Elley Mae
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GUILTY In - Halee Rathgeber, 20, Fatally Shot, Warrick County, 24 April 2017 *arrest*
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EmmaRose
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Hi NewMama. I had wondered the same.
Indy Anna
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I know IH had been employed at Texas Roadhouse and he named a couple of other places, but does anyone know if he was currently employed? Apparently, the grace period on his school loans had expired and he was in default:
He wouldn't have to repay the loan in a lump sum, but make monthly payments. If he was having trouble repaying his loans, he could go to a graduated pay scale, where the monthly payment is lowered but increases every year. And, (IIRC) if someone loses their job, they can delay repayment. It's interesting that IH's loan was going into collections.
The $300 he owed his dad (and had 'borrowed' from Halee) would be a normal loan repayment amount. He was still living with his parents, so wasn't paying rent (unless they required him to pay them room and board). So, what did he do with the money he earned while working? And, if he'd lost his job, why not notify the financial institution he borrowed from to work out a repayment plan?
Nothing in this adds up. Why was IH so intent on getting the money to repay his dad? What repercussions did he anticipate if he was unable to repay his dad? Did his dad threaten to evict him? That would be ironic if he had to pay rent because he wasn't able to pay off debts to his parents, friends and a financial institution.
I think it'll be interesting to find out why IH went through so many jobs and especially why he lost his last job. The reason may have been preventing him from finding gainful employment. But, I also know of sociopaths who expect other people to support them. They don't feel responsible for themselves, but blame others for their failings. That would certainly fit in this case--with him demanding money from a friend. Sociopaths know how to gain sympathy from others but they do not feel sympathy themselves; rather, they view other people as tools they manipulate to get whatever they want.
That alone could explain IH's actions. But, it doesn't explain what happened to the money he earned while working. How long had he been unemployed if he wasn't currently employed? I'm still thinking there is a drug debt involved. JMO
<snip> http://www.courierpress.com/story/n...it-rathgeber-slaying-case-released/101334480/
He wouldn't have to repay the loan in a lump sum, but make monthly payments. If he was having trouble repaying his loans, he could go to a graduated pay scale, where the monthly payment is lowered but increases every year. And, (IIRC) if someone loses their job, they can delay repayment. It's interesting that IH's loan was going into collections.
The $300 he owed his dad (and had 'borrowed' from Halee) would be a normal loan repayment amount. He was still living with his parents, so wasn't paying rent (unless they required him to pay them room and board). So, what did he do with the money he earned while working? And, if he'd lost his job, why not notify the financial institution he borrowed from to work out a repayment plan?
Nothing in this adds up. Why was IH so intent on getting the money to repay his dad? What repercussions did he anticipate if he was unable to repay his dad? Did his dad threaten to evict him? That would be ironic if he had to pay rent because he wasn't able to pay off debts to his parents, friends and a financial institution.
I think it'll be interesting to find out why IH went through so many jobs and especially why he lost his last job. The reason may have been preventing him from finding gainful employment. But, I also know of sociopaths who expect other people to support them. They don't feel responsible for themselves, but blame others for their failings. That would certainly fit in this case--with him demanding money from a friend. Sociopaths know how to gain sympathy from others but they do not feel sympathy themselves; rather, they view other people as tools they manipulate to get whatever they want.
That alone could explain IH's actions. But, it doesn't explain what happened to the money he earned while working. How long had he been unemployed if he wasn't currently employed? I'm still thinking there is a drug debt involved. JMO
meanmaryjean
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Much of Indiana is Eastern time but extreme northwest (Gary/ Hammond/ Chicago suburbs) and extreme southwest (Evansville) are on Central time. My daughter goes to USI.
Hagan told Judge Greg Granger, during his hearing, that "he lived with his parents and had worked at Lowe's for several weeks prior to his arrest, before that working at Coca Cola bottling."
www.tennessean.com, May 2, 2017, 3:58 pm, Mark Wilson
Indy Anna
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Thank you, Mercedes! I couldn't remember where I saw it. But, when I opened your link, the article wasn't there. I tried search IH's name, and found no articles there. What's with that, I wonder?
Regarding IH's employment, I wonder how long he'd been employed in each job and if he'd been unemployed for a while between each job. Plus, he's told so many lies, I don't know whether to believe he was currently employed at Lowe's (need confirmation from them), or whether he lived at home/lived with roommates.
I don't know if the conflicting information is due to misreporting, or if this guy really is a sociopath. Sociopaths cannot be trusted to tell the truth. They don't even seem able to distinguish a truth from a lie themselves. MOO
ETA: Another comment I wanted to make about sociopaths is that they don't recognize other people's limitations, e.g., financial limitations. I'm sure Halee didn't have a lot of money to spare since she was a student and probably working just PT. Yet, it sounds like IH expected her to pay off his debts, and then murdered her when she couldn't/ put her foot down.
Whiskers16
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I went through IH's twitter starting 7/6/16 when he tags his "roomie". These are all the tweets that seem to relate directly to employment/money, school, living situation, and Halee when they were an item. Beginning of November looks like maybe he ran out of money and moved in with his parents. JMO.
july 6, 2016 tweet "pray for my roomie @************ ain't nothin wrong with him he just look like Max from A Goofy Movie"
july 21, 2016 tweet "bout to make that rent money in 2 days"
july 29, 2016 tweet "i would have to leave for work right as it starts pouring"
aug 5, 2016 tweet "when you stay still almost midnight but make 140 in 6 hrs"
aug 7, 2016 "why do i always take doubles on Sunday knowing I'm about to be hungover af"
aug 21, 2016 tweet "three straight doubles will make you wanna be an alcoholic so bad"
aug 29, 2016 tweet "i forgot how to write a paper"
sept 16, 2016 retweet Halee "i came home to this today... I'm so so so blessed & happy" (photo of jewelry is captioned "when bae randomly spoils you all the time... HE'S PERFECT!")
sept 26, 2016 tweeting about olive garden the same day Halee is
sep 30, 2016 tweet "i cant remember the last time i was off on a friday night lol im old"
oct 2, 2016 tweet "got the next 2 days off and I'll probably just sleep and eat and maybe go outside once idk"
oct 7, 2016 tweet "a friday night off is a friday night not remembered"
oct 19, 2016 tweet "hate being an adult but love being on my own"
nov 3, 2016 tweet "i would pay someone to do 1/2 the things that i need done but i got like 12 bucks"
nov 8, 2016 tweet "so nice to see my parents happy "
nov 11, 2016 tweet "love my moms but she's gotta stop buying me off brand pop tarts lol"
nov 19, 2016 tweet "parents got their dream home"
dec 14, 2016 tweet "they be askin the dumbest questions in interviews n expect you to sell yourself lol"
jan 11, 2017 tweet "boss has bought my lunch the last 5 days"
jan 30, 2017 tweet "have no clue where to start lookin for a 2nd job"
Alethea
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Awesome job Whiskers and Indy Anna, just catching up. The timing does line up with student loans going into repayment. But unless he took out private loans, it would take a long time for any student loans to go into collection. For Federal loans, the government has many different forbearance programs when you're under/unemployed. Plus, there's so much red tape I think it would take years before they actually tried to collect. Student loans aren't like a mortgage where the loan can be foreclosed and the house taken- there's not much you can do for student loans. "Like getting water from a rock."
I definitely think more nefarious loans - drug, gambling - would be more likely.
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I definitely think more nefarious loans - drug, gambling - would be more likely.
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Indy Anna
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Yes, I thought it was rather soon for his loans to go into collection. I don't think I had to even start repaying mine for 2 years. And, ITA there's not much they can do to collect. Many people default on student loans. Because of that, the gov't/ financial institutions offer forbearance programs and graduated plans just to encourage people to repay their loans.
I also agree that it was more likely a drug debt, or something of that nature, he was trying to pay off. I noticed in his tweets, IH made a few comments about being hungover and alcoholism. I think he did have an alcohol problem, but I don't think alcohol was the only substance he was abusing.
Another thing...Halee posted about jewelry IH had given her and she stated he spoiled her "all the time." I wonder how much money he was spending on her. Did he not start having money problems until later? Did he feel that Halee owed him money because of all the money he'd spent on her earlier?
JMO
Whiskers16
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JMO from reading his tweets, he had several habits that would eat up money quickly- drinking, restaurants, shopping. He makes some comments that imply heavy drinking, blacking out, drinking during the day. Although I do think his comments seem pretty common to me for his age and someone who seems to have a big circle of friends. He makes mention of going to bdubs (buffalo wild wings) 6x in a week. Another tweet said something like going to the mall for every meal. The jewelry and olive garden takeout for Halee. And he posted about wanting to buy multiple pairs of shoes, multiple sports jerseys, going to the mall several days in a row, online shopping.
He made a LOT of posts about how lazy he was being, taking naps or sleeping all day, etc. I honestly got a vibe of depression from it, but maybe he didn't realize it...
DeDee
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Just a little note about reading Tweets....Hope this helps.
When one reads a Tweet, it will show the time zone as the reader of the Tweet.
If a Tweet is sent at 12:30pm in their time zone, for example, the time appears as being in the reader's time zone when it is read. If you live a time zone away, it would read as 1:30pm. Hence, you will deduct one hour to know the actual time of the Tweet. Conversely, it could read as 11:30am, if the reader lives in one TZ east of the original tweet. Therefore, you know to add an hour to determine the actual time the Tweet was sent.
Tweets are shown in the reader's own time zone so knowing what time zone the Tweet originates may be helpful in cases like this one.
When one reads a Tweet, it will show the time zone as the reader of the Tweet.
If a Tweet is sent at 12:30pm in their time zone, for example, the time appears as being in the reader's time zone when it is read. If you live a time zone away, it would read as 1:30pm. Hence, you will deduct one hour to know the actual time of the Tweet. Conversely, it could read as 11:30am, if the reader lives in one TZ east of the original tweet. Therefore, you know to add an hour to determine the actual time the Tweet was sent.
Tweets are shown in the reader's own time zone so knowing what time zone the Tweet originates may be helpful in cases like this one.
carbuff
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That's a good insight about depression. His tweets aren't any different than some of my kids' friends' tweets when you take them one at a time, but somehow they leave a troubling impression when you read them all at once. Clearly something wrong in his head or his heart.
Gardenista
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And a bunch of kids in that group have similar tweets--both male and female. I can't decide what's up with them.
jessarox
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Bringing down your blue text here:
I think his job at Coca Cola was part time. There's no bottling facility here that I know of so his job was likely the part time merchandising position as described here: https://chp.tbe.taleo.net/chp02/ats/careers/requisition.jsp?org=COKECONSOLIDATED&cws=1&rid=16301
It's essentially stocking Coca Cola at grocery stores, big box stores, etc and setting up special displays. I had a friend do a similar job for Pepsi a few years back. It's hard work - lots of bending, stooping, lifting, etc. My friend had to give it up because of an injury. I bet IH thought it would be a cake job and then realized it was much tougher than he expected.
"IH's public defender requested to be released from the case. Attorney Jonathan Young filed a motion, saying he is not certified for the "death penalty" or "life without parole cases" in the state of Indiana."
http://www.14news.com/story/3538724...le-for-hagan-public-defender-forced-from-case
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http://www.14news.com/story/3538724...le-for-hagan-public-defender-forced-from-case
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Tippy Lynn
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Thanks Rosieone. I'm glad he filed the motion now instead of a few months into it. Having an unqualified or uncertified public defender is grounds for a mistrial and we don't want that.
Learned something here, I didn't know a lawyer had to be certified to defend a death penalty case in certain states. In our state, judges usually just appoint a real experienced lawyer, maybe someone who has done murder cases before, but not certified. And, occasionally a judge may appoint a team, depending on the case. Then after all that, most defendants plead. IMO
In the meantime here, I researched this issue and there are many states that require experienced lawyers with x number of trials, etc.
jessarox
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I wonder if IH dropped too many classes in his final semester at KWC and found out that hard way that Pell grants have to be repaid if you drop too many classes and drop below full time (source). This can be up to the amount equal to the cost of the classes dropped. So at KWC if he dropped 2 classes, this would be ~$3000 since their tuition is approximately $500 per credit hour if you're a full time student. Now that doesn't take into consideration other scholarships, loans, or other forms of financial aid, it could have been a lot cheaper. But on the other hand, he could have dropped more classes too.
Speaking from experience, if you don't pay back the grant, the school holds your transcript until you do which means kiss transferring goodbye. They won't release the official transcript for ANY reason until you pay the grant back, even if you need it for a job.
Speaking from experience, if you don't pay back the grant, the school holds your transcript until you do which means kiss transferring goodbye. They won't release the official transcript for ANY reason until you pay the grant back, even if you need it for a job.