IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #46

[CataKil]

I believe RL did take a plea deal in regards to the transfer station and pizza restaurant? I did find it curious that no deal was mentioned in relation to Lafayette and fish shopping? Any thoughts on this? Did he have a driver that day? If he did who?

Yes, he plead guilty to those two charges that were unrelated to the murders. However, in my opinion the other two charges that were part of the plea deal (false informing and obstructing justice) had to do with his alibi. I think LE verified that he lied about where he was that day of the murders and he also must have lied about something else that we don't know about yet...possibly also related to the murders. Obstruction of justice would fit the scenario of one lying, thus interfering with an ongoing investigation. I recalled one of the LE officers publicly stating that there were lies uncovered during their investigation...I have always thought they were referring specifically to R/L's alibi, and perhaps others.

 

[Tricia]

To Our Wonderful Websleuths Posters.

This thread will be closing a bit early tonight. Our apologies but we will open it up early in the morning.

In fact, we will have a brand spankin' new thread for you in the morning.

We'll shut this down in about 30 minutes or so.

Thanks,
Tricia

 

[TheVisual]

Would anyone have info on the blue tennis shoes that were found ( I believe) under the bridge? I mean where can I find the info.

 

[Jax49]

well at the least that clears up two different dates of death for the girls.

That info is the most interesting thing I've seen in weeks, regarding this case. Takes care of many of the rumors that have been making the rounds. moo

 

[otto]

These were kids. And we don't know what he said or did to compel them to go down that hill, assuming they did just that. He may have been talking the entire time, threatening, and making a good case for remaining silent. He may have said 'do as I say and you'll be home for dinner'...we have no idea what that exchange was about once he had them in his control. There may have then been a struggle at the scene once it was clear this was headed in the direction it obviously went.

It just sounds like the girls are being characterized as having an adult ability to do what we would do, as we think about this from afar, as adults. I can buy that they, or at least Libby, fought back. I don't seen any logic in taking them away in a car, or spending time with them in a building, or moving them back to where they were found because it's too labor and time intensive and it would have been taking place in the dark.

I don't think they were walked to that area and immediately killed, but I do think they were taken there, assaulted and then killed, either after the assault, or as a result of it. And some tape or a gag stops the noise of resistance. He took two kids in broad daylight and successfully ended their lives while no one was the wiser or saw a thing (to the best of our knowledge). I'm sure he thought through how to prevent them from drawing attention to his abduction and the subsequent crime activity.

One of the girls tried so hard to leave clues, such as the video and audio clip, and perhaps the footprints. One of the videos posted here shows that the leaves were scraped away going down the hill at the SE end of the bridge. Was that another clue? I can't imagine what she was thinking as time was running out on their lives, both knowing that someone would be looking for them an hour after the abduction, hoping that help would arrive in time.

 

[jillycat]

One of the girls tried so hard to leave clues, such as the video and audio clip, and perhaps the footprints. One of the videos posted here shows that the leaves were scraped away going down the hill at the SE end of the bridge. Was that another clue? I can't imagine what she was thinking as time was running out on their lives, both knowing that someone would be looking for them an hour after the abduction, hoping that help would arrive in time.

I missed the leaves...was that something that could have been done by LE?

 

[gliving]

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...qUXpNVFl3TnpFNU1EUXdPak0xTlRjME1qY3lNR1k9In19

Found for searching for cases by the State's Attorney, who may have been involved in a somewhat related case last year.

Awesome sleuthing Beer!!! Come here, I want to put a gold star on your forehead! :loveyou:

 

[Burnt Toast]

Would anyone have info on the blue tennis shoes that were found ( I believe) under the bridge? I mean where can I find the info.

neither of the girls wore blue tennis shoes that day.

 

[otto]

I know. I just assume the one used to charge/collect taxes would be accurate. :dunno:

The cemetery is 4 acres. Visually compare the 4 acre cemetery with the 2 acre parcel of private property. Does it look like the cemetery is twice as large?

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/Application.aspx?AppID=377&LayerID=5553&PageTypeID=1

 

[otto]

well at the least that clears up two different dates of death for the girls.

When they were pronounced?

 

[Jax49]

When they were pronounced?

From Beer's link:

"Petition to seal the autopsy reports concerning Abigail Williams and Liberty German. The Court, being duly advised, FINDS as follows: 1) On February 13, 2017 Abigail Williams and Liberty German were killed just outside of Delphi in Carroll County, Indiana."

BBM

 

[otto]

I missed the leaves...was that something that could have been done by LE?

When I saw it in the video, I thought someone slid down the hill on her bum.
The videographer seemed surprised by it as well.

 

[otto]

And there we have it ... thanks for a great discussion, and especially for everyone's help with understanding the bigger picture geographically.

 

[jillycat]

When I saw it in the video, I thought someone slid down the hill on her bum.
The videographer seemed surprised by it as well.

Wow, ok, I didn't see that one. I can't keep up with the videos of the area.

 

[expatCanada]

Can't tell visually. Not my sort of thing. lol. IF so, RL is getting screwed on tax assessment values.

The cemetery is 4 acres. Visually compare the 4 acre cemetery with the 2 acre parcel of private property. Does it look like the cemetery is twice as large?

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/Application.aspx?AppID=377&LayerID=5553&PageTypeID=1

 

[Burnt Toast]

When they were pronounced?

here you go.


https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...qUXpNVFl3TnpFNU1EUXdPak0xTlRjME1qY3lNR1k9In19

 

[otto]

Can't tell visually. Not my sort of thing. lol. IF so, RL is getting screwed on tax assessment values.

Not at all. He has 4 acres and is taxed for 2. His win.

 

[MistyWaters]

There were organized searches the night of the 13th. The second post on the scanner thread for case has some of it.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...lliams-Scanner-Thread&p=13258687#post13258687

Thanks for the link. Is it correct it's undetermined exactly what areas were searched later that night? If so, my guess is that only known places were the girls might have accidentally fell or been swept into the river were searched. Not knowing how many organized searchers there were, but I doubt there were enough to search the entire broad area surrounding the trails and bridge.

In hindsight we know where the girls were tragically discovered. But if nobody has declared the exact area was previously searched then it's not a fact that it was. That was sort of my point - that theories involving the bodies not being moved whatsoever, only one crime scene, cannot be rightly discounted for the reason that the area was previously searched. We don't know whether it was or not. In my opinion only one crime scene makes far more sense than a kidnapping of one or both girls with the culprit returning with bodies knowing they'd be quickly found.


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[Tricia]

Hi Everyone,

Abby and Libby's thread is shutting down for the night.

In the morning please click RIGHT HERE for thread #47

Take Care and G'night

Tricia

 

[Steleheart]

The cemetery is 4 acres. Visually compare the 4 acre cemetery with the 2 acre parcel of private property. Does it look like the cemetery is twice as large?

https://beacon.schneidercorp.com/Application.aspx?AppID=377&LayerID=5553&PageTypeID=1

Yes the cemetery lot is 4 acres and the total area is twice the width of the cemetery boundary