IN - Amanda Blackburn, 28, pregnant, murdered, Indianapolis, 10 Nov 2015 - #3

[MaxManning]

They wouldn't stand out. It's a working class area but surrounded by shady ones.

I'm looking on google streetview, and I respectfully disagree based on going up rockwood and observing large houses and nice cars and lawns. But there could be areas off of that road that are as you say.

 

[FlyerFan28]

I'm looking on google streetview, and I respectfully disagree based on going up rockwood and observing large houses and nice cars and lawns. But there could be areas off of that road that are as you say.

Okay. Have a nice Thanksgiving.

 

[MaxManning]

I guess you are right though, if there are indeed neighboring areas , it might be very common for them to walk through and not be conspicuous. Good point.

 

[fizzypop]

Regarding the house that had them get through even a dead bolt... it's not very hard. Many dead bolts are so easy to kick in. I'm trying to find it, my LE instructor has a video online where he kicks in a door locked by a dead bolt in literally 1 try. It's all about a high security strike plate with 3 inch screws so you go into the stud not just the door jamb which can be a 1/2 piece of wood. He installed on and tried to kick it in again and was unsuccessful after 5 tries, at which point most burglars would give up and move on.

This is just a semi related safety tip for you. They are like 5 dollars and very easy to install, you can find videos on YouTube. They are a huge help in securing doors to the fullest.

 

[MaxManning]

So leaving by bus or via ride ? I'd say ride , but location is soooo close to a bus stop. So I'd want to check those cameras if they exist, you could get lucky.

 

[MaxManning]

They wouldn't stand out. It's a working class area but surrounded by shady ones.

Yeah, i did streetview even just a few streets away and there is gang grafitti on fences etc. You are definitely right.

 

[sumbunny]

Get lucky with what though? They already have the perps? What are you looking for?

 

[MaxManning]

Get lucky with what though? They already have the perps? What are you looking for?

Better images with their faces etc. Yes, they have alot of evidence already, but I think knowing where they got off might also lead to more evidence and others involved ?

 

[sumbunny]

I'd hope DNA trumps pictures. I'm upset that only two are being formally charged currently.

I'm positive others will be charged sooner than later. The two that are charged have lawyered up and will soon realize that spilling the beans on everything may help their case.

 

[MaxManning]

At this point , I think the cell phone tracking data is the most damning. But that just means the phone, it doesn't mean the person conclusively. So would be nice to have one image that is in the location of a phone that is one of these individuals or all conclusively. That's just my opinion.

 

[MaxManning]

I'd hope DNA trumps pictures. I'm upset that only two are being formally charged currently.

I'm positive others will be charged sooner than later. The two that are charged have lawyered up and will soon realize that spilling the beans on everything may help their case.

I think the only DNA we have heard about is on the sweater. I haven't heard anything about DNA or print matches from car/houses etc.

But regardless, if you are presenting a case to the jury, having a full accounting of A-Z that night only strengthens the case. I'd be surprised if they haven't done exactly what we are asking about right now.

 

[sumbunny]

I would love to understand why two are only charged? Clearly several were involved. Are they just roaming the streets?

 

[Ontario Mom]

Nope. What's not adding up? Let's figure it out.

Well without the actual numbers being associated to individuals I don't really have a clear picture to straighten out part of it. In any case, I had to see all this on the map in the order it took place so...

From the PC statement, bessie's fantastic timeline and google maps:

1. Gordon, Taylor and Watson leave ABull's apartment at Brendon Way Dr. (The Cottages) around 3:30 am (according to ABull's gf)
2. First burglary at 4:30 at 5700 San Clemente (literally down the street from ABull's apartment - so either the gf was lying/mistaken on the time the 3 left or they were unaccounted for, for an hour before the first burglary)
3. At 5:36 on Sunnyfield Ct. the interior video picks up a subject who disables the system.
4. At 6:25 the phone pings off a tower at Sunnyfield Ct.
5. At 6:39 the phone is at N. Mighigan Rd. (failed ATM)
6. At 6:54 the phone is at W. 86th Street (successful ATM)
7. At 7:10 a neighbor on Sunmeadow Way sees a black male (Taylor) wearing a hoody walking on Sunmeadow Way. Male was walking east. Chrysler Sebring drives east, stopped and black male gets in front passenger seat. Car backs into a drive and drives west. (All captured on home video)
8. Unknown time: Taylor dropped off near 56th and Guion with the *stolen property and a bag over his shoulder. (do a google street view of this location)
9. On 11/11 the Sebring was located at 3800 Rookwood Ave. Concerned citizen tells LE the car appeared there sometime between 7:30 and 8:35am on 11/10.
10. Watson and Gordan claim to have left the car there.
11. All 3 "eventually" end up back at ABull's house on Brendan Way Dr.

*stolen property from the PC statement:

Burglary #1: cell phone, Apple Macbook laptop, purse, keys, Chrysler Sebring.
Burglary #2: 4 televisions, MacBook Pro, pearl necklace, pink sweater, bag of oranges, bed sheets
Burglary #3 (AB's house): Chase debit card, MacBook Pro, in a blue book bag with 2 books inside



Either, they unloaded the stolen property with assistance at the location "near" 56th and Guion, or they had someone pick them up on Lookwood and transferred it to that vehicle. No one walked away from that vehicle carrying all of that stolen property. The part I was trying to sort out, was WHO was calling who, and at what time, and in accordance with which locations.

 

[MaxManning]

What part of it do you see as not adding up ?

What might be a theory for why they'd not want to account for the hour before the san clemente burglary ?

 

[Ontario Mom]

What part of it do you see as not adding up ?

What might be a theory for why they'd not want to account for the hour before the san clemente robbery ?

The problem (for me) is that without knowing who's phone was calling who else's phone, it doesn't really make sense to even speculate. That 3:30/4:30 discrepancy I think, is just ABull's gf not giving the correct time. What does strike me as odd though, is the amount of travel that morning. The first burglary was so close to ABull's house they could have all walked there in two minutes, in their sleep. They leave there and for some bizarre reason head to Sunnyfield Ct. 10 miles away. I just want one of those creeps to explain why THERE. What made them head to that specific area?

Then there are the 2 ATM attempts. Both at Chase Bank ATMs. Oddly enough, there is a Chase branch much closer to the house on Sunnyfield than either of the branches they tried. Maybe they headed that direction in search of a Chase branch because it was the direction to head back to ABull's and they really were going to leave Taylor behind.

Then dropping Taylor off at 56 & Guion. That's a good haul to make it back to ABull's house without a car.

Just a lot of questions really that the PC doesn't answer.

 

[bessie]

Well without the actual numbers being associated to individuals I don't really have a clear picture to straighten out part of it. In any case, I had to see all this on the map in the order it took place so...

From the PC statement, bessie's fantastic timeline and google maps:

1. Gordon, Taylor and Watson leave ABull's apartment at Brendon Way Dr. (The Cottages) around 3:30 am (according to ABull's gf)
2. First burglary at 4:30 at 5700 San Clemente (literally down the street from ABull's apartment - so either the gf was lying/mistaken on the time the 3 left or they were unaccounted for, for an hour before the first burglary)
3. At 5:36 on Sunnyfield Ct. the interior video picks up a subject who disables the system.
4. At 6:25 the phone pings off a tower at Sunnyfield Ct.
5. At 6:39 the phone is at N. Mighigan Rd. (failed ATM)
6. At 6:54 the phone is at W. 86th Street (successful ATM)
7. At 7:10 a neighbor on Sunmeadow Way sees a black male (Taylor) wearing a hoody walking on Sunmeadow Way. Male was walking east. Chrysler Sebring drives east, stopped and black male gets in front passenger seat. Car backs into a drive and drives west. (All captured on home video)
8. Unknown time: Taylor dropped off near 56th and Guion with the *stolen property and a bag over his shoulder. (do a google street view of this location)
9. On 11/11 the Sebring was located at 3800 Rookwood Ave. Concerned citizen tells LE the car appeared there sometime between 7:30 and 8:35am on 11/10.
10. Watson and Gordan claim to have left the car there.
11. All 3 "eventually" end up back at ABull's house on Brendan Way Dr.

*stolen property from the PC statement:

Burglary #1: cell phone, Apple Macbook laptop, purse, keys, Chrysler Sebring.
Burglary #2: 4 televisions, MacBook Pro, pearl necklace, pink sweater, bag of oranges, bed sheets
Burglary #3 (AB's house): Chase debit card, MacBook Pro, in a blue book bag with 2 books inside

Either, they unloaded the stolen property with assistance at the location "near" 56th and Guion, or they had someone pick them up on Lookwood and transferred it to that vehicle. No one walked away from that vehicle carrying all of that stolen property.

the phone numbers are tricky, but by reading through the affidavit I was able to piece it together. It's like a logic puzzle. lol

There's another option. It's very hard to ignore that dark-colored SUV, even though I said I would for now. If we go back to the first presser, it was stated that the SUV was seen driving quickly down the street, leaving the area around 6:00 A.M. So if we plug it into the timeline it looks like this:

5:36 - suspects are on video inside the first SuCo home.

6:01 - SUV is driving away - captured on video

6:25 - suspects enter AB's house - no video Time is approximate based on phone records.

We know DG's phone placed five calls to the same phone between 4:40 and 6:54. So they were communicating with someone during the whole ordeal. That phone didn't leave the area of the cottages, but that doesn't mean someone wasn't communicating with another someone. lol

Bottom line, my theory is that the person with whom they were communicating dispatched another individual with a dark SUV to meet them at the neighbor's house, and pick up the televisions. The CI is afraid to drop a dime on that someone. So he didn't mention the SUV to the detective. Instead, he lied and said that they loaded everything into the Sebring, and when they dropped off Taylor, Taylor took the stolen property with him. I think that after the SUV left, they hung around drinking wine and beer, and picked up the smaller items, i.e., laptop, sweater, Tiffany bracelet, etc., and put those items in the Sebring. The part about Taylor carrying off a bag over his shoulder might be true.

There's no way they fit four televisions into that small car. And there's no way they allowed Taylor to take the televisions. The problem now, imo, is that until someone talks, LE can't ID the SUV. Even if they have an idea who owns it, they don't have evidence to prove it.

JMO

 

[bessie]

The problem (for me) is that without knowing who's phone was calling who else's phone, it doesn't really make sense to even speculate. That 3:30/4:30 discrepancy I think, is just ABull's gf not giving the correct time. What does strike me as odd though, is the amount of travel that morning. The first burglary was so close to ABull's house they could have all walked there in two minutes, in their sleep. They leave there and for some bizarre reason head to Sunnyfield Ct. 10 miles away. I just want one of those creeps to explain why THERE. What made them head to that specific area?

Then there are the 2 ATM attempts. Both at Chase Bank ATMs. Oddly enough, there is a Chase branch much closer to the house on Sunnyfield than either of the branches they tried. Maybe they headed that direction in search of a Chase branch because it was the direction to head back to ABull's and they really were going to leave Taylor behind.

Then dropping Taylor off at 56 & Guion. That's a good haul to make it back to ABull's house without a car.

Just a lot of questions really that the PC doesn't answer.

They were going to drop off Taylor. They turned north off of 38th onto Kessler. The first subdivision on the right is the addition. IMO, the CI might have been telling the truth when he said they wanted more money after the first burglary. So they're driving along, and decide to scout out AB's neighborhood. The turn right onto the first street, and veer around to the cul de sac.

 

[Ontario Mom]

the phone numbers are tricky, but by reading through the affidavit I was able to piece it together. It's like a logic puzzle. lol

There's another option. It's very hard to ignore that dark-colored SUV, even though I said I would for now. If we go back to the first presser, it was stated that the SUV was seen driving quickly down the street, leaving the area around 6:00 A.M. So if we plug it into the timeline it looks like this:

5:36 - suspects are on video inside the first SuCo home.

6:01 - SUV is driving away - captured on video

6:25 - suspects enter AB's house - no video Time is approximate based on phone records.

We know DG's phone placed five calls to the same phone between 4:40 and 6:54. So they were communicating with someone during the whole ordeal. That phone didn't leave the area of the cottages, but that doesn't mean someone wasn't communicating with another someone. lol

Bottom line, my theory is that the person with whom they were communicating dispatched another individual with a dark SUV to meet them at the neighbor's house, and pick up the televisions. The CI is afraid to drop a dime on that someone. So he didn't mention the SUV to the detective. Instead, he lied and said that they loaded everything into the Sebring, and when they dropped off Taylor, Taylor took the stolen property with him. I think that after the SUV left, they hung around drinking wine and beer, and picked up the smaller items, i.e., laptop, sweater, Tiffany bracelet, etc., and put those items in the Sebring. The part about Taylor carrying off a bag over his shoulder might be true.

There's no way they fit four televisions into that small car. And there's no way they allowed Taylor to take the televisions. The problem now, imo, is that until someone talks, LE can't ID the SUV. Even if they have an idea who owns it, they don't have evidence to prove it.

JMO

That really does answer a few things and lines up with what I didn't post about the 5-times called person. And it really makes NO sense he's not been charged with anything. I'm not at all convinced they ever went to 56th & Guion, though. Only because Taylor told LE that he did. If he actually did though, that bag was probably the bag from the Blackburn home with the laptop and 2 books in it.

 

[Ontario Mom]

They were going to drop off Taylor. They turned north off of 38th onto Kessler. The first subdivision on the right is the addition. IMO, the CI might have been telling the truth when he said they wanted more money after the first burglary. So they're driving along, and decide to scout out AB's neighborhood. The turn right onto the first street, and veer around to the cul de sac.

Maybe, but it would make more sense for them to have headed west on Kessler Blvd. E, to "Cheese's" place near 56th & Guion. It's a faster route than to head south to 38. Then again we're talking logic, and I've met hammers smarter than these tools.

 

[borndem]

I included in one of my previous posts that they "wanted more money".

I think your ideas are all highly plausible. I'm merely pointing out a very logical and simple explanation for why they ended up in that particular neighborhood.

CI stated that after the first burglary they wanted more money.

Taylor stated that he "possibly" rode in a silver car to go see Cheese around 56th and Guion Rd.
Taylor states that he "possibly" stopped off at Sunnyfield Ct.
Taylor only remembers (<--don't believe this for a second) being dropped off around Cheese's place.

CI stated that when they left the addition after the crimes, they dropped off Taylor at 56th and Guion Rd.

Connect the dots and it makes sense that they left San Clemente headed toward 56th and Guion to drop off Taylor. Along the way, they decided that they "wanted more money", and discussed hitting another house. So where do they end up? In the vicinity of their intended destination, or a mere three miles away. JMO

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/San...bf12e4b01875!2m2!1d-86.207191!2d39.826914!3e0

Agreed. They looked around, saw a nice development, and said, "Why not?" And I don't think for a minute anything was planned. One of them may have driven down Sunnyfield, just looking, casing, maybe, and said it was a "rich" neighborhood, or the like. So they tried it.

Just pure dumb luck. These guys weren't smart-- no planning, no targeting, etc. - IMO - they just had a ride of incredible dumb luck -- until it ran out. Grrrrr.