IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #83

[heartgoesout]

Both Holeman and Carter said Libby began taking the video because she sensed something was wrong.

If so we just don’t know if it was because they did or didn’t know the man.

I can picture a scenario where she started filming with the intent to now tell someone here’s the guy that’s been following us or we’ve seen before or that is the guy who’s always mean to us or that’s the same guy I saw last week or so on and so on.

 

[Jax49]

I believe they crossed the creek, hard as that is to understand. But, if they didn't cross the creek how did they get to the location where they were found? Back over the bridge, by vehicle, some other route?

 

[No it's not]

I think if they met a creepy lewd talking or flashing man on the path they would be very afraid and startled -
I feel If that happened they would call home to tell someone what happened, turn back to safety and for ask for a ride ASAP -
IMO Weird adult aggression is not taken lightly by teens. I don't think they would continue to slowly walk into a more isolated part of the trail.
IMO the first time they noticed him was when they they first saw him behind them.
And they were so right to be uncomfortable —unfortunately - he meant them terrible harm.

Unless they had decided to walk over the bridge towards Abby's home (less than 1 mile).

ALL IMO

-Nin

 

[Steleheart]

Bumping my own post to link the long interview where Holeman mentions the creek, in case anyone wants to listen. At about the 10 or 11 minute mark.

moo

Thanks Jax. Holeman speaking about the creek is because Alexis asks him the difficulty and what one would have to do to walk to where the bodies were found from the bridge. Holeman simply states that they would of had to cross the creek to get to the other side-that's just an obvious fact. If anything Holeman stresses how very difficult it would be. If someone asked me to describe what someone would encounter taking a certain path does not mean they actually took that path. We cannot take a statement without first knowing the question first. LE has never said the girls crossed the creek. If LE believed they walked all that way, where's all the crime tape? Wouldn't LE consider BG dropped something along the way?

Here I agree. Thankfully we have the transcript of the Holeman interview with Alexis kindly done by our own Spellbound in whch Holeman was entirely noncommittal and never confirmed if they crossed the creek or made it down through the woods;

A: When you walked down and I walked through, that was private property right where the bodies were found. Looking at it logistically from where they were on the bridge and to where their bodies were found, I know we talked about the terrain in the past. I know it's not an easy thing to navigate. Usually you might have to be familiar with the area. I mean, would it have been difficult for the girls to from where they were on the bridge to where they were found?

H: [10:49] Yeah. Absolutely. I think it would be difficult, obviously. They have to go through some pretty steep terrain in a wooded area, sticker bushes and things like that, so it's uh ... and then to cross the creek. The creek, and obviously it's February, it's probably not the warmest . The weather was a warm day that day, but still the water temperature is probably cooler than the air temperature. So yeah, it would have been difficult for .... I mean, I don't think anybody, say on a walk, would walk that way.

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-65&p=13565009#post13565009

 

[mtnlites]

Unless they had decided to walk over the bridge towards Abby's home (less than 1 mile).

ALL IMO

-Nin

I think I've mentioned this before...Although technically possible, when looking at a map, I have trouble seeing them attempt this. The terrain is rough and mucky in places and there are quite a few fences that they would've had to climb over, go around, etc. My aunt lived closer to the park than Abby and I never would've attempted the walk. Even if they were running, it would've made more logical sense to attempt reaching a different location.

 

[Shiressleuth]

So where was DTH leading to if they did not cross the creek?

 

[Steleheart]

So where was DTH leading to if they did not cross the creek?

The north end of the bridge has a steep hill next to it that leads through the wooded area over to RL's property. There was a video where a reporter went down there showing how difficult it was to get to where they were found. If I can find his video I will post it. But the bridge being in excess of 60 feet above the creek or land, DTH can refer to either end IMHO.

EDIT: The easiest way to cross the creek in a cold water setting is back across the way they came. While GH's videos give an accurate location where BG was captured on video, we have no time stamp for that vid, nor do we have a time stamp for the DTH audio. There could be any number of minutes between those events. There is nothing to say they did not cross back and him follow them to the north end.
JMHO

 

[No it's not]

I think I've mentioned this before...Although technically possible, when looking at a map, I have trouble seeing them attempt this. The terrain is rough and mucky in places and there are quite a few fences that they would've had to climb over, go around, etc. My aunt lived closer to the park than Abby and I never would've attempted the walk. Even if they were running, it would've made more logical sense to attempt reaching a different location.

There are fences on N 625 W ? Thanks.

-Nin

 

[Jethro4WS]

I think I've mentioned this before...Although technically possible, when looking at a map, I have trouble seeing them attempt this. The terrain is rough and mucky in places and there are quite a few fences that they would've had to climb over, go around, etc. My aunt lived closer to the park than Abby and I never would've attempted the walk. Even if they were running, it would've made more logical sense to attempt reaching a different location.

They could simply follow the road. Easiest path.

 

[Jethro4WS]

The north end of the bridge has a steep hill next to it that leads through the wooded area over to RL's property. There was a video where a reporter went down there showing how difficult it was to get to where they were found. If I can find his video I will post it. But the bridge being in excess of 60 feet above the creek or land, DTH can refer to either end IMHO.

EDIT: The easiest way to cross the creek in a cold water setting is back across the way they came. While GH's videos give an accurate location where BG was captured on video, we have no time stamp for that vid, nor do we have a time stamp for the DTH audio. There could be any number of minutes between those events. There is nothing to say they did not cross back and him follow them to the north end.
JMHO

I think the only thing we have time-wise is that on the nationwide billboards when the image of BG was shown it also said last seen 2:30pm (I imagine an approximate time was used but it would be known to LE to the second.)

 

[BIC]

Here I agree. Thankfully we have the transcript of the Holeman interview with Alexis kindly done by our own Spellbound in whch Holeman was entirely noncommittal and never confirmed if they crossed the creek or made it down through the woods;


https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-65&p=13565009#post13565009

Why does he mention crossing the creek in your mind? Why does he mention the temperature of the creek? To me its cut and dry. I can’t see any other explanation for what he said. IMO

 

[SkipperKey3]

GH does have more recent (12-17) video with animated figures showing the logistics at the end of the bridge...it's long, and I felt sad and troubled after watching. However, I think it makes sense of a possible scenario. I have the link ready to paste and will try to put it up now on media thread...I've not posted that way previously and could mess up on technology...(this in reply to post #675)

I watched it. Question - I noticed on the end of the bridge that there is a rope and what looks to be "no trespassing" signs. Also GH mentions that they would have been trapped. So what would they have normally done, had BG not been there? Simply turn around when they reached the end of the bridge and returned back over the bridge the way they had come? Or would they have continued on since at least one of the girls was familiar with the area beyond the bridge?

 

[Steleheart]

I think the only thing we have time-wise is that on the nationwide billboards when the image of BG was shown it also said last seen 2:30pm (I imagine an approximate time was used but it would be known to LE to the second.)

Agreed. Most of the billboards we have seen have no time given but this particular one says 2:30

https://lintvwane.files.wordpress.com/2017/02/img_03481.jpg?w=516

 

[Jax49]

I watched it. Question - I noticed on the end of the bridge that there is a rope and what looks to be "no trespassing" signs. Also GH mentions that they would have been trapped. So what would they have normally done, had BG not been there? Simply turn around when they reached the end of the bridge and returned back over the bridge the way they had come? Or would they have continued on since at least one of the girls was familiar with the area beyond the bridge?

They were to be picked up at the same place they were dropped off so they would have turned around and gone back across the bridge.

moo

 

[heartgoesout]

So where was DTH leading to if they did not cross the creek?

Exactly. We don’t even know at what point this was said.

 

[SkipperKey3]

They were to be picked up at the same place they were dropped off so they would have turned around and gone back across the bridge.

moo

Thanks. Makes sense.

 

[Steleheart]

Why does he mention crossing the creek in your mind? Why does he mention the temperature of the creek? To me its cut and dry. I can’t see any other explanation for what he said. IMO

IMO simply because Alexis asked about the terrain and the only other alternative is across the water. He was noncommittal either way "to me"

A: When you walked down and I walked through, that was private property right where the bodies were found. Looking at it logistically from where they were on the bridge and to where their bodies were found, I know we talked about the terrain in the past. I know it's not an easy thing to navigate...

.
https://www.websleuths.com/forums/s...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-65&p=13565009#post13565009

I just don't see anything definite in his response. Cleverly holding his cards close.

JMO

 

[Jethro4WS]

I watched it. Question - I noticed on the end of the bridge that there is a rope and what looks to be "no trespassing" signs. Also GH mentions that they would have been trapped. So what would they have normally done, had BG not been there? Simply turn around when they reached the end of the bridge and returned back over the bridge the way they had come? Or would they have continued on since at least one of the girls was familiar with the area beyond the bridge?

That "rope" I believe is a wire fence that the No Trespassing sign is on. However, there are media photos from the Daily Mail that show that end of the bridge and there is no fence there at the time. Thus, the fence was put up after the murders had occurred.

 

[Try2solve]

So where was DTH leading to if they did not cross the creek?

We don't know if DTH was directed at the girls. We also don't know at what point during the crime DTH was said.

 

[Boxer]

https://www.theindychannel.com/news...-bodies-found-as-missing-carroll-county-teens


Following a set of footprints led to the discovery of their bodies article 2/15/2017.

I have always wondered. Followed "a set" meaning one set of footprints?
IMO there are some questions that come to mind about there being " a set."

Was that set of footprints made by BG as he left the CS, or was it a set going toward the CS?