IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #18

[nerdgirl]

Reward over 216,000 - sorry if already posted

[video=twitter;837363660024655876]https://twitter.com/ISPPeru/status/837363660024655876[/video]


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[Leomoon80]

Here is some information about autopsies and public records in Indiana: https://www.in.gov/pac/files/Public_Access_To_Death_Records.pdf

So the girls autopsies must be made public I suppose

A law enforcement agency generally has the discretion to withhold investigatory records. (See I.C. § 5-14-3-
4(b)(1)) Investigatory records contain information compiled during the investigation of a crime. (See I.C. § 5-
14-3-2(h))
When a coroner performs a death investigation pursuant to (I.C. § 36-2-14-6), the materials the coroner
collects are investigatory records for the purposes of the APRA. Althaus v. Evansville Courier Co., 615
N.E.2d 441, 446 (Ind. Ct. App. 1993).
A coroner performs the duties required by (I.C. § 36-2-14-6) when investigating the death of an individual
who “has died from violence; has died by casualty; has died when apparently in good health; has died in an
apparently suspicious, unusual, or unnatural manner; or has been found dead.” (See I.C. § 36-2-14-6(a))
Even if a coroner conducts a death investigation pursuant to (I.C. § 36-2-14-6), the coroner must nonetheless
release information required by (I.C. § 36-2-14-18(a)

 

[Penny4them]

First time poster. Not sure if anyone has seen this video. Posted just two days before the murders. Gives n amazing vantage point and good understanding of the entire area. [video=youtube;y0MNncO9lLs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0MNncO9lLs[/video]

Thanks for video, really gave me an idea of the scale of the bridge and trees, the perspective right down on the river and river banks was eye opening.

 

[Nocgirl]

Has it been determined the girls were dumped at the scene after it was orig searched? I thought the property owner said his property had already been searched previously and the bodies must have been dumped there after.

So tragic. I am sick they have not made an arrest yet.

 

[dpaoloni]

I really wonder what the girls were doing before they got to that park. Were they at a store, and someone overhead they were being dropped off at the trail? Just seems so convenient that he/them just happened to be there when the girls were. Doesn't seem like you can really see much from any of the streets either.

 

[dotr]

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-27763842

[h=1]Do cash rewards actually help catch criminals?[/h] By Emma Hallett BBC News

• 24 June 2014

"For anybody that has got that information it might just be the trigger or tipping point for them to come forward," says Nick Howe, a former chief superintendent with Staffordshire Police and now a criminologist at the University of Derby
And yet, the fact is, where rewards are on offer, very few people ever claim them.
Crimestoppers - which takes statements anonymously - offers rewards of up to £1,000 for information that helps the police to make an arrest and charge.

More important is the ability to provide information anonymouslyIan Froggett, Crimestoppers​

But it says fewer than 2% of people eligible actually claim a reward.
However, the police and newspapers, as well as other private companies, frequently offer large sums of money for information.
So what is the point of offering rewards?
The reason behind putting up the sum of money is straightforward - to create greater media opportunities to glean vital information and help solve crimes.

"If information can fast track inquiries - bearing in mind most major inquires/murder inquires are very expensive - there is an argument that... a short sharp injection of money can do that," he said. "I think you can argue it is good use of public money."

Crimestopper's operations performance manager Ian Froggett argued that rewards helped to keep crime lower by intimidating potential criminals.

 

[pseudo_hum]

I'm not being argumentative, but just want to point out another perspective on this: maybe LE have their hands full most of the time and can't direct 100% of resources to every missing person all of the time. In other words, it's a heck of a lot easier to criticize actions after the fact IMO and I think it's more complicated than that.

JMO.

Hindsight is 20/20.

 

[Deleted member 278]

Has it been determined the girls were dumped at the scene after it was orig searched? I thought the property owner said his property had already been searched previously and the bodies must have been dumped there after.

So tragic. I am sick they have not made an arrest yet.

Good question. I heard that too but never asked if anyone had any proof of it.

 

[EllieBee]

This is a really interesting (old) article from Psychology Today regarding how predators select their victims. More importantly, it gives advice on keeping yourself safe (safer).

I think I will share this one with my daughter.....

https://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200901/marked-mayhem

 

[gregjrichards]

Looking forward to this, wondering how long it would take?..
rbbm.
http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/re...e/news-story/28908ec6b693b0460913a84d05b93c13

In the Elizabeth Collins and Lyric Cook case the FBI profile was released two years after they went missing and 16 months after their remains were found. I don't know why there was such this much of a delay hopefully they won't wait that long in this case.

 

[ab01]

Has it been determined the girls were dumped at the scene after it was orig searched? I thought the property owner said his property had already been searched previously and the bodies must have been dumped there after.

So tragic. I am sick they have not made an arrest yet.

We don't know when they were left there. Or how they got to the dump site for that matter. We just dont know and LE hasn't said, all else is speculation

 

[ocgrad]

So the girls autopsies must be made public I suppose

A law enforcement agency generally has the discretion to withhold investigatory records. (See I.C. § 5-14-3-
4(b)(1)) Investigatory records contain information compiled during the investigation of a crime. (See I.C. § 5-
14-3-2(h))
When a coroner performs a death investigation pursuant to (I.C. § 36-2-14-6), the materials the coroner
collects are investigatory records for the purposes of the APRA. Althaus v. Evansville Courier Co., 615
N.E.2d 441, 446 (Ind. Ct. App. 1993).
A coroner performs the duties required by (I.C. § 36-2-14-6) when investigating the death of an individual
who “has died from violence; has died by casualty; has died when apparently in good health; has died in an
apparently suspicious, unusual, or unnatural manner; or has been found dead.” (See I.C. § 36-2-14-6(a))
Even if a coroner conducts a death investigation pursuant to (I.C. § 36-2-14-6), the coroner must nonetheless
release information required by (I.C. § 36-2-14-18(a)

And then LE can file to have it sealed for a period of time, perhaps 30 days, if it is critical to an ongoing investigation. And they can have it resealed as needed I believe. The same with search warrants, 911 calls or any documents that are critical to the investigation.

 

[Deleted member 278]

OT: Phil interviews Austin Harrouff today

 

[Lawyer]

It seems many people think that someone knows this guy and isn't reporting him to the tip line for some reason. So, I started to think about why someone might not report him (or might not report him YET). The reward money might not be a motivating factor for someone in the know (SITK). If someone loves the BG and wants to help him, maybe that someone is busy liquidating or selling assets to come up with money for a private defense attorney. At this point, it seems everyone in that community has heard about BG and probably seen the pictures. There are billboards up in most of the states, and the crime has been reported internationally. It could be that SITK did report BG to the tip line and the tips are still being sorted. But, LE is active on credible tips. So, maybe the SITK is just waiting for the "right" time to come forward.

 

[heaterann]

Law enforcement just like emergency medical services have to follow protocols. Every time a child or children are reported missing or in the case if we think back all that had happened at that point was they just didn’t show up on time for their pick up. Was it reasonable that they were taking their time, “just being teenagers” point being if the situation did not fit all the criteria for the “Missing / Abducted Child Protocol” then the LE acted in a reasonable and responsible manner. Do I agree with the protocol no, I wish that every time a child was not exactly where they were suppose to be we could send the troops out to search for that stat but that’s just not realistic and many many times missing kids are found unharmed, in trouble from their parents no doubt but they haven’t been met with foul play, that’s why the protocols are in place. I made a comment many threads back that I had wondered if these girls had come from different families ie, grandparents are raising Libby and Abby is from a single mother household would they have taken the fact that these girls did not return on time more seriously. On one hand they have protocols on the other hand LE do not turn their backs when they believe children are in danger. For whatever reason the LE just couldn’t for see the situation and who really could have?

 

[margarita25]

In regards to the "fanny pack", I saw a comment on a news post that the BG could be wearing a waist pack that hunters use to carry extra ammo, knife, etc. Here's a picture of a similar style. When looking into this, I noticed this color was often referred to as vintage tan making me think he has had it for awhile.

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Yep...

 

[EllieBee]

Oh oh oh oh !

I totally meant to share this with y'all last night, but my husband does not follow any of the cases I follow here on WS. I may mention something here ar there, but he finds my interest "depressing".

That said, he texted me yesterday to ask if I had heard about the two girls in Indiana, and I said that I was following closesly, but how had he heard of them?

He said he heard Pat McAfee talking about them! My hubby is a big football fan, and also listens to the Bob and Tom show out of Indy (where Pat is a frequent guest).

So, there is definitely something positive about having celebs or sports figures help in getting the word out. My husband never would have known about the girls if not for that.

We live in LA, btw....not any local coverage that I have seen, but I don't watch much telly.

 

[FrostedGlass]

The still pic and voice memo don't look that way though JMO


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I agree the drug addict theory has loose ends. I've never sleuthed and I've sure picked a doozy to begin on.

I even considered BG may have taken them back to the north end by going under the bridge, instead of on it; but the lady who was on the bridge shortly after Abby's pic was uploaded probably would have seen them.

 

[KenzieK]

I also have very strong feelings about people in call in tips that really in reality aren't tips, they are opinions like " I saw the two still images and believe that the suspect has had knee replacement surgery and my friend made a video out of the two still pictures so from studying that, I believe that he's using a prosthetic leg on the right and may have had three toes removed on the left. " That Type of"tip" makes me SMH because I feel like the tipster may not realize that the police know more then we do. I'm sure the FBI is plenty qualified to study the evidence.
Fwiw, I would encourage anyone with a valid tip to call in though. If your thinking the suspect looks like your neighbor or sounds like your husband, by all means call it in! My personal opinion.....
End rant!

Completely agree! Some people don't seem to understand the difference between a tip and a theory. LE can come up with plenty of their own theories (using a lot more resources based on a lot more information than the public has available). The only time a member of the public can help solve this case is if they have information that LE does NOT have and/or is not publicly available. You'd think this would be common sense, but evidently it's not.

Examples of things that are NOT "tips":
- "You should look into RSOs"
- "I think the perp might be hiding a gun. I can totally see the outline.
- "Check out the map of the crime scene and sketch of the suspect I made."
- "You should look into men who had knee replacements because my uncle had one and walks like that."

Examples of useful TIPS:
- "My co-worker looks a bit like the suspect, and I just found two pairs of girls panties in his desk drawer."
(If the victims were found fully clothed LE will quickly move on, but if they were found nude with their underwear missing they'd follow up on this.)

- "I found a bloody knife in my neighbor's garage. He claims he cut up a deer with it, but the story he gave me didn't add up."
(If the victims were strangled LE would probably dismiss the tip, but if they were stabbed they might follow up on it).

- "My husband has been acting strange since that day, and when I asked where his blue jacket and brown hoodie were he claimed he lost them, but he doesn't remember when or where."
(They would likely follow up on this due to someone reporting a close family member).

I realize that at the press conference they encouraged the public to call with any tips no matter how insignificant they seemed. However, I'm pretty sure they did NOT mean to call in with wild (or even plausible) theories. Hopefully within those 10,000 plus calls and emails they received there's a few that actually qualify as TIPS, and hopefully one will actually pan out. I'm just afraid that it's going to take much longer to get to that viable tip because they have to sort through 9,999 pieces of nonsense to get to it.

 

[#1nana]

First time poster. Not sure if anyone has seen this video. Posted just two days before the murders. Gives n amazing vantage point and good understanding of the entire area. [video=youtube;y0MNncO9lLs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0MNncO9lLs[/video]

I think this video shows just how bare and open this area and the woods are this time of year! There really isn't much hiding in there in the winter. This guy was brazen beyond belief!