Jupiter812
New Member
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2011
- Messages
- 1,744
- Reaction score
- -15
I agree. I hope it's enough to locate her.
Edited to add: Faculty and academic staff are back too, if you have the occasion to strike up a convo with them.
IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #22
- Thread starter SheWhoMustNotBeNamed
- Start date
- Status
Edited to add: Faculty and academic staff are back too, if you have the occasion to strike up a convo with them.
The reporters on this case have been using this word "party" continually in referring to LS's activities of the night, without any implication that she was necessarily using illegal drugs. Journalists do choose their words carefully. They would not want to be accused of smearing someone's reputation without evidence. The meaning taken must be the dictionary meaning unless specific context determines otherwise.
"To party" is not any special generation slang; it goes back to at least the 1970s.
A long time ago two friends of mine, let’s call them Mutt and Jeff, decided to take LSD together. Jeff "flipped out" and took all of his clothes off in public and was arrested and then hospitalized. Mutt had no "problems" and did not attract attention.
The incident caused a lot of embarrassment and family problems for Jeff. His father was some kind of Judge and a prominent member of the community. Apparently this was some sort of "last straw" for Jeff. A week later, Jeff committed suicide.
Eventually Mutt was arrested and charged with manslaughter. On the advice of his attorney he plead guilty to "Furnishing a controlled substance" Otherwise he was at risk of a jury giving him a 20 year sentence (from what I understood, they bought the drugs from a street dealer in a nearby town). The police questioned all of their friends; threatening everyone with long prison sentences if they didn't talk. I was hundreds of miles away at college or I would have been caught up in the mess.
The obvious lesson I learned is that when it comes to drugs, if someone dies, there is going to be a demand that "somebody pay for this". Realistically, if there is a "drug related" death, anyone who was with that person in the hours (or even days) before the death could be subject to prosecution.
We don't know what happened to LS but there is a good chance she did die late that night and whoever she was with hid her body to avoid prosecution. Everyone else "involved" with her that night is probably "adjusting" their recollection of events that night to cover for themselves and anyone else they fear might be subject to prosecution.
Considering the above, I suspect MB's claim that LS wanted to "party" (while poor MB had to study) to be an obvious effort to claim that whatever "misadventure LS encountered that night occured after she left MB's apt. This doesn't mean it is false; its just that it is self-serving to MB.
The incident caused a lot of embarrassment and family problems for Jeff. His father was some kind of Judge and a prominent member of the community. Apparently this was some sort of "last straw" for Jeff. A week later, Jeff committed suicide.
Eventually Mutt was arrested and charged with manslaughter. On the advice of his attorney he plead guilty to "Furnishing a controlled substance" Otherwise he was at risk of a jury giving him a 20 year sentence (from what I understood, they bought the drugs from a street dealer in a nearby town). The police questioned all of their friends; threatening everyone with long prison sentences if they didn't talk. I was hundreds of miles away at college or I would have been caught up in the mess.
The obvious lesson I learned is that when it comes to drugs, if someone dies, there is going to be a demand that "somebody pay for this". Realistically, if there is a "drug related" death, anyone who was with that person in the hours (or even days) before the death could be subject to prosecution.
We don't know what happened to LS but there is a good chance she did die late that night and whoever she was with hid her body to avoid prosecution. Everyone else "involved" with her that night is probably "adjusting" their recollection of events that night to cover for themselves and anyone else they fear might be subject to prosecution.
Considering the above, I suspect MB's claim that LS wanted to "party" (while poor MB had to study) to be an obvious effort to claim that whatever "misadventure LS encountered that night occured after she left MB's apt. This doesn't mean it is false; its just that it is self-serving to MB.
I respectfully disagree. I am the same age as LS and I atten a different Big 10 school. Students here either sleep around or are in a serious relationship. There is really no "dating" going on, most people meet someone they're attracted to and either sleep with them right away, and become "friends with benefits", have a one night stand, or become exclusive with one another. No one really goes out on "dates".
How do they get into the relationship if they do not accompany each other on social occasions or at social events (= "dating")?
How can someone have an exclusive relationship with someone but never attend a social event or participate in a social activity with them?
The young college grads (less than 25 yo) where I work talk about "dates," as in "He asked me out on a date." Or "I don't know if I want to go out on a date with him."
Of course, once they start actually working, they may become more conservative; but they seem to prefer the formality. It's not Doonesbury any more.
Well I am 20 and one at my school talks about being asked out on a date or anything. They become exclusive mostly from hanging out in a group together, and sleeping together at the end of the night, or by hooking up first and choosing to continue and then at some point having a discussion of whether they want to be boyfriend and girlfriend or just friends with benefits.
IndyMom
Member
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2011
- Messages
- 48
- Reaction score
- 0
In regards to the dating talk, I think it's different for everyone. I was in college when I met my husband (5 years ago) and he asked me on an official date. However, some couples simply meet, maybe through mutual friends or while partying...spend time together (not formal dates) and decide they'll become an official couple. The sleeping together can fall anywhere in that process.
Do you mean for example going to college event or a concert with a group of friends? Once they make a point of the fact that they are together, you may as well call it a "date."
The word "hooking up" has a negative connotation. Hookers are prostitutes. The term expresses disapprobation.
"Friends with benefits" is somewhat sarcastic; as though the relationship were some type of mutual funds investment vehicle which the prospect could not immediately afford, and therefore the salesperson constructed a special plan for him. Again, the words themselves express disapproval.
But if they do meet to discuss their relationship that meeting too may as well be called a "date."
cluciano63
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2010
- Messages
- 41,198
- Reaction score
- 27,312
I was just watching a Dateline case where a father lied on the stand about something his son had said to him (which he had told police previously) when the son was eventually tried for murder of a female friend...so there are parents out there, for sure, who will do anything to cover up for their children.
Thank you for sharing this story. If both Mutt and Jeff purchased the drugs from a dealer, why was Mutt considered guilty of "furnishing" the drugs? Seems to me that in truth, he was only guilty of possession, unless he incited Jeff to use the drugs. Incitement is almost impossible to prove, though.
Or is it just that the laws in this regard are so poorly written? While we obviously must work toward ending drug abuse in our society, the so-called "war on drugs" seems to have failed. We need some other approach.
Darcyline
New Member
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2010
- Messages
- 1,300
- Reaction score
- 8
I think reporters definitely ARE using "party" to mean drinking and drugs were involved. At least, that is the usages I have seen. The focus has definitely been on them being intoxicated, the possibilities of illegal drugs, Lauren being so unconscious she couldn't walk...I haven't really seen party used by reporters to mean "she was being social and talking to people!"
Thanks for the discussion of IQ-I do agree, but I just thought it was strange how many people I have seen make comments about their IQs and not just because of circumstances. I was wondering if we did have any information about their GPAs or whatever which would back up them being actually stupid instead of just acting stupid or stupid because of circumstances.
Thanks for the discussion of IQ-I do agree, but I just thought it was strange how many people I have seen make comments about their IQs and not just because of circumstances. I was wondering if we did have any information about their GPAs or whatever which would back up them being actually stupid instead of just acting stupid or stupid because of circumstances.
That's assuming they actually return to the university.
Yes, she did have a heart condition. Which means if she were to take some sort of substance, it might have not killed a person without a heart condition but could have killed her. There is a long list of legal and illegal drugs people with long qt syndrome should be avoiding. Person with long qt sydrom should be extra careful.
This particular case was a "plea bargain situation". Mutt took the offer because he could avoid prison time even though it involved a felony conviction. He was afraid the DA would have a parade of their friends come forward claiming Mutt did "incite" Jeff to do drugs. The real problem was the "manslaughter" statute which amounts to "imprudent action resulting in death". Some situations (like drunk driving) seem pretty clear cut but others can be pretty vague. It is a chance to punish "somebody" when a tragedy occurs.
I think these kids in Bloomington were fairly sophisticated and had access to better legal advice than the kids in my home town. I'm sure that everyone there has a pretty good idea that something bad happened to LS that night and anyone who furnished or did drugs with her and anyone who saw that she was severely inebriated and yet allowed her to go out on her own (or with someone else equally inebriated) could find themselves in legal trouble.
PlainJaneDoe
Verified expert in neuroscience
- Joined
- Jun 3, 2011
- Messages
- 5,130
- Reaction score
- 29
The Anthonys, eg?:innocent: ok, JMO, and o/t besides. No disrespect entitled to anyone else's opinion about this...but one of my pet peeves is when a parent puts his or her own child above the law.
Walker- I mean this very respectfully but I believe you're a bit out of touch with this generation. The word "party" absolutely is generational, just like the word "gay" and many other words like "bad", "cool", "chill", "sick", etc. Meanings change. "Hook up" and "friends with benefits"....yeah, they seem negative but it is what it is. I'm in my 40s and I don't like it anymore than you, but the way someone up thread described college life and relationships is pretty much my view as well. I have worked with this age group and sorry but yes, I still call them kids, and some of my own kids are in college now. You mentioned something about how in a different generation they'd be married with children. That's true. My Grandma was married at 16. However, that's not life today. In those times, they didn't have Mommy and Daddy paying their bills and sending them off to Big 10 schools, all expense paid, paying for overseas trips, big expensive Spring Break excursions, and shipping their car to campus. I'm not saying that ALL of these POI's have each of those benefits but the fact is, many "kids" of this age do. They do NOT have adult responsibilities. Many are sent off to school with credit cards (for which Daddy gets the bill). Many don't even have Daddy sending them rent $ - Daddy just pays the landlord directly. They don't have to worry about the things that most adults do. I'm not knocking them; most do grow up and "get it". I'm just saying at this age today, they're a FAR CRY from the generations that were getting married young. IMO adulthood doesn't come with a given age. Sure, legally it does, but I find it personally to be something that's warranted by maturity and responsibility.
When it comes to "dating"....it really doesn't happen. A bunch of kids go to a party and usually that happens in groups. A boy/girl see each other, get to know each other, and sadly - they often have sex that first night. They may never see each other again, or they may see each other accidentally at another party and "hook up" (sex) again, or they may start texting (likely no calling), friending on facebook, and develop a relationship. Relationships usually involve hanging out (chilling) at each other's dorm/apartment, going to parties together (or meeting up there) or going to the bar. Often this is in a group and not really "dates". When I was this age, a boy would call me and ask me on an official date. It's SO different. My son had a girlfriend of about a year and they probably went on 3 dates that entire time. Usually, they hung out at our house and watched movies or did things in groups. The days of going out to a movie are really over b/c they have netflix, etc.
The "hooking up" thing is VERY common. It surprises me how many partners many of these kids have had by the time they're married. When I was in college in the 80s there was the start of the AIDS awareness and STDs. Multiple partners was a scary thought. That whole fear seems to have subsided b/c when talking with these kids, many can't even tell me how many partners they've had b/c they don't know.
As for the word "party", it's pretty much common knowledge among anyone who is either that age, has a child that age, or works with those that age, that "partying" involves drugs. One may say, "I'm going to a party" to mean a social gathering. Used in this context, it can mean something benign. However, if one says, "Do you like to party?", "I wanna party", "She's a partier", it's very understood that they're referring to drugs by those within this generation.
When it comes to "dating"....it really doesn't happen. A bunch of kids go to a party and usually that happens in groups. A boy/girl see each other, get to know each other, and sadly - they often have sex that first night. They may never see each other again, or they may see each other accidentally at another party and "hook up" (sex) again, or they may start texting (likely no calling), friending on facebook, and develop a relationship. Relationships usually involve hanging out (chilling) at each other's dorm/apartment, going to parties together (or meeting up there) or going to the bar. Often this is in a group and not really "dates". When I was this age, a boy would call me and ask me on an official date. It's SO different. My son had a girlfriend of about a year and they probably went on 3 dates that entire time. Usually, they hung out at our house and watched movies or did things in groups. The days of going out to a movie are really over b/c they have netflix, etc.
The "hooking up" thing is VERY common. It surprises me how many partners many of these kids have had by the time they're married. When I was in college in the 80s there was the start of the AIDS awareness and STDs. Multiple partners was a scary thought. That whole fear seems to have subsided b/c when talking with these kids, many can't even tell me how many partners they've had b/c they don't know.
As for the word "party", it's pretty much common knowledge among anyone who is either that age, has a child that age, or works with those that age, that "partying" involves drugs. One may say, "I'm going to a party" to mean a social gathering. Used in this context, it can mean something benign. However, if one says, "Do you like to party?", "I wanna party", "She's a partier", it's very understood that they're referring to drugs by those within this generation.
There were several articles and newscasts about LS's parents returning to Bloomington. Here are excerpts from two of them:
[Aug 28] With new posters in hand, volunteers and students hit the pavement to make sure LS's picture can't be missed. "Students hear things. They know things. We're hoping that by getting the message out that LS is still missing, someone will come forward, give us a piece of information, something they heard. We desperately need it," said LS's dad.
LS's parents vow to remain in Bloomington until they find her. After a trip home to New York, they barely escaped Hurricane Irene to make it back. Their flight was among the last to depart before officials closed the airport.
http://www.wthr.com/story/15348433/search-for-missing-student-intensifies-as-classes-resume
[Aug 28] LS’s parents shared tearful hugs with LS’s roommate, a small group of her friends and twice that many strangers, who all gathered on College Avenue Sunday morning to hang fresh posters across Bloomington and the IU campus.
LS’s mother said Sunday that every event counts, no matter the turnout. She and her husband plan to stay in Bloomington for “as long as it takes,” she said. LS’s parents flew home to New York last week for their oldest daughter’s 25th birthday.
LS’s roommate and childhood best friend, BW, scooped LS's mother from the sidewalk Sunday morning in tears. BW has known the Spierer family since she was nine. She left Bloomington after her final exams May 3, spent the summer at home in New Jersey, and came back for the first time last week, she said. She swooped in Sunday to hang her first stack of posters, assuring a small crowd of news cameras and newspaper reporters that “the truth will come out... I’m 100 percent sure someone knows something.”
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/08/28/news.qp-8250142.sto
[Aug 28] With new posters in hand, volunteers and students hit the pavement to make sure LS's picture can't be missed. "Students hear things. They know things. We're hoping that by getting the message out that LS is still missing, someone will come forward, give us a piece of information, something they heard. We desperately need it," said LS's dad.
LS's parents vow to remain in Bloomington until they find her. After a trip home to New York, they barely escaped Hurricane Irene to make it back. Their flight was among the last to depart before officials closed the airport.
http://www.wthr.com/story/15348433/search-for-missing-student-intensifies-as-classes-resume
[Aug 28] LS’s parents shared tearful hugs with LS’s roommate, a small group of her friends and twice that many strangers, who all gathered on College Avenue Sunday morning to hang fresh posters across Bloomington and the IU campus.
LS’s mother said Sunday that every event counts, no matter the turnout. She and her husband plan to stay in Bloomington for “as long as it takes,” she said. LS’s parents flew home to New York last week for their oldest daughter’s 25th birthday.
LS’s roommate and childhood best friend, BW, scooped LS's mother from the sidewalk Sunday morning in tears. BW has known the Spierer family since she was nine. She left Bloomington after her final exams May 3, spent the summer at home in New Jersey, and came back for the first time last week, she said. She swooped in Sunday to hang her first stack of posters, assuring a small crowd of news cameras and newspaper reporters that “the truth will come out... I’m 100 percent sure someone knows something.”
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/08/28/news.qp-8250142.sto
- Status