Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #97

[Angelcat13]

Is it normal IN vernacular to consider an empty CPS building as abandoned?

Just wondering if he used “abandoned” instead of “empty” or similar terms because he may have felt “abandoned” more accurately reflects that the business no longer occupies the building? He may have thought “empty” or similar terms could be construed as the business was still locates there but was closed at the time and therefore empty of people?

Either way, I don’t really think the specific word means much.

 

[MassGuy]

If he isn't organized, then he's awfully lucky in my opinion.

Very lucky.

This was incredibly brazen and stupid.

I think some people are conflating skill, with dumb luck.

You don’t have to be some criminal genius to get away with something like this.

Stranger homicides (if this is one), are notoriously difficult to solve.

 

[Jax49]

They were two small teenage girls.

Its not difficult to dispose of their little bodies.

Why would LE not advise they are looking for two perps?

Are you saying this due to the two sketches released by LE? Because sketch 1 guy was cleared and it was not him.

Why do you think the killing didn't take place at the park?

moo

The victims were young teens but one was not a small girl, per the FBI posters.

https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/seeking-info/liberty-german/@@download.pdf

 

[steeltowngirl]

I’m sitting here wondering if there is even ONE THING that everybody can agree on as related to this case. Anything? I can’t think of one thing lol (other than we all want him arrested, of course).

YES. We agree that BG murdered two beautiful girls and we want LE to catch him and as was said before, nail him to the floor.

 

[taximama24]

I'm not sure I follow the discussion on the snapchat pic of Abby, I'm not seeing anything in that spot on the picture. However as to the talk of the focal point not falling on Abby but on the wood, just keep in mind this is not only a phone camera, but its also not even just the camera functionality but the Snapchat app, which is basically known for its filters, 99% of which involve some form of distortion (on purpose).

 

[margarita25]

YES. We agree that BG murdered two beautiful girls and we want LE to catch him and as was said before, nail him to the floor.

Well of course we want all LE to catch him, but as far as everyone being in agreement, there are even some people who think BG may not have acted alone, so technically even what you said is not entirely true as far as everyone agreeing, lol.

 

[MingyMoo]

Hi All,

Long-time no chat although I have been lurking on and off. I still can’t help but think Libby & Abbie

• Recognised their assailant-s
• Knew off their assailant-s (Please note Knew off of is very different to Know)

I personally think the assailant was known to them or recognised to be in a place he shouldn’t have been. That is why Libby started recording , she sensed danger because she recognised and saw someone out of place.

Whether it was a wanted person from a different crime reported Locally for example

• Local news broadcast
• Local Paper
• Local Alert

Something triggered her to start recording

MOO

Mingy

 

[raja]

If you're religious then it's nice to have. In many small communities the church is pretty much the center of people's social lives. Our town doesn't have cinemas, places to shop, etc. We have parks, mountains, school, and church.

Yes I guess maybe church on Monday afternoons would be normal. (?) Did the church have activities for kids since it was a weekday off? Parents do work and all.

 

[Krwiley60]

Another blood-boiler for me is knowing one of them had to watch the other one die first .

After watching Gray Hughe's (sp?) video again last night, I think the girls probably made a run for it over the creek if it happened the way Gray theorizes (the path taken, I mean). I don't think the killer intended to kill them anywhere but right there at the bottom of that hill when they first exited the bridge. If they did run it probably only enraged him further once he caught up to them . This also tells me this guy is agile.

Didn’t LE say the video re-enactments were not correct? Where did I hear that?

 

[margarita25]

Very lucky.

This was incredibly brazen and stupid.

I think some people are conflating skill, with dumb luck.

You don’t have to be some criminal genius to get away with something like this.

Stranger homicides (if this is one), are notoriously difficult to solve.

MassGuy, off the top of your head, and I am asking seriously and not in a challenging way (I will clearly state if I am being challenging lol), is can you (or anyone else) name an example of a perp who would be similar to what you’re thinking about being dumb and just lucky and able to evade for so long? I’m sure there are tons of examples but I was trying to think about this the other day and was not recalling any specific examples off the top of my head. Tia.

 

[foxbluff]

I can't help but imagine the shocked surprise and utter fear caused by someone jumping out of bushes and grabbing you...a someone who is stronger than you...a someone who is armed with a deadly weapon and won't hesitate to use it. Imagine the heart-pounding, gut-wrenching feeling of helplessness...knowing there's nothing you can do to save yourself and nobody is coming to help you. And then you hear those words "get on the ground."


Wouldn't today be a good day for BG to find out what that feels like?

 

[steeltowngirl]

Well of course we want all LE to catch him, but as far as everyone being in agreement, there are even some people who think BG may not have acted alone, so technically even what you said is not entirely true as far as everyone agreeing, lol.

Maybe we can use the acronym BG as the universal entity that is responsible. Since we can’t be sure of anything about this case. Other than those girls are gone at the hands of this unknown monster. I don’t even want to picture that monster entity in my head anymore. Just want to eradicate and replace with honoring the lives of Libby and Abby. I believe we all want that. I’m impatient, I’m guessing we all are. But LE asked for patience so I’m going with it. They will get him.

 

[dub]

Here's where I'm at right now: the key word for BG is "average". Just a generally unremarkable guy.

I think he's going to be right around average intelligence. Could be somewhat above or below; I think more likely to be below, but neither would surprise me. Probably high-school educated; may be a college dropout or have a 2-year degree, and I think he has a trade of some kind.

Average height and weight. I think because he seems to be looking down in the images he could be taller than expected [eta: meaning, if he stood up straight he'd be taller]; I wouldn't discount anyone 6'1" or less based on height, although I think he's about 5'9" and 180 pounds. Looks are probably average too--not objectively attractive nor ugly. Roughly 30 years old.

He most likely has passable social skills and has some friends, although not a ton; people probably think of him as a little weird, but not alarmingly so or especially off-putting to the point where he would be on anyone's radar for something like this.

He probably has a job that affords him a fair amount of flexibility and mobility, and may be self-employed. He may have been unemployed at the time of the murders, and may have intermittent employment in general, but most likely does not go through long-term periods of unemployment.

He most likely struggles to an extent with both substance abuse and mental health, but his issues with both are not "extreme", at least not visibly--not a hard drug addict or raging alcoholic, and probably has not been hospitalized for mental health.

I'm not sure what I think of his living situation. I don't think he lives with his parents long-term, but as with the employment, may do so intermittently. He's probably not born and raised right in Delphi, but likely has spent his entire life in the vicinity, may have lived there for a time, and probably went to school with people who were.

I'm also on the fence as to whether the murders were sexually motivated, but if they were, I think that was secondary. I think the primary motivation was rage--not specifically towards A & L, but towards some precipitating event--but there was definitely something secondary, maybe sexual, maybe an urge to kill for whatever reason, that arose around that time for whatever reason.

In contrast to some others here, I do think in that moment he would have attacked an adult woman if that was the opportunity, although I don't think he would have attacked two together.

The crime was probably a mix of organized and disorganized characteristics, and was almost certainly not targeted towards A & L. I do not think he was familiar personally with A & L, although they probably knew some of the same people and may have met before.

 

[ocgrad]

Nooooooow we’re getting down to it, lol.

For me, as Fitzgerald would say in the Closs case, these are “million dollar questions”. As for the latest released sketch, this imo comes down to witness’ reliability and subjective interpretation for one which can get very iffy, imo.

As far as the other sketch being ruled out, I don’t know what to think about that. I’ve been meaning to listen to that podcast that supposedly references this, but then got strayed away when some posters said they didn’t even have some basic facts right.

Right!? Me too!
I agree the early witness that saw him without head or face covered, became credible after something else came to light.
That the first sketch was said to be a SO who was cleared I consider rumor till I set my self down to listen or the former officers quote their source.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

I'm not sure I follow the discussion on the snapchat pic of Abby, I'm not seeing anything in that spot on the picture. However as to the talk of the focal point not falling on Abby but on the wood, just keep in mind this is not only a phone camera, but its also not even just the camera functionality but the Snapchat app, which is basically known for its filters, 99% of which involve some form of distortion (on purpose).

Could the difference in the sketches be that simple? Could one have been based from a snapchat pic that's been reversed engineered? Just a thought. The differences in the 2 sketches are just startling. It makes my mind want to figure out why. RIP to these 2 beautiful angels, and fly high.

 

[SeattleStew]

MassGuy, off the top of your head, and I am asking seriously and not in a challenging way (I will clearly state if I am being challenging lol), is can you (or anyone else) name an example of a perp who would be similar to what you’re thinking about being dumb and lucky and able to evade for so long? I’m sure there are tons of examples but I was trying to think about this the other day and was not recalling any specific examples off the top of my head. Tia.

I know you are asking Mass Guy, but of course I thought of my Tacoma girls right away--Jenny Bastian and Michaela Welch. 1986-2018. Their murders terrorized Tacoma for 32 years.

 

[dalsglen]

I have to believe that as the filming started that he really had the girls under control fast and that's why a longer silent video of his walk hasn't been released.

I rarely wear my glasses so focus alot on the way people walk/carry themselves to recognise them. I can guarantee you I could spot a friends/acquaintances mannerisms a mile off even on a dodgy bridge.

 

[Krwiley60]

I agree and I don't think he had to do anything extra awful to their bodies in order for Carter to make that comment.

A dead child is pretty much the worst sight in the world all on its own. Leaving them dead and discarded, on the creek bank and open to the elements, is already bad. There doesn't have to be more to it.

What do you think Leazenby was referring to when he said “twist”? Audio and video or something else?

 

[x_files]

For two years we have been looking for the schlubbiest degenerate ever. People were listing all kinds of suspects based on social status in town. Didn’t ever see any choir boys come up. Only guys who could possibly be nicknamed Bubba.
Wonder why that is?

good question!!!

 

[MassGuy]

MassGuy, off the top of your head, and I am asking seriously and not in a challenging way (I will clearly state if I am being challenging lol), is can you (or anyone else) name an example of a perp who would be similar to what you’re thinking about being dumb and lucky and able to evade for so long? I’m sure there are tons of examples but I was trying to think about this the other day and was not recalling any specific examples off the top of my head. Tia.

Carl Eugene Watts, is an extreme example.

He killed dozens of women, but took advantage of of the fact that the murders were random.

His IQ was about 75.

I don’t think this guy is that stupid, but I absolutely don’t think he’s very smart, or works a job that requires a great deal of intellectual ability.