IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #12

[Ven]

And should I take from that, that LE isn't thinking along the lines of a random abduction? Cause that's what I'm thinking now.

If LE thought this was a random abduction, they would be warning the public to keep an eye out for things, keep an eye out for safety purposes, etc.

 

[Darcyline]

And should I take from that, that LE isn't thinking along the lines of a random abduction? Cause that's what I'm thinking now.

At least at this moment, I think LE is keeping themselves open to various ideas. Like, the truck example at the same time as still interviewing the POIs. Outside of LE, I feel like most people are treating it as an accident or something bad happened between her and some combination of the people she was last with. Even her parents, to me, are not acting like I have seen parents act when they believe their child may have been abducted and might be in a basement somewhere. They act like parents who think their child is gone. Their statements feel like they are one step away from actually naming names sometimes.
That is purely my impression watching their body language and words-if that is too much speculation I can delete!

 

[Darcyline]

I have a question. Ok, so in the timeline she loses her shoes at Kilroys and then goes back to her apartment with CR, but never gets shoes. So, are we to believe that she walks from Kilroys, back to CR's apartment, into JR's apartment, and then he allows her to leave still shoeless?

 

[northsider]

DANG! This just occurred to me too ....

Do we know if JW went and picked up the phone??? Or did LE go to Kilroy's and pick it up???

If you text your g/f and you get a response telling you she left her phone at Kilroy's, wouldn't your first move be to go get her phone?
Why would you assume she's in trouble????

Wouldn't a normal person's reaction be to get their g/f's phone and give it back to her next time you see her (like later that day?)???

I'm not sure if he picked up her phone or if LE did so. But from some of the media accounts, his next move after that was to go to the class that HT was in and get her apartment key to check to see if LS was there. Which does seem odd now that I think about it, for the reasons mentioned above --- if you think your girlfriend shacked up with a guy the night before, your first thought wouldn't be that she was missing --- and certainly not to the point where you'd go to her roommate's class to get her key.

 

[jjenny]

At least at this moment, I think LE is keeping themselves open to various ideas. Like, the truck example at the same time as still interviewing the POIs. Outside of LE, I feel like most people are treating it as an accident or something bad happened between her and some combination of the people she was last with. Even her parents, to me, are not acting like I have seen parents act when they believe their child may have been abducted and might be in a basement somewhere. They act like parents who think their child is gone. Their statements feel like they are one step away from actually naming names sometimes.
That is purely my impression watching their body language and words-if that is too much speculation I can delete!

I agree that I don't get the feeling her parents think this is a random abduction. Pleading with her friends to do the right thing and report what they know-if it was a random abduction, likely her friends would not know anything of value.

 

[northsider]

I have a question. Ok, so in the timeline she loses her shoes at Kilroys and then goes back to her apartment with CR, but never gets shoes. So, are we to believe that she walks from Kilroys, back to CR's apartment, into JR's apartment, and then he allows her to leave still shoeless?

According to LE, she never went back to her apartment at Smallwood.

I understand where you're coming from, but I see enough students walking around without shoes in B-town that I don't think much of it. It does seem odd that she wouldn't have gotten shoes if she was planning on leaving again, I agree.

 

[VeryVeritas]

I guess we now know who the 3rd person that Salzman referred to in the statement that 3 other people could corroborate seeing LS AFTRR he was in bed.. We know MB and JR were always 2 of the 3.. And now I take it that number 3 is JR's hometown buddy that was staying with him that night...

Wonder if he was asked to submit DNA as well and if so dis he comply??

So very many more questions than answers. And every new detail that we learn really only poses 10+ more questions than giving us any answers..

At first analysis makes it seem like there are more and more questions... but eventually this leads to answers which fills in a picture (or alternate pictures) and at some point these answers (facts, etc... ) collapse the questions around the theories ruling them in or out.

In my view, I see zero evidence that LS ever left JR's or the gravel lot for that matter. JR admits to being the last to seeing LS alive and that makes him a suspect to me! I see nothing to back up his statement that LS left at 4:15 to 4:30 and walked down 11th and then N. College.
I think it's a lie. And if it is a Lie, then what did happen? That one statement of his is what makes stranger abduction possible. If that one statement is a lie, then there is no stranger involved.

There is a dead end here and the dead end is at JR's

My understanding too is that while people keep talking about "East Coaster's etc.." is that JR is from Michigan, is this correct or not? What is this hometown of his?

 

[Barry]

I am open to the possibility of a stranger abduction. However, the apparent smokescreen among the friends that LE seems to not be able to get through, keeps me leaning towards someone she knew. IMO, if it is a stranger abduction, it's certainly not helping that LE has to wade through all this other stuff.

 

[Long-time Local]

And should I take from that, that LE isn't thinking along the lines of a random abduction? Cause that's what I'm thinking now.

They really aren't giving an indication one way or the other (honestly). There have been women go missing from Bloomington before and we certainly don't hear any different message than what they're giving us now. In the case of Jill Behrman, it really was a random abduction, and Crystal Grubb... well, most of us never heard a word about it (and her killer(s) is still at large). There will be a slight bump in women taking self-defense courses and frantic parents at orientation buying up all the pepper spray in town and then everyone will forget about it. We took a late night drive last night and there were young women walking alone all over the place near where LS disappeared and into darker, sketchier areas. There certainly isn't an evident mood of fear, but I truly don't think that has any reflection on who LE think is responsible.

 

[Darcyline]

According to LE, she never went back to her apartment at Smallwood.

I understand where you're coming from, but I see enough students walking around without shoes in B-town that I don't think much of it. It does seem odd that she wouldn't have gotten shoes if she was planning on leaving again, I agree.

Didn't she go back to the complex though for a few minutes after she lost her shoes? Just not her actual unit?

It just seems like a long time to be shoeless and for a lot of people to see she doesn't have shoes and not do anything about it. Could mean absolutely nothing though.

 

[Barry]

At first analysis makes it seem like there are more and more questions... but eventually this leads to answers which fills in a picture (or alternate pictures) and at some point these answers (facts, etc... ) collapse the questions around the theories ruling them in or out.

In my view, I see zero evidence that LS ever left JR's or the gravel lot for that matter. JR admits to being the last to seeing LS alive and that makes him a suspect to me! I see nothing to back up his statement that LS left at 4:15 to 4:30 and walked down 11th and then N. College.
I think it's a lie. And if it is a Lie, then what did happen? That one statement of his is what makes stranger abduction possible. If that one statement is a lie, then there is no stranger involved.

There is a dead end here and the dead end is at JR's

My understanding too is that while people keep talking about "East Coaster's etc.." is that JR is from Michigan, is this correct or not? What is this hometown of his?

I agree, JR is whom it all seems to swirl around, at the moment.

 

[VeryVeritas]

Doesn't waffle house have cameras?

I think btown said they did, and surely LE is aware of that.

 

[mamamia54]

One more thought and I haven't seen anyone speak of it yet, either that or I've missed it. In the photo of Lauren walking inside Smallwood before she goes out for the evening, she is carrying what looks like possibly a hoodie or jacket, and if you look at the picture to her feet, those aren't just flip flops.

 

[Ven]

I'm not sure if he picked up her phone or if LE did so. But from some of the media accounts, his next move after that was to go to the class that HT was in and get her apartment key to check to see if LS was there. Which does seem odd now that I think about it, for the reasons mentioned above --- if you think your girlfriend shacked up with a guy the night before, your first thought wouldn't be that she was missing --- and certainly not to the point where you'd go to her roommate's class to get her key.

Yeah, the boyfriend's actions on June 3 don't add up for me at all.

I want to make two possible assumptions:
1. LS and JW were still in a relationship, but she went with CR anyway
2. LS and JW recently broke up, but he was still after her

Under scenario one, if you're JW, you are worried LS is cheating on you with this guy. If you're going to confront her, why would you wait until the next day? And if you did try and confront her the next day, why would you assume she's missing? Wouldn't you just assume she's still off with the other guy?

Under scenario 2, again, she's spent the night with another guy. You aren't her b/f anymore, or at least not now if it's an on/off type of thing. Why would you be stalking her down the next day, when it's none of your business?

Finally, there always seem to be the detractors in these threads who profess that JW and LS were in a perfect relationship with each other and there was nothing eventful about her going off with CR that night.

So let's say you are JW and you are NOT worried about LS from the previous night.
You text her the next day and you get a reply that the phone is at the bar, come get it.

I'll assume that the phone was his way of getting in touch with her.
He could either:
a) wait until she goes back and gets her own phone and texts him
b) go get the phone and take it to her

Why would you start panicking and go off to the roommate and ask her to let you in the room???

 

[Blythe]

I don't know if JW's actions are necessarily suspicious but I would like to know his conversation with Mr. S. We know Mr. S called Mrs. at her relatives and said, according to the presser, "It's Lauren, she's missing".

 

[VeryVeritas]

I don't know. Let's say they do, should we place that much confidence in cameras to pick up on all activity in a particular vicinity. Cameras differ in range and field of view. Motion activated cameras have different sensitivity levels. I don't think we should rule anything out strictly based on the presence of surveillance cameras. JMO.

People coming and going to WH would be on camera. This would lead to a list of people that could be checked for their stories about what they saw. "sketchy" is a meaningless term with respect to describing someone capable of abuduction. Abductors can look like anyone. LE should check everyone that was in the WH in the preceeding hours and maybe even the hours following 4:15. On that list would be a certain amount of "regulars" and I'm sure they would have been talking already about that night and still do. I'm sure it's a short list... and LE may have exhausted it by now. I agree though, it's very unlikely that LS would not have been seen.... and so from the combination of all of the ways she could have been seen a random abduction appears extremely unlikely to me.

 

[cluciano63]

Not to harp on this particular case but in Katie Sepich case, which was like this one in many ways, her friend and/or roommate called Katie's mother by 2pm the day after the party where she was last seen and soon, thereafter, the police. So the time factor alone doesn't freak me out, if they had already checked around at all of the various lodgins where Lauren could have ended up.

 

[northsider]

At first analysis makes it seem like there are more and more questions... but eventually this leads to answers which fills in a picture (or alternate pictures) and at some point these answers (facts, etc... ) collapse the questions around the theories ruling them in or out.

In my view, I see zero evidence that LS ever left JR's or the gravel lot for that matter. JR admits to being the last to seeing LS alive and that makes him a suspect to me! I see nothing to back up his statement that LS left at 4:15 to 4:30 and walked down 11th and then N. College.
I think it's a lie. And if it is a Lie, then what did happen? That one statement of his is what makes stranger abduction possible. If that one statement is a lie, then there is no stranger involved.

There is a dead end here and the dead end is at JR's

My understanding too is that while people keep talking about "East Coaster's etc.." is that JR is from Michigan, is this correct or not? What is this hometown of his?

Honestly, the dead end is earlier than JR's --- it's 2:52 am, when she and (supposedly) CR left the viewing space of the alley camera. I just drove by that alley about an hour ago to take another look...it's a really short distance from there to the back of 5 North.

I agree with you, though - the JR statements are really the only thing that people are pinning the stranger abduction on. If you take those statements out of the mix, all we're left with is MB saying that she left his apartment around 3:10. Even that seems a bit odd, because it is at most a 2-minute walk from the exit of the alley behind 10th and College Village to the front of 5 North. So if LS and CR got there at 2:53 am, then it took her 17 minutes to leave. Which would seem to leave some minutes unaccounted for in MB's explanation of events.

As someone who's lived here for a while as both a student and as a professional, and as someone who has walked those same streets at the same time of evening, I am 99% positive that there's no chance it was a stranger abduction. It's simply not that type of area, despite what some people have claimed. College Avenue is a one-way street running south, and 11th street is the crest of a large (for Bloomington) hill. No one is going to be parked or idling in that area --- not with 3-4 cop cars in the Waffle House parking lot a block away at that time of night (which there almost always are). No one is going to idle or park on 11th street, either --- half the street is closed due to construction, and there's no parking spots on the other side of the street (which are right in front of 5 North and the yellow house).

 

[jjenny]

Not to harp on this particular case but in Katie Sepich case, which was like this one in many ways, her friend and/or roommate called Katie's mother by 2pm the day after the party where she was last seen and soon, thereafter, the police. So the time factor alone doesn't freak me out, if they had already checked around at all of the various lodgins where Lauren could have ended up.

I don't think anything suspicious in it either. Add to this, if the boyfriend (or her two friends, depending on which version of the story is correct) didn't report her missing, then people would be suspicious as to why he wasn't concerned that she was missing.

 

[epiphany]

I don't believe that to be correct. Do you have a link? If I recall this correctly, Captain Q didn't say that boyfriend reported her missing.

Qualters also revealed that it was Spierer's longtime boyfriend who reported her disappearance to the police on the afternoon of June 3.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/lauren-spierer-update-mothers-plea-press-conferences/story?id=13824266

It was hours later, when bar employees saw that Wolff had texted her phone, that they called him to report they had it. He retrieved it, checked her apartment, then reported her missing and called her parents to share the disturbing news.

http://www.lohud.com/article/201106...riends-school-reflect-missing-college-student