IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #17

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Bently said:
For some reason, this post made me think of Eric Rudolph and how he hid in plain site in the woods after the Olympic Bombing. For five years he hid in the woods outside of Andrews NC to escape capture by FBI etc....... this USAToday article gave insight as to how it could be done even after he was identified and named as suspect.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-07-05-rudolph-cover-parttwo_x.htm
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That was an interesting read, thanks for the link!!
 
kirkassoc said:
Hope LE reached out to public to see who may have been near the bridge on Friday, 2/10. It's possible BG may have been scoping then and didn't have an opportunity, etc. JMO
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That's a good thought. Has anyone in the park seen anyone like BG in the park in the last few weeks or months? He could have been prowling earlier for an opportunity.

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Can someone throw a rail, +bus, +freight/18 Wheeler map on top of each other and maybe we can peg 3-4 spots of interest/major hubs where camera's, traffic stops, etc., may have occurred? Or restaurants/odd businesses someone might visit (I know this is disgusting, but sex shops/*advertiser censored*, etc.), stuff like that?
 
azshadowwalker said:
Replying to the posted MSM piece in this post http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13191793 from the previous thread.

Authorities are arresting witnesses and others they question if there are outstanding warrants or other crimes come to light during questioning. Based upon stuff I have read in other WS threads, many people operate under the misconception that this doesn't happen; cops overlook other crimes in order to get information about a murder. I mean, you only have to watch The First 48 to know that this isn't the case, but here we have LE telling us point blank.

This concerns me. If the crime or warrant is for something violent, I understand, but this sounds like a blanket statement. I can see it discouraging tips from locals who worry about being arrested for something else if they come forward.

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Tips can be made anonymously. Therefore, if you are worried about being arrested, you can place a tip without anyone knowing your identity.
 
heaterann said:
Grrr if I didn't have this dumb thing called a job and a life that I was responsible for I would love to just pack up and go to the trail so that I could see this for myself. It may just be me but the maps just don't completely make sense to me, I would need to walk it myself to truly be able to form a solid opinion on what happened. I just keep going back and forth and all over the place lol
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Hey I'm Right there with ya!
Them make no sense to me at all.
 
Rpenrod said:
Something that bothers me about the railroad scenario(although IMO this should be investigated) is that there haven't been bodies found of other alleged victims. If bodies were located COD would be a huge piece of evidence but until then the MO just seems different. Abby and Liberty were found quite quickly IMO so unless BG just got spooked and ran out in the middle of his crime I find it hard to believe his other victims wouldn't have been discovered by now. Of course if LE deemed these other victims as runaways they may not have searched as thoroughly. These are all IMO though.
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The mild weather over the past few weeks, the planned pick up time for the girls, and family probably yelling their names in the area early on when they did not appear for pickup, I'm thinking played into the girls being found. The crime may have been cut short and there was no time to hide them. But just to get away himself
 
matou said:
OK dumb question but how was the deer creek water level? Could someone paddle through there with a canoe at that time?
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Water levels were posted last night (hydro graphic water and river flow charts).

Water was apx. knee-to-waist high deep when the searchers were scouring.

The water levels have noticeably fluctuated in the days prior and after the murders. I did watch video of the area the week before the murders (I believe), and there was a dusting of snow as well.

I'm just jumping in here to answer your question. So, I have missed why you asked it - or what train of thought that is on? Basically, are you wondering if he paddled to and from the crime (more than 1 similarity to Lyric and Lizzie's case, that's for sure)?
 
It amazes me how we look at small town living. Having gown up in what would be considered a large suburb I always pictured small towns as Mayberry lol idk always loved The Andy Griffith Show . But the truth is very different. There is crime, there are homeless people, there are squatters / vagrants, rapes happen, people get killed, they have drug problems, divorces. Perhaps it's that mentality that make these towns a target for someone like the perp, after all things like that just dont happen around here so their guard is down. Where as I would never ever let my kids go walking around any hiking trail alone period, but like I stated I grew up in a much much larger city so I have a greater awareness of what could happen cause it does.
 
It may be that the killer's family knows the true nature of the killer, many characteristics that have been shown since childhood and even protect it or worse even share

 
Ms Suzanne said:
I feel maybe LE might know or suspect that someone who knows the suspect is not talking.That might be why the family will talk to the public soon.I feel if someone does not come up and turn the guy in after they see this presser when it comes out that they are very very cold hearted.That's so sad for Abby and Libby and their families.
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There are plenty of Mama Kohlhepps' out there.

It is disgusting.
 
mazblondie said:
Is the cemetery near the scene still in use? Does anyone local know?

In use as in are there still active burials/additional unfilled plots?

Could it be the perp was at the graveyard visiting a relative/friend and saw the girls and acted?

MOO
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And if it's still working, how many employees does it have? Have they been checked out?
 
Yellow Rose said:
For those wondering why LE hasn't released a sketch or clearer picture I think it's honestly because they don't have a clearer picture. Why would they send out and post on billboards a grainy image if they had better? I think Libby took that video very very quickly and without turning audio off she stuck that phone in a pocket. I think audio is still going and LE hear stuff they wish they could erase from memory. I think if you watch the original presser you know they've never seen or heard anything like this before in their lives. And they made no bones about Libby being the hero of a lifetime to have the presence of mind to do what she did.
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Thank-you, Yellow Rose, well said.
 
It seems to me the landowner is used to and frustrated by people trespassing on his property. I posted a link last night where he called to report a burglar in his barn back in 2014.

So perhaps parts of this creek are used by locals or known as a hangout spot. When I was a kid visiting my grandmother in rural Illinois, older relatives used to point out the "gypsies" who were camping by a local creek. I could see them on the creaked through the woods.
 
heaterann said:
That totally answered all my questions :) I am very grateful you were able to go to the site and can answer these questions, it very much helps. From what you saw can you please give us your opinion of the events?
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.

My theory changed almost immediately once I got into Delphi. Originally I thought that maybe it was a random passerby possibly hitchhiking. It took me an hour to find this place via GPS and asking two separate people for directions. IMO there is no way someone just stumbled onto this bridge at the exact same time these two girls did.

I don't really have 1 solid theory. I think it was planned out very meticulously. IMO it was someone who knew the girls and knew they were going to be there and knew there was no school that day. Whether that was a Delphi citizen/family/friend or someone the girls met online and were thinking they were meeting up with, then along comes this guy in the middle of nowhere and they got spooked.

My other theory is that they were dropped off at the trail right beside highway 25/Hoosier Heartland, they walked across the top of the interstate and someone saw them, knew the area, and made a U-turn to catch up with them, knowing the bridge and hoping to catch them alone.

I don't think they parked in front of the trial or walked the trail from in town, that's a hike and their vehicle would have been sitting right on the road for all to see. I believe the perp parked at the back of the cemetery where it was kind of hidden, came in the northeast side of the woods and cased the area, watching the girls for a while to plan just the right moment to confront them for the attack. He saw them at the Southwest side of the bridge where its desolate and secluded and followed them, I think they saw him and got scared and and started walking fast to the North end, this is closest to any kind of population, other walkers, and the house right on the road. My first thought in that situation is to try and get somewhere safe where other people are. They snapped a photo over their shoulder but kept moving. I think he was walking very fast and trying to watch his step to catch up and this is why his feet/foot looks strange in the one picture.

Maybe once they got to the end of the trail they felt a little more relaxed and safer? Anyway, I think he caught up with them at the end and somehow accosted them and made them go up the East side of the bridge into the woods, there's a hill there and you can't see over it from the bridge or path and led them back towards the cemetery, and took them down closer to the water because it's hidden, did whatever horrible things I cannot even think about and left immediately. I'm sure he asked them what time they were going to be picked up, he knew he was on a time schedule and wasn't going to waste time hiking all over the woods and through the water or dragging bodies.

But............I honestly have no idea what happened! LOL
That's just my theory. I hope they catch this soon!
 
Nellsbells said:
I think that he either walked in from the parking spaces in town, he utilized the cemetery or he parked on one of the other trails in the area not connected to this park. I would imagine quite a few people park at the cemetery to walk the trails as there's such limited spaces near the bridge. I don't think cars parked at the cemetery would arouse much suspicion, and this guy knew he needed to park for awhile. It's probably already been answered, but I wonder if the parking lot in town has camera surveillance? Although I really do not think he used that parking.

ETA: I really want to get down there and check my theories out. Hopefully next week if they haven't solved this (and I'm praying my hardest that they do!).
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If he lives in the area, it's quite possible that he didn't drive a car or park anywhere. He could be the adult son or family member of one of the nearby property owners. He would be familiar with the area. You would be surprised how many older adult parents with adult children that are non productive citizens have no clue what their adult child does or is capable of doing especially if they are older people. He is not a social person and it's a small town so he can fly under the radar.
 
Wondergirl said:
Water levels were posted last night (hydro graphic water and river flow charts).

Water was apx. knee-to-waist high deep when the searchers were scouring.

The water levels have noticeably fluctuated in the days prior and after the murders. I did watch video of the area the week before the murders (I believe), and there was a dusting of snow as well.

I'm just jumping in here to answer your question. So, I have missed why you asked it - or what train of thought that is on? Basically, are you wondering if he paddled to and from the crime (more than 1 similarity to Lyric and Lizzie's case, that's for sure)?
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Well, I was wondering if this could be possible. Paddling in jeans would suck though. I think LE has some kind of car info i.e. tire tracks somewhere based on them stopping people in their cars to interview them.
 
BlankSpace11 said:
Anyone buried there recently, maybe recent funeral that had out of town family come in and noticed trail, possibly on Friday ?
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I am just going to go through the more recent interments. Problem is its only 81% documented.
 
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