on the POI list .
One is the person that Minazoe is thinking of, the other is the person that HGO is talking about.
That person is honestly the one that would be closest to the crime scene , the crime, the timing, etc.
I firmly believe that one of these will be arrested for the crime within a year . (Hopefully less)


AMOO MOO JMO

BBM

What evidence makes you think that? Nothing LE has said suggests that they are close to an arrest, at least nothing that I'm aware of.

 

[heartgoesout]

In all honesty, “looks like BG” means nothing at the moment. I would drop that video. Between “pixelated shot taken from afar” to “walks strangely, but no, it is OK, just the planks” to “a white middle-aged male” to “maybe a silicone mask” , it stopped making any sense.

Perhaps he was a local, or, I wonder, if is it difficult to drive two miles and walk two miles from Flora? Or, drive six miles and walk four miles from Cutler? Drive eight miles and walk four miles from Monticello? In short, I think he parked somewhere in the woods (he knew the area!) and just walked by foot a mile or two.

He might have been undetected, or maybe, there were two of them, after all, with a very good history to provide if they were seen.

If LE allowed anyone, except for direct supervisors, to interject himself into the investigation, to skew the narrative, this just cries LE’s unprofessionalism, and I doubt DC would publicly admit it. I think this story, of the “evil” that has come to Delphi and now controls the investigation, is just a plausible explanation of why the case has not been moving forward. Yeah, someone came in, lied, messed up the narrative… haven’t we all heard it before?

I would not be surprised if in real life, ISP has made some mistakes, and now some evidence is inadmissible. I have heard of such cases.

The only thing that makes sense to me is TL’s phrase that he heard the voice before. Now, I am not sure that he really.did.hear.that.very.voice, but to me, his phrase merely makes the accent very local. Whether the person lives nearby, or lived in the area as a child and can “flip back to old accent”, I don’t know, but there is a certain indication of the “local” factor.

Maybe the killer is someone known to the Delphians and they are afraid, or, more likely, they are scared and try not to intervene (two teenagers killed, scary). They probably don’t quite trust their police, either.

All JMO.

Looks like BG is still relevant. We know that he is not a super heavy or super tall person for example.

LE is looking for the driver of a car parked at the CPS building. I don't think BG parked and walked miles.

LE did not "allow" BG to skew the narrative. LE interviewed people, who on their own accord placed themselves at the scene and theoretically did a good job of lying and deceiving. LE eventually caught on. Remember there is a fine line of LE interviewing a witness as oppose to a suspect. Was it here things got complicated? Imagine if it was TL who interviewed this person. He knows that voice.
All IMO

 

[Ravenmoon]

BBM

What evidence makes you think that? Nothing LE has said suggests that they are close to an arrest, at least nothing that I'm aware of.

You're correct. LE has not made that statement.
This is all just me, my way of seeing things .
Apologies if I gave the impression that I know more than anyone else.
All just my own take away.


MOO JMO AMOO

 

[FrostedGlass]

LE's move to the new secluded building makes me think they have something pretty solid. I'm impatiently waiting for one of the workers in that other large building to spot someone being brought in and spill it on the net.

 

[Marzipan]

Perhaps it makes sense to think about, which name never came up (except in verrry rare and verrry brief comments on YT) and why it might be like that. "Hiding in plain sight" , indirectly. - I may be wrong, you know.

There are just so many. I think I know who you mean, actually, but the last couple of days people are talking about relooking at those known to have been out on the trails that day. And the person you may be speaking of is someone I’ve never had luck placing in Delphi.
Of those many that were known to be there that day, there is still not just one “staring me right in the face.”
I didn’t follow this case in the beginning because I did not want to get sucked in when it happened. But I’ve been following now since early or mid 2019 and read everything from earlier. Sure wish that by now I could feel the clarity some others have.

 

[gregjrichards]

LE's move to the new secluded building makes me think they have something pretty solid. I'm impatiently waiting for one of the workers in that other large building to spot someone being brought in and spill it on the net.

I’m really pleased that the new building is going to be leased as the HQ for the investigation. I was concerned that the case would only have one or two detectives working on it at this point but thankfully that doesn’t appear to be the case. Hopefully there is a lot of progress and developments being made behind the scenes. It is hard to believe it will be five years since this horrific tragedy happened in just a few months.

It is great that the Abby and Libby Memorial Park is now open. The girl’s families and everyone involved in making the park a reality through fundraising etc should feel incredibly proud, it is a wonderful tribute to the memories of the girls.

I’m glad that Abby and Liberty’s Grandfather’s were positive and confident about the case being solved when they were asked during an interview which took place at the dedication of Abby and Libby’s memorial park a couple of weeks ago. I’m still hopeful law enforcement will get the perpetrator too.

I’m pleased that Chadwell has pled guilty but I’m surprised he did. It would have been horrendous if a trial had gone ahead and the poor girl he greatly harmed and her family had to go through that. I hope he still gets the maximum sentence he can get after what he did. He is a very dangerous man who should spend the rest of his life locked up.