Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #90

[Ccging]

I know the COD was not released, but did they release any possible time of death?

 

[MassGuy]

I know the COD was not released, but did they release any possible time of death?

Nope. We’re still in the dark there, as we are with most of the details of this case.

 

[TTF14]

let's go back to the sketch article for a min and chew on this part:

The sketch released on Monday was drawn by Bryant on Feb. 17, 2017, a few days after the victims' bodies were found. The picture was based on the description of a person who saw something that the person felt needed to be reported, according to Bryant.

Delphi murders: New sketch of killer, video from Libby's phone released

Does that seem like it means it was not necessarily someone seen at the bridge or that area? But someone saw the sketch person doing something odd somewhere else or seemed out of place or something?

Maybe this is why they didn't take the sketch very seriously at first. I dunno, just thinking out loud but it seems an unusual statement imo

I also wonder if LE is kinda upset that the sketch artist spilled the beans about the sketch being old lol

Yeah, like maybe at a laundromat? Getting drunk at a bar/seeming upset? At that "abandoned" vehicle? In the cemetery? Buying a can of gasoline (to burn his clothes)?? Possibilities are endless, but I definitely see your point!

 

[NickoD]

"Also, I don't think it's fair to call the search site abandoned. Everyone involved was out well past dark, and in wooded areas far from light and near a river, I am quite certain the decision to call off the search for the night was made for safety reasons."

Get some flashlights. I would have. I can't imagine their thinking. Which was, as published, they believed the girls were missing by choice. And they stopped searching because it was......dark. Yes, it's dark at night. But that's what flashlights are for. If it were my child, I would have sued for abandoning the search. They would have settled too.

It does not work that way. During a search the first concern is for the safety of the searcher. Furthermore, coordination of the search becomes much more difficult when you have friends and family also searching with you since they might not be as experienced or prepared for the change in weather/temperatures or have the right equipment.

Taking such risks could have compromised the search if a searcher or a family/friend was injured and actually have the opposite effect on the entire operation. This is all procedure.

The search was called off at midnight because it was simply too dark to continue the search without risking the safety of the searchers. Family and friends remained out until 2am on their own. The search was resumed at first light the next day.

 

[Jerrod]

Would the family leaving the press conference upset and in tears have caused the LE Officer to be shaken and emotional?

Along with stepping up to the podium, looking at a roomful of anxious faces of local citizens, and the reality hits you that you have nothing to offer them but a “new” 2-year-old sketch, an additional 2 seconds of video, and an additional spoken word of audio.

 

[kidetect22]

And WHO exactly called off the search that night? I know it was dark but that always struck me as odd. Two kids missing - let's wait til morning?

Not being rude, but that has been rehashed a million times! It’s common protocol to call off a search at night. It is dangerous to LE and volunteer searchers. You are talking about uneven terrain, water, brush, etc that people even familiar with the land, could end up hurt. Even when people were searching that night, more than likely Libby and Abby had already been murdered!

 

[Gumbeaux]

Reporter with WTHR tweeted. With photos. And, go!

Anna Carrera on Twitter

“ @IndStatePolice says killer of #AbbyandLibby is hiding in plain sight, may even be in the room of the press conference this afternoon.”

 

[Kateinfl]

I'm a bit confused re. the car part of things. A car had been parked by the old building. Is this the same car that LE referred to being abandoned by the side of the road and if so, what was the timeline for that.

Maybe the car is where the witness saw the killer and they don't want tosaythe car type because the killer might try to get ridof the car....andif the police mentioned the car type...he wouldn't be able to get rid of the car without someone being suspicious.

 

[Mind your biscuits]

I don’t know if this has been brought up yet but IMO, it is strange that this new sketch looks like such a young man. Maybe he is older than he looks but people do not usually jump from committing no crime to committing a “brutal” double homicide. Where has this guy come from?

I think the first picture had everyone looking for an older guy. That was misleading to most people. The new picture shows a younger looking guy. Perhaps we should have been looking in plain sight for a middle aged baby faced dude. Maybe one who was clean shaven prior to the crime and not so much after. Moo

 

[kidetect22]

"Also, I don't think it's fair to call the search site abandoned. Everyone involved was out well past dark, and in wooded areas far from light and near a river, I am quite certain the decision to call off the search for the night was made for safety reasons."

Get some flashlights. I would have. I can't imagine their thinking. Which was, as published, they believed the girls were missing by choice. And they stopped searching because it was......dark. Yes, it's dark at night. But that's what flashlights are for. If it were my child, I would have sued for abandoning the search. They would have settled too.

Let’s remember too, even when the search was called off, doesn’t mean that family and friends weren’t still searching.

 

[PaulaDC]

I believe LE's statement on the car was poorly worded. I had a difficult time trying to determine if Carter meant it was an abandoned car OR was it was a car parked near an abandoned building. One news site showed a map and indicated an address on West 300 N (6814?). Also I believe he stated the building was the 'old' DPS/CPS building on W 300 near the Hoosier Heartland Hwy. If you do a Google search you find the DPS/CPS (IN Dept of Protective Services/Child Protective Services) is not at that location but in downtown Delphi and nowhere near the trail. If this address on W 300 is correct it is right across from the trailhead. A car parked in front an abandoned building might stick out to those driving by.
But, yes, ALL of this seems odd to me as well.

Someone might rule out a vehicle if they saw someone upstanding in their mind near or exiting the vehicle. Someone that wasn't a "stranger". Trying to stir up someone's memory bank and give them a different perspective on what they saw.

 

[Inthedetails]

I've been out all day so this might have been discussed already....

I noticed Carter called the girls "two little girls" rather than by their names. I wonder if that was also a statement to the killer - could the killer be a father, step-father, brother of young girls himself? Or someone who the community trusts with young kids in particular?

jmo

 

[deugirtni]

Yep, she sure does say that. Weird. I guess that could explain why he wasnt covered in blood if that's the actual COD.

Sorry if mentioned in the meantime (I'm only 11 pages behind!), but would also explain how they were able to have open caskets at their funeral(s), which occurred, as per reports at the time.

 

[Inthedetails]

Let’s remember too, even when the search was called off, doesn’t mean that family and friends weren’t still searching.

I'm recalling that people thought the girls had run away. Do we know WHY they thought that?

jmo

 

[Medstudies]

Okay, not that it matters much, but in the presser, at 1:18, info is requested about the driver of the vehicle that was “parked” (not abandoned) between the hours of noon-5.

And then this:
State Police receive a thousand tips since new Delphi evidence release

Police are still asking for tips. They should be sent to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com.

Police request that tips include the following information:

• Suspect's name
• Date of birth or approximate age
• Physical description including height, weight, hair color, eye color
• Address or location including city
• Vehicle information including year, make, model, color
• Specific reason for the tip. Why could they be the suspect?
• Motivation for the crime
• Connection to Delphi, IN

BBM: (moo) makes me wonder if they know what vehicle was there, and a way to make it easier to hone in on the tip that breaks the case.

 

[CrimeDawg123]

This was reported by at least 2 reporters who tweeted it before
the pc started. One said family was 'angry' and other said 'in tears'.

If it is true that the family left "in tears", one thing that could leave them that way is to learn that LE has bupkis more than they did 2 years ago. IMO

 

[kidetect22]

I'm recalling that people thought the girls had run away. Do we know WHY they thought that?

jmo

I don’t think anyone thought they ran away, it was more like, maybe they had gone deeper into the woods and lost their way back... or maybe they left and went to a friends house and didn’t call or text to family members they had left and went somewhere else for the day... more along those lines is what people were thinking !

ETA from my memory, I’m not sure everyone was thinking that, but I can remember more of them getting lost and couldn’t find their way back was what they were worried about. Like the girls being cold... no one was fearing them dead at the point the search was called off, also added article from when the girls were still missing. Talks about at the end how they didn’t believe the girls were in danger

Authorities, family continue searching for missing Carroll County teens

 

[cluciano63]

If it is true that the family left "in tears", one thing that could leave them that way is to learn that LE has bupkus more than they did 2 years ago. IMO

That is exactly what I think. Back to the beginning but with a new sketch.

 

[mtnlites]

We don't know that these people are totally different. The sketches are not that similar, but eyewitness testimony is, I'm sorry to say, very often incorrect or remembering wrongly. The human mind is just not that observant unless it's been specifically trained to do so.

Also, I don't think it's fair to call the search site abandoned. Everyone involved was out well past dark, and in wooded areas far from light and near a river, I am quite certain the decision to call off the search for the night was made for safety reasons.

You're right about the safety reasons. And many people remained out until after midnight. It was very dark outside, and very cold, and the landscape is hilly and difficult to traverse in the dark. Still, it's not like everyone packed up and left at 10pm.

 

[MassGuy]

I've been out all day so this might have been discussed already....

I noticed Carter called the girls "two little girls" rather than by their names. I wonder if that was also a statement to the killer - could the killer be a father, step-father, brother of young girls himself? Or someone who the community trusts with young kids in particular?

jmo

I think that was a technique intended to rattle him, with the added purpose of encouraging someone close to him to speak up.

Typically you would personalize the victims, repeating their names over and over.

By saying “two little girls,” it adds an emotional charge.

It emphasizes how monstrous this guy’s actions were.

He is a coward, who preyed on the weak and innocent. It might just spur a reaction from him, one that can help expose him.