IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #8

[Mommazz4]

*mega eyeroll* GMAFB!

WTF??? So blaming the poor baby who lost her life, I truly am shocked

 

[Snoods]

We just boarded Liberty of the Seas for a week long cruise out of Galveston and the first thing I did was look out the 11th floor windows (which you could CLEARLY tell we’re open or closed) and I literally get sick to my stomach.

Not that anyone needed to confirmation of any of that but geez, it really puts it in perspective when you see it first hand.

I think the family and defense attorneys sweated it out until the last possible moment, hoping RCCL would fold and cough up some money. When RCCL called their bluff, they had to cave.

The LAST thing defense would have wanted was a jury field trip to the ship to view the open window for themselves. If it was so obviously open in pictures, imagine if you were actually there leaning your body out the window, feeling the ocean breeze, hearing the ocean, and not smashing your head into a window. Defense took that off the table with a request for a bench trial, but still couldn’t get RCCL to call Uncle. Chloe’s death has become a game of strategy for maximum payout.

 

[LietKynes]

OR HE DIDN'T WANT TO MIX A SEDATIVE WITH SAY...ALCHOHOL????

But...but... SA's lawyer said from the beginning of this 'negligent homicide' that SA was charged with that SA was not a drinker !!!!
PR courts have it right as they don't believe this was an accident.

And that article in the Wiegand's hometown FB page is disgusting.
This was "all HER fault"; according to that city.
She probably asked in her very adult voice (combined with foodie and fashionista) to be picked up and held at an arm's length and dangled out of that window.

I'm angry for Chloe's sake.
This baby did nothing to merit her death ; up to and including 'asking to be picked up' or wandering around on the deck.

 

[LietKynes]

I think the family and defense attorneys sweated it out until the last possible moment, hoping RCCL would fold and cough up some money. When RCCL called their bluff, they had to cave.

The LAST thing defense would have wanted was a jury field trip to the ship to view the open window for themselves. If it was so obviously open in pictures, imagine if you were actually there leaning your body out the window, feeling the ocean breeze, hearing the ocean, and not smashing your head into a window. Defense took that off the table with a request for a bench trial, but still couldn’t get RCCL to call Uncle. Chloe’s death has become a game of strategy for maximum payout.

bbm
Ita.
Of course it has.

And no one had any idea that her death in port would yield an unlimited amount to sue for -- as opposed to a death out at sea.
No one.

 

[Safetybug]

yes I cannot believe there are people who support this family, and this quote almost seems as though little Chloe was the cause.

So very angry how the death of this little innocent child has been played out by her family. It is as though this was a script. I will forever feel that SA, and perhaps another family member, knew the outcome of the script. Why did SA walk over to the open window and stare down at the dock before picking up Chloe. That is the one part in all this that makes me feel it was no accident. He knew the window was open, he walked right over to it after he got up from squatting.

If SA walked to the window without leaning over, and picked Chloe up as soon as he got to the window, maybe then I might feel it was an accident, but those few seconds checking out the dock, why!!! He then picks up Chloe so fast and puts her in front of the very open window he just leaned out of! He knew what the outcome would be. IMO

And the family continues to protect SA, and even has friends writing letters saying what a good grandpa SA is. So sad, so angry!

From what you say here, along with what
@HRH Phoebe Cat and @RoadToSerfdom commented on tonight,

IMO...Why leave that splash pad ? that would have held any kids attention endlessly! I can’t help but think he planted the idea in her head. And it’s like it’s again reaffirmed while he squats with her at the pole halfway to the windows. I’m sure she needed a lot of convincing to pick boring windows over a colorful splash pad. So off they go - and I think how surprised and confused she must have felt that there was no “hockey rink” no action and no big brother to cheer ... and no glass to go slappety-slap. All that topped off with the one-handed loosey goosey grip on her (despite all those 2 handed pictures paraded on the internet)

And then the final curtain call pierces my heart to the core...

I cannot escape her her fixation of the movie Frozen (that she watches 3 times a day where we can see on an old video clip) where she dressed like a princess- twirling & singing “Let it Go!”

... and then SA ...LETS HER GO.

& admittedly watches her fall the entire 150 ft

My heart is broken

 

[Snoods]

Something I find incredible telling is SA’s refusal to be sedated. KSW and Chloe’s paternal grandmother accepted sedatives.... why not SA, who was allegedly so distraught he sobbed whenever anyone approached him to ask questions??(acting again?) IMO, SA likely knew a sedative would relax him such a point he might actually divulge the truth of what happened.

What I find particularly telling is the doctor said SA cried ONLY when someone questioned him about what happened. The rest of the time he was A-okay.

It makes me think of a person in a police interrogation room who is distraught while being questioned by police, but when police leave the room they are doing handstands or singing.

 

[HRH Phoebe Cat]

@Snoods ,

IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #8

Thanks, @JerseySleuth17 for the original post and @max99 ‘s emphasis.

Sums it up quite well...JMHO of course.

 

[sl222]

He was treated with kid gloves from the start. In their first interview the parents said SA cried / got very upset every time the subject came up. It sounded like they couldn't ask him any questions without him dissolving into sobs. That never really sat well with me. It seems like one way to avoid answering for your actions. The more upset you are, the more people feel sorry for you.

In the airport when all the press was there taking video of his arrival (when he first returned to the US after what happened), he was very glum and at one point he speaks to his wife, and she has an exasperated expression while talking to him. In my head (not reality, just MOO), I got the impression of him saying something like he's the most hated man in America or something along the lines of feeling sorry for himself, and his wife trying to talk sense into him or offer some encouragement but at the same time getting to the end of her rope with him. Who knows but I know one thing; under the circumstances I would prefer to have to only deal with the loss of Chloe and not also have to take care of the feelings of the person who inexplicably and recklessly sent their precious child/grandchild to her death in an 11 story fall that was utterly needless.

There are 3 sets of grandparents. SA and wife, KW's father and his wife, and AW's parents. The other grandparents have been right not to add their voices to this media circus. It's not the world's business what they think but I'm sure they don't all think that SA is on the level. It's not their place to tell KW and AW what to do here. All they can do is the best they can.

Soon this case will come to an end and I hope things will go well for CW's brother.

 

[In vino veritas]

@Snoods ,

IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #8

Thanks, @JerseySleuth17 for the original post and @max99 ‘s emphasis.

Sums it up quite well...JMHO of course.

Whoa! I just looked at the video of SA at the airport after Chloe’s death. Hadn’t seen it previously. Does NOT look like a man broken by a horrible tragedy in which he was a major player. I just don’t know what to think.
I have to believe if PR prosecutors suspected intent on SA’s part, even without proof of intent, a plea deal would never have been an option.

 

[HRH Phoebe Cat]

Apologies for some dark humor here but is anyone else thinking at times of the field day/treasure trove/whatever a psychology student writing a dissertation in the future could have with just SA and KSW alone?

My late stepmother (a very sharp and witty woman) would have said something along the lines of “you are going to need another roll of (yellow) crime scene tape” on the ship. A feisty 5’0” and 100 lbs, if he had hurt one of her babies, she would have thrown his obese rear end out of the window. The good citizens and LE would not have been bothered dealing with his sorry rear end.

 

[they'll get you]

We just boarded Liberty of the Seas for a week long cruise out of Galveston and the first thing I did was look out the 11th floor windows (which you could CLEARLY tell we’re open or closed) and I literally get sick to my stomach.

Not that anyone needed to confirmation of any of that but geez, it really puts it in perspective when you see it first hand.

Do ya think the window is open?
Look at this woman’s ponytail !!

I agree with you MommyStephV.



I also saw a man standing on a deck chair looking out and I took the opportunity to (friendly) suggest it was a bit dangerous. He smiled and then stepped off.
The window sill was at his waistline.

 

[they'll get you]

Chloe wanted to be lifted up.

What a child wants and gets are two different things.
The word ‘NO!’ is regularly heard from a good parent’s mouth.

 

[neesaki]

Can my skin burn anymore?!?
From South Bend Tribune Facebook page (Feb 26) in the article entitled: “Grandfather of Granger toddler killed in cruise ship fall will plead guilty”... here is just one (of several) bizarre comments from one of the fervent supporters of the family - who initially protested how innocent SA is, finally conceded with... “it was a stupid mistake she was Probably bothering him wanting him to hold her out the window so as a good grandpa he did it just turned out horribly different”

Chloe was “bothering” him? And it just turned out “horribly different”?! Oh my god.... I really have no words. Ya know, I’m sure there’s a place for clueless people like this. Maybe we should let them find out where that is, all on there own. And be careful to keep our distance.

 

[neesaki]

Apologies for some dark humor here but is anyone else thinking at times of the field day/treasure trove/whatever a psychology student writing a dissertation in the future could have with just SA and KSW alone?

My late stepmother (a very sharp and witty woman) would have said something along the lines of “you are going to need another roll of (yellow) crime scene tape” on the ship. A feisty 5’0” and 100 lbs, if he had hurt one of her babies, she would have thrown his obese rear end out of the window. The good citizens and LE would not have been bothered dealing with his sorry rear end.

I think I might have liked to have your late stepmother for a mother , HRHPhoebe.

 

[Snoods]

Anyone could throw someone over the railing which is only chest high. So I guess that could be a safety issue, but most people know not to do that. So if the windows are not safe, what about the railings. These were four or five ships, all different cruise lines. Do we punish everyone for the actions of a few?

BBM RSBM Wholeheartedly agree, but I must make a slight correction. “Do we punish everyone for the actions of a one?”

 

[Snoods]

Chloe was “bothering” him? And it just turned out “horribly different”?! Oh my god.... I really have no words. Ya know, I’m sure there’s a place for clueless people like this. Maybe we should let them find out where that is, all on there own. And be careful to keep our distance.

I just don’t get it and I’m glad I don’t. Horribly different was Coca Cola’s “New Coke.” Blarf.

I would go all Yosemite Sam with guns blazing on the person who dropped my child out a window. Everyone grieves differently, but this family and their supporters are displaying a whole new “horribly different” type of grieving.

 

[Mommazz4]

But...but... SA's lawyer said from the beginning of this 'negligent homicide' that SA was charged with that SA was not a drinker !!!!
PR courts have it right as they don't believe this was an accident.

And that article in the Wiegand's hometown FB page is disgusting.
This was "all HER fault"; according to that city.
She probably asked in her very adult voice (combined with foodie and fashionista) to be picked up and held at an arm's length and dangled out of that window.

I'm angry for Chloe's sake.
This baby did nothing to merit her death ; up to and including 'asking to be picked up' or wandering around on the deck.

Wow can that attorney explain why would a non drinker be advised to not take a breathalyzer test????
And I agree with you completely regarding the sentiments posted on the Southbend Tribune Facebook. They are utterly mindblowing, oh the poor man. Poor SA, how he must suffer. To blame chloe just made me sick. Somehow this beautiful girls tragic death is just not in the forefront as it should be.

 

[Bethan]

Wow can that attorney explain why would a non drinker be advised to not take a breathalyzer test????
And I agree with you completely regarding the sentiments posted on the Southbend Tribune Facebook. They are utterly mindblowing, oh the poor man. Poor SA, how he must suffer. To blame chloe just made me sick. Somehow this beautiful girls tragic death is just not in the forefront as it should be.

Always found the quote “Sam is not a drinker” odd & deliberately vague.

Does it mean

“Sam is teetotal & therefore had not been drinking”

“ Sam is not an alcoholic”

“Sam is not a big drinker”

“ Sam was not drunk”

“Sam is not a drinker” is pretty meaningless to me personally.

I think from his refusal to be tested, it’s pretty obvious to me that

“Sam had consumed some alcohol”

but we’ll probably never know the answer to that question.

Personally I’m amazed that he could get away with refusing a breathalyser or blood test, following a fatal accident. I doubt that would have happened here in the UK.

ETA Had SA been completely teetotal I would have thought he’d have fully cooperated & provided a sample....just to prove that he was sober.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

Something I find incredible telling is SA’s refusal to be sedated. KSW and Chloe’s paternal grandmother accepted sedatives.... why not SA, who was allegedly so distraught he sobbed whenever anyone approached him to ask questions??(acting again?) IMO, SA likely knew a sedative would relax him such a point he might actually divulge the truth of what happened.

He didn’t need a sedative. He was sedated from alcohol and/or drug combination. That’s why his tears flowed on board. But couldn’t fake the tears on camera.

 

[Safetybug]

He is not a drinker
I wasn’t drinking

Agreed ~ regarding how could it be that no breathalyzer or blood test was done? Shouldn’t it have been imperative especially with a dead body to account for?

It’s unnerving how the parents were in such high-gear professionally esp those first hours. Oh, our dearest poppy Sammy just isn’t a drinker! (my twist on their words) And since they are themselves LE/lawyer magically the mantras about drinking are like a get-out-of-jail-free card. Especially when they know all the tricks and loopholes of the biz. Any other joker would have been locked up and processed thoroughly ruling out every possibility.

Oh wait, NO ONE has ever tossed a kid out a cruise ship window! So this should have been the ultimate case-study. But wait, in steps lawyer step-daughter and officer step-son-in-law. Serpentine to the left serpentine to the right. Then under the radar off to the airport undetected. Surreal. So no breathalyzer, no blood test, no autopsy. Tracks covered. Phew! Lights, camera, action! on with the media circuit (circus) and putting the squeeze on RCCL with one spin after another.

Yes, it will definitely be interesting to hear from a Websleuther who is in the legal field to expound on the meaning of ...not a “drinker” / wasn't ”drinking” Does it mean only one drink? with a few hours in between? Wasn’t ”feeling” buzzed?

I seriously doubt it means teetotaler. The smoke and mirrors worked for a spell until they suddenly slinked back to the mainland and now it’s too late for tests. Has he been in AA? Did his prior marriage hit the crapper over alcohol related issues? Has he been to rehab? All this gets a free pass simply because his step-inlaws are deemed credible due to their professional standing. Just take ”our” word for it... Not.a.drinker. We say it’s so - makes it so. Skip tests. Skip autopsy.

Not sure how that wasn’t mandated by authorities other than the family sure played the “accident” card for all it was worth.

SA & entourage had to have known this would have all come out in the bench trial. Oh to have to have been a fly on the wall and see what last-minute evidence was revealed that caused SA to abandon his innocence plea. Sign & sail records? Cameras from other places leading up to the splash pad arrival? A witness at the dock seeing her held out the window? Whatever it was, had to be HUGE for SA to jump on a guilty plea like his head was on fire running to water.

And just like that- no more family press conferences either. No more Q & A sessions. Crickets. This sure has put a monkey wrench in their money grabbing. And have been their own stumbling block to grieving loss of their innocent angel baby. I feel sorrow for what CW’s older brother has to endure for a lifetime