IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #63

[margarita25]

Old article from 2004, again nothing earth shattering:

"In 1974, the FBI formed its Behavioral Science Unit to investigate serial rape and homicide cases. From 1976 to 1979, several FBI agents--most famously John Douglas and Robert Ressler--interviewed 36 serial murderers to develop theories and categories of different types of offenders.

Most notably, they developed the idea of the "organized/disorganized dichotomy": Organized crimes are premeditated and carefully planned, so little evidence is found at the scene. Organized criminals, according to the classification scheme, are antisocial but know right from wrong, are not insane and show no remorse. Disorganized crimes, in contrast, are not planned, and criminals leave such evidence as fingerprints and blood. Disorganized criminals may be young, under the influence of alcohol or drugs, or mentally ill.

Over the past quarter-century, the Behavioral Science Unit has further developed the FBI's profiling process--including refining the organized/disorganized dichotomy into a continuum and developing other classification schemes.

"The basic premise is that behavior reflects personality," explains retired FBI agent Gregg McCrary. In a homicide case, for example, FBI agents glean insight into personality through questions about the murderer's behavior at four crime phases:

Antecedent: What fantasy or plan, or both, did the murderer have in place before the act? What triggered the murderer to act some days and not others?

Method and manner: What type of victim or victims did the murderer select? What was the method and manner of murder: shooting, stabbing, strangulation or something else?

Body disposal: Did the murder and body disposal take place all at one scene, or multiple scenes?

Postoffense behavior: Is the murderer trying to inject himself into the investigation by reacting to media reports or contacting investigators?"


Criminal profiling: the reality behind the myth
http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/criminal.aspx

 

[Lilowlet]

Doing some research, here is a basic article for anyone interested (nothing really new I haven't come across before but posting anyway):

Who Murders Children? Psychology Profiles Child Killers
How forensic psychology profiles the suspect.
Posted Sep 04, 2015
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...rs-children-psychology-profiles-child-killers

"Christine Gregoire an Attorney General from Washington State*reports the killers are usually at the initial contact site for legitimate reasons. They either lived in the area or were engaging in some routine. She also reports most child abduction murders are opportunistic. Only in 14 percent of cases was the victim picked out because of some physical characteristic. The initial contact site is*within 1/4 mile of the victim’s last known location in 80 percent*of cases."

This is interesting stuff. I think everyone should take a look at this. Thanks margarita!

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[margarita25]

Alright cool, maybe there's something here at "The Vault":

https://vault.fbi.gov/Criminal Profiling

 

[Lilowlet]

Alright cool, maybe there's something here at "The Vault":

https://vault.fbi.gov/Criminal Profiling

Reading the beginning of part 2, makes me wonder more about BG. I feel like when i read it, he must've read this and planned accordingly, honestly it gave me the creeps. I'm glad you found this.

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[margarita25]

"Behavioral Analysis Unit

The Behavioral Analysis Unit actually consists of three separate units, each with a specialty: counterterrorism/threat assessment, crimes against adults, and crimes against children.

The mission is to provide behavioral-based operational support to federal, state, local, and international law enforcement agencies investigating unusual or repetitive violent crimes, terrorism, and time-sensitive matters such as kidnappings. The expertise of BAU’s agents, analysts, and support staff has helped investigators solve countless violent crimes.

BAU is part of the National Center for the Analysis of Violent Crime (NCAVC), which is managed under the FBI’s Critical Incident Response Group (CIRG)."

https://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/behavioral-interview-program

 

[Beth11311]

Reading the beginning of part 2, makes me wonder more about BG. I feel like when i read it, he must've read this and planned accordingly, honestly it gave me the creeps. I'm glad you found this.

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It says page doesn't exist for me!? Wahhhh


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[margarita25]

Qmfr:

Re: the lack of a profile at this time, I'm confused by this. It would seem to me there might be something of substance other than the usual cookie cutter profile ("might have missed work the next day, increased alcohol or drug usage, has an unusual interest in case, may have changed appearance, bla bla...") which could be gleamed by gaining insight from the crime scene (via COD, MO, etc etc etc...).

Gives the "we want to know who he is" a double meaning....they can't even give a freakin profile as to who they think he is profile-wise. Not dogging LE, just wondering why this guy might be so hard for even them to possibly analyze??

Eta: Do I recall the number of actual FBI profilers in the US are next to none? Maybe I dreamed this but I thought there were only like 6 or something vIa Foxfire...brain has officially gone kaput so sorry if this is imagined misinformation...

Taking a break.

Alright, THIS must be what I remembered our lovely Foxfire talking about:

"Audio Transcript

Mollie Halpern:*Making sense of the incomprehensible. That’s the specialty of the eight agents of the FBI’s Behavioral Analysis Unit-2, or BAU-2. They get inside the twisted minds of serial murderers like Ted Bundy, Jeffrey Dahmer, and John Allen Muhammed. The very names of these notorious killers incite fear and fascination, and their horrific acts attract the attention of the public, the media, and mental health experts.

Mark A Hilts:*The type of cases we get involved in, the serial murder cases, the unusual, the bizarre cases, are the type of cases that most people, the average individual struggles to understand themselves. Why would somebody kill 10 different people over a year’s time period? What kind of person would chop somebody up or would carve something into a victim or would do some other bondage or other type activity? So it’s something that as normal human beings we struggle with, we don’t understand.

Halpern:*I’m Mollie Halpern of the Bureau, and you’re listening to “Inside the FBI.” Coming up, get an inside look at the work of the agents Hollywood calls “profilers,” what it takes to become an agent in the BAU, and how they’re using their expertise in new ways."

Behavioral Analysts
https://www.fbi.gov/audio-repository/news-podcasts-inside-bau-profilers.mp3/view

 

[Lilowlet]

It says page doesn't exist for me!? Wahhhh


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That's odd wonder why? [emoji15]

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[margarita25]

Slightly o/t, but waaay in the early threads, there was discussion about the darkweb, TOR, etc (I had mentioned a likely connection to child *advertiser censored*):

"Audio Transcript

Mollie Halpern:*An international law enforcement operation results in the seizure of the largest criminal marketplace on the Darknet.

I’m Mollie Halpern of the Bureau with FBI, This Week.

AlphaBay sold illegal drugs, malware, and other illicit commodities on the Tor network, which conceals users’ identities and locations."

07.20.2017*—*FBI, This Week: AlphaBay Criminal Marketplace Takedown
https://www.fbi.gov/audio-repository/ftw-podcast-alphabay-takedown-072017.mp3/view

 

[Tinypeeps]

he's probably gone there with his family and his kids. A lot of serial killers find their places to kill in the most mundane ways, like it's an area they have to drive through on their way home that has places that are isolated and potential victims can be found or taken there, places they can have privacy and come back to even after the murder.

these girls would obviously be missed within hours due to their age, so he was fast and cunning, he was aware of the time and knew how much time he had.

if he was scouting for a victim or victims, he came prepared. How did he know he would find a victim that day? had he been lurking for some time? days? hours? OR had he been stalking these girls and knew somehow they would be at that park?



how did he know that " down the hill" would lead to seclusion . ( i sense in depth knowledge of the area)

yes to whoever said they see a control freak in that picture...like a BTK vibe...

he knew there would be an instant and frantic search for these girls...that's part of the pleasure for him.


just things Im thinking of.

It was me who said i got a controlled sk vibe. And yes!! Totally BTK vibe - Green River Killer too. Not a."drifter" type to me at all.

I think he likes what he got. Young teenage girls. Child-women. I think he has probably been controlled and/or abused - psychologically or physically, by full grown women in the past so he gets off by destroying girls he feels powerful with.

How did he know "down the hill" was the isolated place he wanted?? Gosh, great question. I'd have to say he cased the rec area carefully before - maybe just that morning, maybe.more han once, on separate occasions. I think these girls were a stroke of luck - that he had picked out the area to troll in and boom, there they were. If they hadnt come, I think he would have just gone home without a kill, and tried again the next time he could, even hungrier.

 

[margarita25]

Looks like the FBI added a new link on one of their pages in addition to the Wanted Poster page):

07.17.2017*—*Voice of Unknown Subject in Indiana Murder Investigation
https://www.fbi.gov/wanted/seeking-info/unknown-suspect-2/down-the-hill.mp3/view

 

[margarita25]

Old post by Knox re: BAU:

"I believe Sgt. Riley when he says LE will find the person who murdered Liberty & Abby. The pressor was one of the best I've seen, recognized the BAU input right away. Carefully crafted words spoken by LE at that podium today."

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-13-Feb-2017-8/page23&p=13170634#post13170634

(Getting heebie jeebies reading some of the old posts...)

 

[Tinypeeps]

Doing some research, here is a basic article for anyone interested (nothing really new I haven't come across before but posting anyway):

Who Murders Children? Psychology Profiles Child Killers
How forensic psychology profiles the suspect.
Posted Sep 04, 2015
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...rs-children-psychology-profiles-child-killers

Really interesting. Thanks.

 

[margarita25]

Re: the possibe influence of Parabon on the most latest released descriptions and sketch, etc, here's an old article from 2/23:

Carroll County sheriff discusses Delphi murder investigation, says DNA evidence ‘fast-tracked’
http://fox59.com/2017/02/23/carroll...investigation-says-dna-evidence-fast-tracked/

"Leazenby couldn’t address the specific forensics of the case, but he did say investigators were looking at all of the evidence, from statements made by individuals to physical clues. He said there were “several pieces to this huge puzzle.”

Leazenby did say investigators have asked for DNA evidence to be “fast-tracked.”

“I can’t go into the specifics because of the ongoing (investigation), that’s being expedited as best as it can be done,” he said."

Eta: Then there's this from April 13:

Investigators pore over Delphi analysis of evidence
http://www.jconline.com/story/news/...rs-shift-through-analysis-evidence/100347324/

"Police collected a significant amount of evidence from the scene, but police aren't specifically saying what that evidence is. It's*being analyzed, Leazenby said, and Carroll County sheriff's Detective Kevin*Hammond said most of the evidence went to the Indiana State Police lab, but some went to the FBI lab.

“We’ve gotten some (analysis) back, but we can’t really discuss what we’ve gotten back,” Hammond said. “There’s a large amount of stuff to be tested.”"

 

[Beth11311]

Old post by Knox re: BAU:

"I believe Sgt. Riley when he says LE will find the person who murdered Liberty & Abby. The pressor was one of the best I've seen, recognized the BAU input right away. Carefully crafted words spoken by LE at that podium today."

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-13-Feb-2017-8/page23&p=13170634#post13170634

(Getting heebie jeebies reading some of the old posts...)

You're making my night with your posts! This was the case that originally brought me to websleuths and it's been such a roller coaster of emotion - feeling so close to finding BG and then like we will never know the answer. I felt a lot of hope again once they released the sketch...I really hope this one does not go unsolved. Think of the girls often [emoji177]


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[margarita25]

You're making my night with your posts! This was the case that originally brought me to websleuths and it's been such a roller coaster of emotion - feeling so close to finding BG and then like we will never know the answer. I felt a lot of hope again once they released the sketch...I really hope this one does not go unsolved. Think of the girls often [emoji177]


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Bless you...We all want this arrest so badly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[margarita25]

Articles like this give me hope but sadly, it might be something like this which eventually leads to him...gosh please find him before he kills again, like I said before if he hasn't already...

Double child murder cold case finally solved after body of fiancee led police to killer
Kevin Sweat had a secret, and only the discovery of his fiancee's dead body would expose him as the murderer of two young girls years earlier


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/real-life-stories/double-child-murder-cold-case-4648173

 

[Beth11311]

Bless you...We all want this arrest so badly!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That we do...let today be the day!


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[margarita25]

So, going around in circles, beating the same old dead horses, what else can we do as sleuthers other than help get the word out since we do not have all the information that BAU has, here are some possibilities as to how this case can be maybe be solved:

1. Confession (yeah, let's just cross that one off right now).

2. Someone turns him in, either known to him, or less likely, a random sighting.

3. A cold case sitting in a box somewhere gets DNA retested and there's a match...now if it's a cold case you might wonder well how the heck can that help? Well because there might be information in the file as to someone interviewed early on or maybe a POI in that case that could never be proven.

4. DNA is linked in a future case where the suspect is either caught, or there are circumstances similar to #3, a person on the radar in that case is identified as being in the area, matching the sketch, voice or DNA.

5. Some miraculous hit via other investigative techniques in the future that could come to light such as pings, footprint analysis, facial recognition match, surveillance footage, etc etc. Obviously none of that has worked so far.

6. He gets pulled over, random car accident, etc and LE is suspicious for some reason and digs deeper.

What else? There must be more...(please let there be more...)

 

[margarita25]

Man, the trail of bodies this monster has likely left...there's something out there somewhere he's done that we can't find or hasnt been proven....somehow this could be the key...

What is his connection to Delphi and this bridge area??? This is key, imo. (Same old questions and comments, sorry...trying to be as least repetitive as possible, but coming back to these same things...why was he in the area on Feb 13...gah I can't stand this...)

I don't know what we can possibly discuss that hasn't been discussed already...seriously, is there anything about this case that hasn't been discussed??

Eta: The plant still bugs me too, but LE would have that covered to infinity by now....I wonder if they've asked to see every pay check ever written to every employee...maybe the plant has minimal records. Maybe they hit a dead end with aliases, etc, or even locating some people...

I wish they'd release the shoe print information...obviously they haven't gotten a database hit on that assuming they got a clear imprint...

I'm dying to know COD and disposal method/condition of how those poor girls were left were left, understandably they can't release this, but this is a big part of the picture we "armchair detectives" are missing.